# My story of Type 2 reversal



## wallycorker (Sep 27, 2009)

My name is John I am 66 years of age and I live in the UK. I thought that others might be interested to hear my story regarding the reversal of my Type 2 diabetic condition by self-management. 

I'm a Type 2 who was diagnosed nearly nine years ago in the very early stages of diabetes (at that time with a fasting blood glucose level just over 7 and with an HbA1c still in the 5s). 

At that stage: FBS 7.4, 7.7 & 7.4; HbA1c 5.7%; TC 7.0; LDL 5.2; HDL 1.07; TG 1.6; BP 164/109; BMI 38.8

My GP prescribed medication to improve my cholesterol (simvastatin increasing throughout the period covered from 10g > 20g > 40g) and also tablets to reduce my blood pressure (bisoprolol and ramipril).

I was given the standard UK advice of "do not test" and "eat plenty of starchy carbohydrate". I'm a good patient and followed that advice!

Despite doing that, my situation gradually worsened over the next seven years with my HbA1c rising slowly and the health professionals continually telling me that things were generally “satisfactory". 

HBa1c Progression: 5.3 > 5.7 > 5.9 > 5.7 > 6.2 > 6.3 > 7.1 > 6.7 > 7.4 > 8.2%

Eventually, when my HbA1c eventually reached 9.4%, my GP prescribed metformin (500mg twice daily) but he and all the other health authorities still told me to follow the same advice of "do not test" and "eat plenty of starchy carbohydrate".

At that stage: TC 5.3; LDL 2.9; HDL 1.1; TG 2.85; BP 130/80; BMI 39.4

For a while, the metformin seemed to make my levels a little bit better but after twelve months my HbA1c had climbed back to a level of 8.5%.

HbA1c Progression: 9.4 > 7.2 > 6.7 > 8.5%

At that stage: TC 4.2; LDL 2.0; HDL 1.0; TG 2.56; BP 125/75; BMI 38.7

Because of this deterioration, my GP doubled the metformin dose (1000mg twice daily) yet at the same time he and the other health authorities still continued to tell me to keep following the "do not test" and "eat plenty of starchy carbohydrate" advice.

I decided that it was about time that I found out much more about what was happening and started looking for reading matter on Amazon. Motivated by a book that I read about reversing diabetes written by a US doctor called Dr Neil Barnard, I started my improvement programme by initially changing eating to a very-low fat, whole food diet with lots of fruit and vegetables and very low alcohol diet. At the same time, but as what I saw a separate exercise, I started calorie counting to lose weight and because of that inadvertently and unconsciously started reducing my carbohydrate consumption. I also decided to disregard my GP's advice and started testing.

Immediately that I adopted these dietary changes, my blood glucose levels improved remarkably and have continued to do so - my HbA1c readings over the last twelve months dropping from 8.5 > 6.8 > 5.7 > 5.5 and to 5.3% last time. My regular finger prick tests indicate that my present level is even lower today. 

This testing also quite clearly showed me that the starchy carbohydrates that I had been eating so enthusiastically on medical advice was, in fact, my worst enemy – especially in the morning at breakfast. I have almost eliminated cereals such as porridge, All Bran, Weetabix, Shredded Wheat etc from my diet altogether. My GP had been encouraging me to try eating porridge for lunch! Whenever I do eat cereal these days it tends to be a nut-based granola. By managing my carbohydrate intake, I have managed to normalise my blood glucose levels to largely achieve the following levels:

Fasting – Less than 6 mmol/l
One hour after finishing eating – Less than 8 mmol/l

These days my fasting blood glucose levels never reach the greater than 7 mmol/l level that is needed to diagnose diabetes – also, my HbA1c is in the normal range and less than it was at diagnosis. By using normal detection methods, medical people would not realise that I was diabetic unless either I told them or they were to carry out a glucose tolerance test.

At the same time, I have gained very significant and quite dramatic improvements in my cholesterol numbers, together with a further lowering of my blood pressure and, in addition, a major weight loss of 30kg to take me out of the obese category.

June 2009: TC 3.1; LDL 1.5; HDL 1.1; TG 1.18; BP 105/60; BMI 29.8

My blood pressure is now lower than that of my thirteen-year-old, always-active, sports-mad grandson.

