# Hill walking problems, advice please



## Richard1951 (Aug 10, 2021)

Hi All new here, and I've encountered the worst form of discrimination, 
A bit of background, 20 years ago I did a lot of Hill walking, I was a trained ML.
I stopped about 2004 due to my wife having arthritis in her hips and knees,
Since then I was diagnosed with type 2, my weight at that time was around 16st.
Jan 20 I was admitted to hospital with pancreatitis, not good health throughout 2020, although
I did lose weight in hospital. Feb 2021 wife walks out after her brother died of covid,  March 2021
I'm back in hospital with Cholecystitis, and gall bladder removed, Weight also down to 13st 5lbs.
As soon as I could after surgery started walking again , I was getting up to about 4 miles with gentle inclines.

So joined a couple of walking groups, first two walks OK 8miles and 4 miles, so took on a hard walk  with a climb of 1600'
and hit problems running out of energy, walk leader not happy as he wanted to go faster, but I made to the top OK, with a few breaks.
Last Sunday took on another hard walk over two hills, and this time regularly munching glucose , First hill hard but got up there,
the second hill at 1750'asl, I got more that 3/4 of the way up talking the odd break, and annoying the group for doing so, and was told to go back to the car. , a 4 mile walk . I have now be thrown off walks in September, even though I'm walking a few miles each day, if not raining hard, and going to the gym.

The question after so much waffle:-
I take 2grms of Metformin daily , and 45 mg of pioglitazone twice daily.
If I understand correctly Metformin inhibits the liver from releasing glucose.
Can I get away with stopping the Metformin 24 hrs before climbing up hills , and may be 
increasing the pioglitazone.
I will be walking on my own in future so no one can complain or ban me from any organised walks.
I've left the two groups and suggested they read the Equality Act
Thanks
Richard


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## helli (Aug 10, 2021)

The first thing I would do is to check your blood sugars when you start to run out of energy.
Stress can cause blood sugars to rise and struggling to get up a hill can cause stress.
Therefore, I recommend checking whether your levels are high or low before deciding how to best manage your diabetes when walking.


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## Tim Aylesbury (Aug 10, 2021)

Hi Richard,

Have you tried any walking groups that are specifically designed for people with Diabetes.  We have a local one covering Buckinghamshire and Oxfordshire that also run expeditions, I am secretary of the local Diabetes UK Group and we work closely with them.  If you can e-mail me on aylesburyvale.diabetes@outlook.com, I can provide you with the contact details.  If you live outside of these counties, they may be able to advise if there is a similar group operating in your area.   Regards. Timothy J. Henshaw, Secretary, Aylesbury Vale Diabetes UK Group.


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## Richard1951 (Aug 10, 2021)

Helli ,I checked them when I got home and they were at 5.7


Tim Aylesbury said:


> Hi Richard,
> 
> Have you tried any walking groups that are specifically designed for people with Diabetes.  We have a local one covering Buckinghamshire and Oxfordshire that also run expeditions, I am secretary of the local Diabetes UK Group and we work closely with them.  If you can e-mail me on aylesburyvale.diabetes@outlook.com, I can provide you with the contact details.  If you live outside of these counties, they may be able to advise if there is a similar group operating in your area.   Regards. Timothy J. Henshaw, Secretary, Aylesbury Vale Diabetes UK Group.


Tim I'm in Shropshire, plenty of hills and some that are very challenging, I'm 70 next week and need to get a T shirt with "not dead at 70" on it. I shall walk up the Wrekin tomorrow, miss the metformin tonight and in the morning, and see if that helps.   . 
Thanks both for the reply


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## Drummer (Aug 10, 2021)

Richard1951 said:


> Helli ,I checked them when I got home and they were at 5.7
> 
> Tim I'm in Shropshire, plenty of hills and some that are very challenging, I'm 70 next week and need to get a T shirt with "not dead at 70" on it. I shall walk up the Wrekin tomorrow, miss the metformin tonight and in the morning, and see if that helps.   .
> Thanks both for the reply


I'm afraid that the Metformin will not dissipate overnight, and the glucose might not help either, as that is the system which is broken, so it will most likely just push up BG levels rather than get into your muscles.
As you are getting fitter - I wonder if you need to medicate. Do you test your blood glucose levels or know your last Hba1c?
I also wonder if you are truly type 3C rather than a plain ordinary 2.


