# Donating Blood when on a Pump



## helli (Jun 14, 2021)

As the rules have changed for gay people to give blood, I have gone back to wondering why people treated with insulin are not able to give blood.
All the information I can find suggests that there is concern about "insulin levels" for the donor.
I can kind of think of an explanation of this for those on MDI where the amount of slow acting insulin could be affected when blood is taken.
However, for those of us with insulin pumps only using fast acting insulin which we are able to adjust easily, I wonder whether the blanket ban is valid or whether the Blood Bank has not caught up with recent diabetes treatments.

Or whether I have completely misunderstood the reasons why we cannot donate blood, especially as I have donated blood for diabetes research.

As much as I would like to donate blood, I am mostly curious to understand what would happen if I did. 
Does anyone know more than "concern for insulin levels"or what this even means?


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## SB2015 (Jun 14, 2021)

I was also told that it was to do with the donor’s safety. I would also be interested to know the impact on those of us using pumps.


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## Inka (Jun 14, 2021)

I was told it was because of the still unknown cause of Type 1 and the concern - however remote - that we might pass on a virus or the like that could, in theory, affect the person receiving our blood.


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## helli (Jun 14, 2021)

Inka said:


> I was told it was because of the still unknown cause of Type 1 and the concern - however remote - that we might pass on a virus or the like that could, in theory, affect the person receiving our blood.


Interestingly, the ban is on anyone treating their diabetes with insulin - type 1 and 2.
But good theory.


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## Sally71 (Jun 14, 2021)

Oh don’t get me started on the rules why you can’t give blood!  Something I’ve always wanted to do, went a couple of times when I was younger but something went wrong both times, wanted to try again a few years later but was a bit nervous going on my own so arranged to meet a colleague and go together, but she forgot about me and went on her own... Finally plucked up the courage to try again when my daughter was 2, only to be told that because I had to have a transfusion after she was born, I’m now banned for life from ever donating.  They say because they can’t test for CJD, well you can’t test for it in anyone else either then!  And I had my transfusion in a UK hospital, not some third world country, if that blood was good enough to give me why isn’t it good enough to give anyone else...
And then the next week it will be all over the papers how desperate they are for new donors.  Really?!


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## rebrascora (Jun 14, 2021)

I didn't know that I am no longer permitted to give blood. I haven't been for a few years due to a variety of reason but I was a very regular donor and cannot remember ever reading anything in the information leaflet about it...... just the usual stuff about "sex and drugs and rock and roll". I used to read all that info and think would you ever know half of this stuff anyway.... How many men would tell a female partner if they had had sex with a man or with a prostitute.... even in a very stable relationship you can never be 100% sure of someone. 

I would have thought that since insulin is a natural hormone which the body produces, it wouldn't need to be declared. In the same way as I probably wouldn't think to mention I am on HRT but it makes sense I suppose. Doesn't the basal insulin sit in the tissue at the injection site and slowly release rather than hitting the blood stream straight away, in which case the small amount in a portion of the blood stream at any one time would hardly be enough to cause problems you would think although might have more implications for the diabetic donor losing that bit. I guess if you have a Type 2 on very high doses of basal then it may have more of an impact both on donor and recipient...... I really just hadn't given it any thought until now! It certainly makes sense that people on a pump should be able to donate if the basal insulin is the problem, but maybe no-one has thought to review the policy. I guess if someone had gone to a donor session an hour or so after a meal then the bolus insulin might also be an issue. Would it degrade in the blood in storage or remain active with no carbs to work on or potentially gobble up all the glucose in that sample whilst in storage.... It's an interesting topic to ponder. Feel stupid for not even considering it now.


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## helli (Jun 14, 2021)

rebrascora said:


> Doesn't the basal insulin sit in the tissue at the injection site and slowly release rather than hitting the blood stream straight away, in which case the small amount in a portion of the blood stream at any one time would hardly be enough to cause problems you would think although might have more implications for the diabetic donor losing that bit.


The reason I asked about blood donation for pumpers is that we do not use long lasting insulin so we don't have this problem,
And the reasons given about insulin-injectors not being able to give blood is the risk to the donors not the recipients.


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## Inka (Jun 14, 2021)

helli said:


> Interestingly, the ban is on anyone treating their diabetes with insulin - type 1 and 2.
> But good theory.



No doubt because of misdiagnoses and simplicity. I’m too slim to give blood anyway, but I did feel ‘tainted’ somehow when I found out I couldn’t. It felt like another singling out. I don’t really mind now, but I can see why you’re curious about pump users.


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## rebrascora (Jun 14, 2021)

@helli 
Yes I had followed your logic for people on a pump donating. 
You would think that the loss of a bit of insulin for those on MDI would only cause a minor rise in BG so hardly a huge risk to the donor once or twice a year and a great way to drop your HbA1c a couple of points or so before your next review!  .... not that I would dream of trying to cheat on my HbA1c results .
I could understand it if it was likely to drop your BG as that would be potentially risky, especially as most people drive to the donation sessions, but I can't think that it would have that effect. 