I would summarise my current diet as being low saturated fat, reduced carbohydrate with lots of fruit and vegetables and with a very low alcohol intake - any alcohol that I do drink these days tends to be the odd glass of red wine on infrequent occasions. Also, any carbohydrate that I do eat I try to make low GI/GL – brown rice, spelt pasta, sweet potatoes and such like.

My GP who had initially refused to prescribe test strips has been left almost speechless – simply reduced to uttering words such as “amazing, unbelievable, very surprised” etc in a repetitive manner. Moreover, he now prescribes strips for me on a regular basis without my even asking – on the basis that it is cheaper than prescribing insulin. I remind him that was my motivation to ask for strips nine months earlier – and also to keep as far as I could away from the quite horrible complications that can come along with poorly-controlled diabetes.

I consider that what I have achieved to have been quite easy to do and simple. These days, I am in the process of questioning at every opportunity the advice that Type 2s are given in the UK – and, wherever I can, I am campaigning against the quite appalling "do not test" and "eat plenty of starchy carbohydrate" advice that is being given to most Type 2 diabetics.

At present, after nine years, I have no symptoms or complications whatsoever that I am aware of. However, I never consider that anything is forever and I am anxious to interact with others to learn what more is achievable in the long term.

I hope that my story may inspire and motivate others.

Here is a further update June 2010 after my annual tests:

June 2010: TC 3.7; LDL 1.8; HDL 1.52; TG 0.93; BP 105/60; BMI 28.0

HbA1c - Down from 5.1% last time to 5.0% (or 31 mmol/mol in the new units)

Total cholesterol - Up from 3.1 to 3.7 

LDL - Up from 1.5 to 1.8

HDL - Up from 1.1 to 1.52

TC/HDL ratio - Down from 2.8 to 2.4

Triglycerides - Down from 1.18 to 0.93

Overall, I'm very pleased with the results and they were just about where I expected to be.

Basically, the changes that I've made dietwise since last year are that I've moved away slightly from a very low-fat diet (almsot vegan) to eating even less starchy carbohydrate and eating more meat. That change seems to have been reflected in the increases in LDL and total cholesterol.

I'm particularly pleased with the improvement in HDL to 1.52 because that's the best result that I've ever had - the previous best was 1.3 if I remember correctly. That might be down to the fact that I've built a regular but small quantity of nuts into my daily diet. I might have done a little bit more exercise too - nothing other than just easy walking. However, despite the fact that I try to do just that, I really hadn't thought that I had increased my activity levels significantly.

Further improvement in TC/HDL ratio from 2.8 to 2.4 mainly due to the improvement in HDL?

Triglycerides down to 0.93 - again a best ever I think. Possibly due to the continued reduction in starchy carbohydrate that I eat? 

The one area that left me just a little bit disappointed is the HbA1c of 5.0% - again my lowest ever. However, I'd been hoping that I might have gone below 5% this time and into the 4% Club. Maybe next time!

A doctor that I don't usually see gave me the results by telephone. He said that he wouldn't have realised that I was diabetic if the screen hadn't given him that information. When I registered slight disappointment that my HbA1c hadn't gone below 5, he commented that it was absolutely nothing to worry about and that my HbA1c was lower than his non-diabetic level. 

Overall, I'm very pleased with what I consider to be a further improvement in my overall sitaution.

Best wishes - John


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## Sugarbum (Sep 27, 2009)

WOW- Im impressed not only with your figures but that you managed to write it all up so accurately!

I think many people will appreciate the time you have taken to share your progress and changes in your diabetes over the years, with a positive outlook.

I find it very interesting. Also very motivating and I am pleased to hear you find yourself in such good health at present! Any news from the petition?

All the best
Lou x


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## Adrienne (Sep 27, 2009)

Hi John

What a fabulous and fantastic story of your 'diabetes life'.

I am in total agreement with you re the doctors and their policy of 'do not test' and 'eat more starcy carbs'.   That advice is so antiquated and wrong.    What they should be saying is 'here is your glucometer and this is how and when you should test' and 'eat a balanced healthy diet'.