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## Richard1951 (Aug 10, 2021)

At the moment my weight is bouncing around a bit, as I put on more muscle, but there is a drop in my waist line,
I doubt if it is 3C as I have no digestive problems, Maybe if I ate less fruit ,


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## helli (Aug 10, 2021)

Richard1951 said:


> Helli ,I checked them when I got home and they were at 5.7


When you walk up The Wrekin, take your meter with you and test when you struggle rather than just when you get home. 
Just like investments, blood sugars can go up as well as down.


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## Richard1951 (Aug 10, 2021)

Yes I will do that Helli, Tnx


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## helli (Aug 10, 2021)

Richard1951 said:


> Yes I will do that Helli, Tnx


And enjoy The Wrekin.
Scenery in your part of the world in stunning. I am jealous.


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## travellor (Aug 10, 2021)

It's a difficult situation to be in.
I find it very bad they made you walk back by yourself if you were struggling.
That is a very poor leader.
Especially if you had made him aware of your condition beforehand.
But, it's also not good to choose to walk  without any backup.
As has been said, choose a group that supports you, and respects your conditions. 
Don't put yourself at risk.


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## Richard1951 (Aug 10, 2021)

Thanks, I agree,There are no groups in the area that offer support, so I'll walk on my own, The Wrekin is safe enough ,there are too many people on it now, But I will have to be careful on other hills, I'd like to get up Caer Caradoc, and another on my list is Cader Idris, but need to be really fit for that one


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## Felinia (Aug 10, 2021)

Do you have a friend who will walk with you at a pace you are comfortable with for the time being, as you build up your strength and stamina?  You have been ill, had surgery, and it does take time to recover full fitness.  People I know around your age were told 6 - 18 months, and admitted later it did take them that long.  I can understand you want to get back to something you enjoy, but I wonder if your body wasn't quite ready to be pushed so hard so soon.  And please don't walk alone, for your own protection, or without a mobile.  Best wishes


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## travellor (Aug 10, 2021)

Richard1951 said:


> Thanks, I agree,There are no groups in the area that offer support, so I'll walk on my own, The Wrekin is safe enough ,there are too many people on it now, But I will have to be careful on other hills, I'd like to get up Caer Caradoc, and another on my list is Cader Idris, but need to be really fit for that one


Follow the usual protocol.
Lay down a route, leave the details with friends, and check in later.
Stay within a cell phone service if you can, take a sat phone if you can run to it if you can't stay in a cell phone area.


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## Richard1951 (Aug 10, 2021)

I don't have a friend I can walk with, what friends I have are tick box friends, and are not fit, so I'd end up carrying them back down. Part of the  reason for joining the walking groups were to make new friends. I'm aware of the hazards, I trained as a mountain leader back in the 1980's, I also carry a two way VHF/UHF handheld radio as well as a phone, and leave a note on the windscreen of the car, I also have additional motivation now , the worst thing anyone can do is tell me I'm not capable of doing it.


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## trophywench (Aug 10, 2021)

Question - bearing in mind I'm clueless about mountain walking.  You know how mountains have mountain rescue teams, and so do places like the fells in Yorkshire, except they're called something else, but same principle?  So, if you wanted to join a group who are walking in such an area, is it possible to contact whatever the local rescue group is, to ask for suggestions who you might do well to contact to try and arrange this? 

Or does your local U3A have any groups with whom you might find a fit?


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## travellor (Aug 10, 2021)

Richard1951 said:


> I don't have a friend I can walk with, what friends I have are tick box friends, and are not fit, so I'd end up carrying them back down. Part of the  reason for joining the walking groups were to make new friends. I'm aware of the hazards, I trained as a mountain leader back in the 1980's, I also carry a two way VHF/UHF handheld radio as well as a phone, and leave a note on the windscreen of the car, I also have additional motivation now , the worst thing anyone can do is tell me I'm not capable of doing it.


That's a choice you alone can make.
Me, if someone tells me I can't do it, I'll ask why.
I did many survival courses.
The first rule is the thing that kills you is embarrassment.
Beyond that.
Always ask for help.
Never go it alone.
Accept some days there are limits.
And a team is always stronger.