At least I can stop feeling guilty for not having been for the last few years and I am proud that I got my 50 pints award before I got diagnosed. I would have been chewed off if my tally had been stopped short on 49 instead of my 51.


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## Leadinglights (Jun 14, 2021)

In some cases the blood from donations from certain people can't be used for whole blood donation to a recipient it can be fractionated and the various components used. I also used to donate regularly but stopped for some reason, had been to Africa I think but then I was too old but I definitely did over 50.


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## trophywench (Jun 14, 2021)

LOL - I gave blood again when they changed over to IFCC units for HbA1c measurements - the Wolfson Unit at B'ham Uni were charged with doing the Quality Control for the measuring equipment at hundreds, if not thousands, of labs worldwide.  So they advertised for localish PWD to give blood and I volunteered and did so about 4 times at the Donor Centre in the centre of Brum - hadn't been near such a place since 1972 and had to pack up donating - so anyway when the powers that be in the transfusion service found out about the insulin dependent ones - they stopped it PDQ.  The reason we were given was that nobody knows how quickly or slowly us lot replace our blood cells - is it the same as a non-D when the D is well controlled, or not?  If not why not, what if not properly controlled? nobody knows .... so best not take the risk!  (Don't want to be sued, do we, sounds to me....) 

Don't shoot the messenger.


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## nonethewiser (Jun 14, 2021)

Would like to give blood, very annoying we can't. 

Still can be organ donors, registered & got card in wallet, no good to me when gone so someone else should benefit from them.


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## everydayupsanddowns (Jun 14, 2021)

Inka said:


> No doubt because of misdiagnoses and simplicity. I’m too slim to give blood anyway, but I did feel ‘tainted’ somehow when I found out I couldn’t. It felt like another singling out. I don’t really mind now, but I can see why you’re curious about pump users.



I completely understand that feeling. When I was first diagnosed it was an introduction to a whole new world. I was almost never ill as a child, never broke a bone, very rarely visited a Dr. Then suddenly I was in and out of hospitals and seeing all this effort, all this expertise, all this care and ‘need’.

I really wanted to contribute and give something back… but was told it was not allowed.


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## trophywench (Jun 15, 2021)

Yep Mike - and when my mother said, Oooh, those are symptoms of diabetes ... this daughter told her not to overdramatise things so much, for goodness sake!  I daresay I should have apologised the following Tuesday once I'd seen the GP but admit I never did, and neither did she ever say I told you so didn't I ! - so I never thanked her for not saying that either.  I never even thought about either of those things until it was too late.

And now I've just read about this Doctor (works at Good Hope Hospital in Sutton Coldfield - name has always made me laugh, well yeah, obviously, we always have good hope when going into any hospital anywhere, for anything, don't we, surely!) but anyway he says he's offended by people referring to vaccinations as 'jabs' because he finds it demeaning towards vaccines so we shouldn't apply the term to them.  Er, so who elected you as spokesman for anything you can be vaccinated against catching?  Did Covid 19, all other SARS viruses, TB, smallpox, polio, tetanus, diptheria etc have a summit in Skeggy whilst the G7 took place in Cornwall to elect you, or what?

So stop saying you have insulin jabs then all my follow Type 1s - cos I've decided saying the word jab is very demeaning to the work of Banting Best and McLaren and definitely to their lab test doggies, not to mention that Canadian chap, old Eli.

Or perhaps the status of an injected hormone is lower than that of a virus, so jab is OK?  (John Cleese plays The Virus, Ronnie Barker portrays the middleman who looks up to Cleese' character and Ronnie Corbett portrays The Lowly Hormone, who simply knows it's place)


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## Cheesecake (Oct 3, 2021)

I always assumed it could/would cause the donor to have a massive hypo, regardless of how insulin is administered. My husband donates regularly and they feed him biscuits afterwards to raise his sugars, I think that’s why he does it!

I suppose you could deliberately run a bit high beforehand, but then that’s putting the donor at risk and they’re never going to advise that and it possibly makes the blood poor quality?


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## Inka (Oct 3, 2021)

@Cheesecake Having unwillingly lost a number of pints of blood due to a haemorrhage, I can confidently say that it didn’t give me a hypo. Almost killed me, of course, but my blood sugar was fine


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## Lucyr (Oct 3, 2021)

I assume donating blood would mean you couldn’t have an accurate hba1c for 3 months afterwards so could affect your diabetes that way if it leads to inappropriate medication changes?


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## Robin (Oct 3, 2021)

People in the US with well controlled diabetes are allowed to give blood, so I don’t know why not here.


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## Cheesecake (Oct 3, 2021)

@Inka Huh, that’s a really great point, and I’ve experienced the same, no idea what my levels were though, I was on a sliding scale at the time.

Maybe it’s just all too confusing to work out how to do it safely so it’s easier to say no?


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## trophywench (Oct 4, 2021)

No it isn't bureaucracy.  It is because the medical profession in the UK think that PW Type 1 diabetes will not be able to replace 'that much blood' as quickly as they could last week or whenever they last gave blood before being diagnosed with D.


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