I personally don't advocate low carbs (my opinion) but I am of the opinion of balanced healthy diet which includes some carbs but the whole plate doesn't have to be based around carbs which is what I was also told at a hospital years ago for my small type 1 daughter.   I too listened, a bit, but don't now.   I also think about low GI (but not obsessively) and we eat brown pasta (because we prefer it) but we eat Basmati rice (sorry can't bear brown) but we don't actually have those that often.    We have the same as you, lots of veg with meat and a bit of protein.    Jessica had a few new pots on her plate tonight and fruit for pudding, they were her carbs.

Good on ya, you must be very proud of yourself especially when your doctor stutters when he sees your great achievements.


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## Steff (Sep 27, 2009)

WOW ty for sharing that john what a inspirational story you seem to have battled and came out the other side , im sure alot will benifit from you writing this post.


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## insulinaddict09 (Sep 27, 2009)

Well done John and thank you for posting , you have made fantastic progress . I have also reduced my Carbohydrates , but unlike you I tend to extreme Low Carb , I find it works better for me and my way of life ,consequently my Insulin requirements have reduced . Keep up the good work !!


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## wallycorker (Sep 27, 2009)

Sugarbum said:


> WOW- Im impressed not only with your figures but that you managed to write it all up so accurately!
> 
> I think many people will appreciate the time you have taken to share your progress and changes in your diabetes over the years, with a positive outlook.
> 
> ...


Hi Lou,

The best thing my GP's practice did for me on diagnosis was to give me a blue book that offered advice which I have come to question but also every diabetic was supposed to take it to every appointment of any sort whatsoever and get test results logged in it. I think that I am the only person in the world that stills carries his battered book to all medical appointments.  However, it has proved very useful as you may be able to tell from my story. In fact, I have even more details that I haven't used in my story - mainly, cholesterol and blood pressure checks.

I am quite commited to pass my story on to as many people as I can because there is nothing that I would rather do with my time these days than hope that someone else can benefit from what I have learnt over nine years - and particularly over the last twelve months.

As regards the petition, the situation is that the Government will reply when the petition comes to a close. However, they only reply if a petition receives sufficient support. It's doing quite well but I do need help to try to find even more supporters so that 10 Downing Street cannot just sweep it under the carpet. Such petitions can become a quite powerful tool as we all found from Joanna Lumley's Ghurka Petition. I'm no Joanna Lumley so I need a little bit more help from others if I can manage to do it. 

Best wishes - John


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## C*5_Dodger (Sep 27, 2009)

*What about cholesterol*

Dear wally,

Great story, you have achieved better HbA1cs than me. However, I note that you take cholesterol-lowering drugs, presumably because you believe elevated cholesterol is connected to heart disease. Have a look at this and let me know if you still believe or not:

Cholesterol not connected to heart disease

BTW the guy in the video is Dr. Malcolm Kendrick and the data he has plotted is from the World Health Organisation - you can't get much better than that!

Regards   Dodger


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## joimes75 (Sep 27, 2009)

Thanks for sharing John, Ive been trying to follow similar principles over the last month or two since diagnosis and i hope my results match yours in the future! its great to hear stories like this - its great motivation for me personally!

The standard NHS line particuarly to testing (although i'm also attempting to cut down on carbs) makes me so so so annoyed....  it lacks any semblance of logic other than very short term financial savings.

cheers
James


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## wallycorker (Sep 27, 2009)

Adrienne said:


> Hi John
> 
> What a fabulous and fantastic story of your 'diabetes life'.
> 
> ...


Thanks for that Adrienne - I'm grateful!

I'm with you on the testing and see what affects you approach. I hope that I've now managed to get my GP onto that approach too. The beauty of what we do as diabetics is that the medical people can't ignore what we've achieved because they have all the results even before we do.

I stress that anything that I write is from my perspective as a Type 2 and I'm in no position whatsoever to comment on the quite different and more complicated problems as encountered by a Type 1. However, from what I have learnt on these forums quite a lot of the dietary stuff is relevant to Type 1s also - if only in reducing the amount of insulin that they need to  use.

Both me and my non-diabetic wife have quickly come to like a lot of the low GI foods better than those that we used to eat. Have you tried spelt pasta - we particularly like that? I love fruit and eat loads of it - I've never found that it does much to elevate my blood glucose levels.

I feel so very sorry for all the kids - such as Jessica - that become affected by diabetes and have a full lifetime where they need to cope with it. Hope that you both manage your way through it all and manage to keep a positive outlook on life because that is so very important.