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## Richard1951 (Aug 10, 2021)

I can look in to U3A, they may do , I'm familiar with mountain rescue , as far as I know nothing local, the nearest  will be North Wales, the Shropshire hills are not big enough to warrant anything, Thanks for the suggestion


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## Leadinglights (Aug 11, 2021)

Sometimes group leaders are not mindful of the needs of the whole group. My daughter found on a Trek in the Himalayas although relatively fit there were others who were not quite as much so when they stopped for people to catch up, he moved on before the slower ones had had time to rest so they were even slower on the next leg. They were all medics so were well aware of the dangers of such an expedition which was to set clinics up in the remote areas where people had little access to healthcare.


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## Richard1951 (Aug 11, 2021)

Walk done, started at 0940 and blood sugar was 13.8, 20mins later 7.4 , feeling  bushed at 1007 , Bs 6.2, Took a t 10 min break and took some glucose ,at 1025 ,BS 5.9 nearly at the top of the Wrekiin. sat down and had something to eat at the top , It took 50 mins to get up with a couple of 10 min breaks and a couple of 5 mins breaks, back down in about 25 mins
and BS 8.0. No Metformin taken yesterday or today. feel fine


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## Grldtnr (Aug 11, 2021)

I find it astounding of the attitude of your group leader,that they treat you like that, I take it he is fully aware of your attributes and recent health problems, you might not be as fit as he/she is, but it sounds as though you know what it is about.
Good riddance to them, perhaps if you should find another group, don't let on your hill walking experience, keep schtum, but demonstrate that you know what you are doing when the moment pops up, people become very hble when they are in a tight spot, and get shown up when the numpty calmy shows their hand, been there and done it.
Better to show your an idiot than prove it, especially when your not!


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## helli (Aug 11, 2021)

Richard1951 said:


> Walk done, started at 0940 and blood sugar was 13.8, 20mins later 7.4 , feeling  bushed at 1007 , Bs 6.2, Took a t 10 min break and took some glucose ,at 1025 ,BS 5.9 nearly at the top of the Wrekiin. sat down and had something to eat at the top , It took 50 mins to get up with a couple of 10 min breaks and a couple of 5 mins breaks, back down in about 25 mins
> and BS 8.0. No Metformin taken yesterday or today. feel fine


If you are recently diagnosed and your body is used to having a blood glucose in double figures, the reason for feeling "bushed" maybe because you are not used to the lower numbers. 
I do not have type 2 and am not a doctor but, my understanding is that you are not likely to go hypo with only metformin so I am surprised that you needed the glucose. I would not have thought it would help your body familiarise with the lower blood sugar levels.  

Regardless, congratulations on the walk. I hope the views rewarded you for your efforts.


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## Drummer (Aug 11, 2021)

Richard1951 said:


> Thanks, I agree,There are no groups in the area that offer support, so I'll walk on my own, The Wrekin is safe enough ,there are too many people on it now, But I will have to be careful on other hills, I'd like to get up Caer Caradoc, and another on my list is Cader Idris, but need to be really fit for that one


That so called leader is dangerous - I used to walk in the Pennines and would often find people heading for trouble. when I moved south I tried to organise a few walks fundraising for a charity, and found that the people at the checkpoints would pack up and abandon all the tail end. I refused to pay them as they had not fulfilled their contracts and they were furious, so they got a lecture on safety protocols.


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## Robin (Aug 11, 2021)

If someone can’t keep up, then everyone must go at the pace of the slowest, even if it spoils their walk. Then when everyone is safely back they can suggest that the back marker picks a more suitable walk next time.
This is why when I book a hack at the riding stables, if there are visitors or others not well known to the stables, they always take two escorts. If someone has overstated their riding ability, and freaks out when it’s suggested that we have a nice canter across a field, the spare escort can take them for a safe walk and trot back to the stables, and the rest of the ride can carry on with what they’ve paid for, without it spoiling their experience. Nobody would ever be told to make their own way back unescorted. (it’s surprising, but it does happen, people don’t necessarily lie, but they may have learned to ride in a safe enclosed arena, and suddenly faced with wide open spaces they panic).


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