Best wishes to both of you - John


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## wallycorker (Sep 27, 2009)

steff09 said:


> WOW ty for sharing that john what a inspirational story you seem to have battled and came out the other side , im sure alot will benifit from you writing this post.


Hi Steff,

I hope that they will.

Best wishes - John


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## wallycorker (Sep 27, 2009)

insulinaddict09 said:


> Well done John and thank you for posting , you have made fantastic progress . I have also reduced my Carbohydrates , but unlike you I tend to extreme Low Carb , I find it works better for me and my way of life ,consequently my Insulin requirements have reduced . Keep up the good work !!


Thanks for that! 

I've never even added up my daily carbohydrate intake - perhaps that is something I ought to do. I eat absolutely loads of fruit - all different kinds - so I don't think that my daily intake will be low. Morevoer, I eat quite a lot of low-GI carbs with my evening meal because carbohydrate doesn't seem to have much of an effect on me at that time of day - much less so thatn in the morning. Cereals and/or bread at breakfast is the worst thing for me - and from what I've learnt many other Type 2s too.

Rest assured that  I'm very committed to try to improve things in this area of my life. I'm retired so I have the time! I'm absolutely bewildered by the advice that I was given.

Best wishes - John


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## wallycorker (Sep 27, 2009)

C*5_Dodger said:


> Dear wally,
> 
> Great story, you have achieved better HbA1cs than me. However, I note that you take cholesterol-lowering drugs, presumably because you believe elevated cholesterol is connected to heart disease. Have a look at this and let me know if you still believe or not:
> 
> ...


Hi Dodger,

I noticed in an earlier post that you've had a lot of success. Is there anywhere that I can read your story of how you managed your improvement?

Yes - I have taken cholesterol-lowering simvastatin drugs for around nine years now. Why? Simply because I'm a good patient usually who does everything that my GP asks me to do! In addition, I never mess around with my medications unless he tells me to. The first-ever non-fasting cholesterol check that I had - quite a long time before the diagnosis of diabetes - was a remarkable 9.74. I've never heard of anyone else with a reading as high as that. I'd be interested to know what I can achieve solely through the dietary changes that I've made but I've decided that I'm not going to push my GP in any particular direction. Not at the present time anyway. For the time being, I'm happy to have the numbers where they are supposed to be.

I'll take a look at the youtube video later.

Best wishes - John


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## insulinaddict09 (Sep 27, 2009)

wallycorker said:


> Thanks for that!
> 
> I've never even added up my daily carbohydrate intake - perhaps that is something I ought to do. I eat absolutely loads of fruit - all different kinds - so I don't think that my daily intake will be low. Morevoer, I eat quite a lot of low-GI carbs with my evening meal because carbohydrate doesn't seem to have much of an effect on me at that time of day - much less so thatn in the morning. Cereals and/or bread at breakfast is the worst thing for me - and from what I've learnt many other Type 2s too.
> 
> ...




Hi John , it still amazes and shocks me that type 2's and type 1's like myself are STILL being told to eat plenty of Carbs for every meals and also Carby snacks  The system has serious flaws ( only my opinion folks )
I remember signing your petition a long time ago , any other help you need give me a shout ,I know I'm type 1 but we still have the same problems and fears of complications this disease can cause.
I tend to have the absolute minimum Carbs per day , this works for me but is not suitable for every Diabetic. I only eat Apples for a treat , Low GI and also Lowish Carbs, on rare occasions I will eat tangerines as a dessert , other than that I only eat Eggs , Steak , Cheese , Chicken , Prawns and any other Seafood , Pork , Beef , Lamb , only Low Carb vegetables , Skimmed Milk , Butter , Olive Oil for cooking , Mushrooms , Salad stuff , I limit Tomatoes though . I also limit my Milk intake to half a pint daily.   I only have other Carbs if I am hypo then I have little choice  I never eat Rice , Pasta , Noodles or any foods like this. I only eat Granary Bread rarely , usually if I have had a hypo and need to have a slow acting Carb.  I never actually add up my daily Carb intake , I may do that just to see how Low Carb I actually am


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## wallycorker (Sep 27, 2009)

insulinaddict09 said:


> Hi John , it still amazes and shocks me that type 2's and type 1's like myself are STILL being told to eat plenty of Carbs for every meals and also Carby snacks  The system has serious flaws ( only my opinion folks )




But the additional problem for Type 2s is that they are generally told not to test and because of that they have no idea what carbohydrates do to their blood glucose levels.



insulinaddict09 said:


> I remember signing your petition a long time ago , any other help you need give me a shout ,I know I'm type 1 but we still have the same problems and fears of complications this disease can cause.




If you could get even a few friends and family to support the petition that would be a tremendous help. The same applies to anyone else too.



insulinaddict09 said:


> I tend to have the absolute minimum Carbs per day , this works for me but is not suitable for every Diabetic. I only eat Apples for a treat , Low GI and also Lowish Carbs, on rare occasions I will eat tangerines as a dessert , other than that I only eat Eggs , Steak , Cheese , Chicken , Prawns and any other Seafood , Pork , Beef , Lamb , only Low Carb vegetables , Skimmed Milk , Butter , Olive Oil for cooking , Mushrooms , Salad stuff , I limit Tomatoes though . I also limit my Milk intake to half a pint daily.   I only have other Carbs if I am hypo then I have little choice  I never eat Rice , Pasta , Noodles or any foods like this. I only eat Granary Bread rarely , usually if I have had a hypo and need to have a slow acting Carb.  I never actually add up my daily Carb intake , I may do that just to see how Low Carb I actually am




Nurses I talk to at my local cricket club always tell me that the standard practice in hospital used to be to give diabetics a fried breakfast, Also, a drink and a slice of toast to treat a hypo'.


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## insulinaddict09 (Sep 27, 2009)

wallycorker said:


> But the additional problem for Type 2s is that they are generally told not to test and because of that they have no idea what carbohydrates do to their blood glucose levels.
> If you could get even a few friends and family to support the petition that would be a tremendous help. The same applies to anyone else too



Yes I am aware of exactly the procedure for Type 2 's I was misdiagnosed for several years as a Type 2 even though my family are predominately Type 1's and I was young  and underweight  I was on Metformin for quite a while and used to buy my own testing strips . I spent several years with levels in the 20+'s doing as I was told and pretty much living on Carbs and popping my pills  Finally I was diagnosed Type 1 after DKA and few days in a Coma . 
I will certainly ask around for you with regard to your petition .


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## wallycorker (Sep 28, 2009)

joimes75 said:


> Thanks for sharing John, Ive been trying to follow similar principles over the last month or two since diagnosis and i hope my results match yours in the future! its great to hear stories like this - its great motivation for me personally!
> 
> The standard NHS line particuarly to testing (although i'm also attempting to cut down on carbs) makes me so so so annoyed....  it lacks any semblance of logic other than very short term financial savings.
> 
> ...


Hi James,

Keep on with your improvement programme - I'm certain that you will be just as successful. Glad to hear that my story gives you additional motivation. 

Yes - I'm terribly frustrated about the question of advice that we are given. Particularly, that when I ask questions of health professionals they never answer my quite simple questions as to why we are given such advice.

Have you supported my petition?

http://petitions.number10.gov.uk/Diabetes-Advice/

Please help if you can.

Best wishes - John


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## C*5_Dodger (Sep 28, 2009)

wallycorker said:


> Hi Dodger,
> 
> I noticed in an earlier post that you've had a lot of success. Is there anywhere that I can read your story of how you managed your improvement?
> 
> Best wishes - John



Dear wally,
My story is not so organised as yours, e.g. I have no little blue book and so my history is not readily available. I was diagnosed in January 1994 and put on Metformin although I was not overweight! However, it did not suit me and so I searched the internet for an alternative. It was as a result of this that I learned about the controlled-carbohydrate approach to blood sugar control. In addition, this exercise taught me to question everything the ?establishment? was telling me about diet, health and nutrition. As a result of searching the internet and reading many books and scientific papers I believe that:

1.  Saturated fat has nothing to do with heart disease ? it is the most stable fat, very resistant to oxidisation i.e. it doesn't go rancid ( You can leave butter out of the fridge for many days)

2.  Cholesterol is also not connected with heart disease and there is no such thing as good and bad cholesterol (VLDL, LDL and HDL are spherical lipoproteins that ferry cholesterol and triglycerides around the body) Every cell in our bodies requires fats and cholesterol to provide its membrane with structural integrity.

3.  Statins do not work by lowering cholesterol ? they are anti-inflammatory drugs

4.  Raised blood sugar is a result of putting more carbohydrate into your body than it can tolerate

5.  The body's toleration of carbohydrate decreases with time (beta-cell function diminishes with time)

My doctor was absolutely astounded at the results I achieved and eventually came to believe my viewpoint. When I then asked her why she was not passing this information on to her other diabetics she replied ?They will not take any notice and would not believe me even if they did?. 

Currently my diabetes clinics are done by my DSN and she too just cannot accept that my good results are connected to my controlling carbohydrates. She just says ?whatever it is that you are doing just keep it up?

Regards   Dodger


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## wallycorker (Sep 28, 2009)

C*5_Dodger said:


> Dear wally,
> My story is not so organised as yours, e.g. I have no little blue book and so my history is not readily available. I was diagnosed in January 1994 and put on Metformin although I was not overweight! However, it did not suit me and so I searched the internet for an alternative. It was as a result of this that I learned about the controlled-carbohydrate approach to blood sugar control. In addition, this exercise taught me to question everything the ?establishment? was telling me about diet, health and nutrition. As a result of searching the internet and reading many books and scientific papers I believe that:
> 
> 1.  Saturated fat has nothing to do with heart disease ? it is the most stable fat, very resistant to oxidisation i.e. it doesn't go rancid ( You can leave butter out of the fridge for many days)
> ...


Hi again Dodger,

So you are a non-overweight Type 2 who was diagnosed around 15 years ago and you have maintained excellent-control over your blood glucose levels throughout that time by restricting carbohydrate intake? Most of that time even with no medication? I find that story itself very interesting and inspirational to me who is really just twelve months into my improvement programme! 

Do you mind me asking - are you complication free after all that time?

After reading Dr Charles Clark's book the Diabetes Revolution, I'm certainly with you on points 4 and 5 above. I'll reserve my judgment on points 1, 2 and 3 but my view is starting to head down that sort of track. 

Yes - I have met several people in the health authorities who have been astounded with what I have done. So impressed that they have suggested all sorts of possibilities for meeting people to take them through my story, even suggested using me in media campaigns, putting my name forward to take place in diabetic pathways discussions etc, etc. However, what has come out of any of those ideas? Absolutely nothing so far! I suppose that when they all sit back and think about things they wouldn't know how to deal with somebody who has a story that is so far off message.

Moreover, I have started getting myself invited to high level meetings within my local Barnsley Area Primary Care Trust with all sorts of specialists in attendance. Everyone listens quietly and politely to my story and mutter a few words such as "Well done!" but nothing else. None of them have asked for more details or seem that interested in what I have achieved and when I push them on any point they tend to clam up or mutter something like "It's complicated!". I can't understand the situation because I'm certain that they are all fully aware of the situation that I describe - i.e. that carbohydrate is just as bad as sugar to a diabetic. 

It really is a crazy world - I find this area quite bewildering! More and more Type 2s are being diagnosed every day - and, according to the statistics,  their conditions are almost certain to get progressively worse. Despite that, the NHS and most of the other health authorities continue to travel down the same "do not test" and "eat plenty of starchy carbohydrate" path towards quite horrible diabetic complications. It really is unbelievable!

I'd love to learn more about your particular situation. Please keep in touch. You never know one day we might need to march into Downing Street. 

Best wishes - John


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## am64 (Sep 28, 2009)

thank you for all your explanations ...so much to take in... what are the low carb foods? after a short while of throwing caution to the wind and feeling crap i am determined to sort my self out...thanks to this forum i finally feel suported
cheers
am


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## C*5_Dodger (Sep 28, 2009)

wallycorker said:


> Hi again Dodger,
> 
> So you are a non-overweight Type 2 who was diagnosed around 15 years ago and you have maintained excellent-control over your blood glucose levels throughout that time by restricting carbohydrate intake? Most of that time even with no medication? I find that story itself very interesting and inspirational to me who is really just twelve months into my improvement programme!
> 
> ...



Dear whally,

I find your situation fastinating, and so very much like my own. To answer your question I have no complications whatsoever beyond a small loss of sensation in my left foot. My DSN has made the statement "Sorry but there is nothing that can be done -just keep doing whatever you are doing now" Well I don't accept that, there are people who have reversed complications -at least in the early stages - Dr. Bernstein is a good example, and I am working on a solution to the problem as we speak. Now, from my earlier posts you may think that I am against oral antidiabetic drugs - nothing could be further from from my position - it's just that I believe, that in the long term, they do not work well. In your thread "Controlled carb approach to BG control", in my post, I point out that I have the results of UKPDS to back my viewpoint, but ofcourse I don't know if anyone has read it (including Northerner!) let alone agree or disagree with it!

I will certainly keep in touch, I have already noted that you, and a number of others post on other forums than this. BTW regarding your reserving judgment on points 1, 2 and 3 have you had a look at the video yet - it's only a minute or two long, but is, I believe, a devastating blow against the "high cholesterol causes heart disease" hypothesis! I value your opinions and would love to see your reaction.

Warmest Regards   Dodger


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## wallycorker (Sep 28, 2009)

C*5_Dodger said:


> Dear whally,
> 
> I find your situation fastinating, and so very much like my own. To answer your question I have no complications whatsoever beyond a small loss of sensation in my left foot. My DSN has made the statement "Sorry but there is nothing that can be done -just keep doing whatever you are doing now" Well I don't accept that, there are people who have reversed complications -at least in the early stages - Dr. Bernstein is a good example, and I am working on a solution to the problem as we speak. Now, from my earlier posts you may think that I am against oral antidiabetic drugs - nothing could be further from from my position - it's just that I believe, that in the long term, they do not work well. In your thread "Controlled carb approach to BG control", in my post, I point out that I have the results of UKPDS to back my viewpoint, but ofcourse I don't know if anyone has read it (including Northerner!) let alone agree or disagree with it!
> 
> ...


Hi again Dodger,

Yes - I've taken a look at the video and I haven't seen it before. I have read similar stuff but not come acoss the Australian Aboriginal  relationship before. It's another interesting point but I've seen so much conflicting advice that I find it hard sort out the wheat from the chaff. What it does say fits in with Dr Charles Clark's position and that is about where I have got to so far in my understanding what happened to me. I'll take a look for more info' on this aspect.

I really am still forming my opinions because I've read so many things that contradict each other. What I find simplest at this stage is to keep any views related to what I know has happened to me. I've plenty to go at just using that as my ammunition - and the medical people know it's factual because the information came from them.

What I can tell you is that my cholesterol levels always were high at a massive 9.74 the first time that I ever had it taken and in the 7s before and at the time of diagnosis of diabetes and before I started medication. Every medical person that I ever met told me that it was a certainty that I would die of a heart attack. 

Then a few years ago I had need to have an angiogram and guess what the specialist told me? He said in his exact words "I had lovely arteries and would certainly not die of an heart attack so I better watch out for a bus getting me!". It's always been as though he was giving me someone else's result - i.e. the next bloke in the queue!

I suppose that little story from my first-hand experience fits in with your beliefs as regards cholesterol and heart disease. I must say that I'm still more of the opinion that the specialist was giving me someone else's result. However, I hope that it's you who is right.

Best wishes - John


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## C*5_Dodger (Sep 28, 2009)

wallycorker said:


> Hi again Dodger,
> 
> Yes - I've taken a look at the video and I haven't seen it before. I have read similar stuff but not come acoss the Australian Aboriginal  relationship before. It's another interesting point but I've seen so much conflicting advice that I find it hard sort out the wheat from the chaff. What it does say fits in with Dr Charles Clark's position and that is about where I have got to so far in my understanding what happened to me. I'll take a look for more info' on this aspect.
> 
> ...



Dear John,

I understand your position completely, but you may like to consider this:

When the graphs of two variables, say A and B, show a correlation there are 3 possibliities:

1.  A causes B
2.  B causes A
3.  A and B are correlated because of some underlying common factor.

The trouble is epidemiology cannot say which of the above is true. However, when no correlation exists you can be sure that A is not related to B.

Regarding your search for more info' you may find this of interest.


*Relation of aggressiveness of lipid-lowering treatment to changes in calcified plaque burden by electron beam tomography*
_The American Journal of Cardiology, Volume 92, Issue 3, 1 August 2003_, Pages 334-336
Harvey S. Hecht MD, and S. Mitchell Harman MD, PhD.

_Abstract_: The comparative effects of more versus less aggressive low-density lipoprotein (LDL) cholesterol lowering (to ≤80 vs >80 mg/dl) on calcified coronary plaque progression by electron beam tomography were evaluated in 182 consecutive asymptomatic patients after 1.2 years of treatment with statins alone or in combination with niacin. Despite the greater improvement in lipids in the ≤80 versus >80 mg/dl groups, there were no differences in calcified plaque progression (9.3%/year vs 9.1%/year).

[My addition] Translated into European units  LDL ≤ 2mmol/L:    progression 9.3%/year  vs   LDL > 2mmol/L:    progression 9.1%/year.

We conclude that, with respect to LDL cholesterol lowering, “lower is better” is not supported by changes in calcified plaque.

I guess we should end this thead for now, I know you will need to do your own research, rather than accept anything I can come up with!

Best Regards   Dodger


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## wallycorker (Sep 29, 2009)

am64 said:


> thank you for all your explanations ...so much to take in... what are the low carb foods? after a short while of throwing caution to the wind and feeling crap i am determined to sort my self out...thanks to this forum i finally feel suported
> cheers
> am


Hi am,

Glad that you intend to sort yourself out. It really is worth doing especially in the long term. 

It's not really a question of what are the low carb foods - it's more a cut out or down on a lot of the foods that are raising your blood glucose levels - i.e. cereals, bread, potatoes, rice, pasta, etc. Start there and gradually refine your diet until you have your blood glucose levels under control.

Good luck - John


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## C*5_Dodger (Sep 29, 2009)

am64 said:


> thank you for all your explanations ...so much to take in... what are the low carb foods? after a short while of throwing caution to the wind and feeling crap i am determined to sort my self out...thanks to this forum i finally feel suported
> cheers
> am



Dear am64,

In addition to whally's post I would like to add that adopting a controlled carbohydrate approach, although not easy, has some great benefits:

1.  It is possible that you may be able to discontinue (with your Dr's agreement) your medications - no meds no side effects.

2.  One can also obtain better control than is possible with oral meds, only insulin can match this approach - better control, delay or even avoid long-term complications.

3. There are good books out there which will enable you to adopt a formal approach to carbohydrate restriction - increases your chance of success. One I have used is by Jenny Ruhl (see books thread) but there's a choice.

Finally, some people question whether this approach works but consider this:
*If you don't put glucose (i.e. carbohydrate) into your body - how can you have high blood sugar!*

This ofcouse is just a slogan you actualy eat sufficient carbohydrate to keep your blood sugars on target!

Warmest Regards   Dodger


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## wallycorker (Dec 30, 2009)

Just to update on this thread - it's further great news for me! I've just received my latest HbA1c result and it is a further improvement to 5.1%.

Recently, I've been fine-tuning by cutting back further on the carbohydrate that I eat. I'm still eating quite a lot of carbohydrate - around 100g per day on average and quite often more - but most of the carbohydrate that I eat is now fruit. 

I've been taking more and more of the starchy carbohydrate out of my diet and now eat hardly any cereal, bread or potatoes - and less pasta and rice too. When I do eat the latter I now only eat brown or wild rice and spelt or pulse pasta.

I've got the 4% Club within my sights now!

John


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## Carina1962 (Jan 1, 2010)

Wallycorker: i have just read your story and feel very inspired by it.  I am fairly newly diagnosed Type 2 (Oct 2009) and i am taking every step possible to contol my diabetes ie losing weight (i am obese with a BMI of 37 but have already lost a stone and a half) doing lots more walking etc and i get the results of my first HbA1c next week.  My DN also told me at the start that there is no such thing as a 'diabetic diet' and that i should follow a meal plan which was set out in a booklet she gave me and did not mention cutting back on carbs but i have learnt so much from this message board site and a couple of others too and am doing my own thing in controlling my BS levels.  She too told me not to bother testing and just to use urine sticks but i have ignored her advice and bought myself a monitor just before i was diagnosed and unfortunately have to buy the expensive test strips.  I was diagnosed at 7.8 fasting glucose level and also feel quite fortunate that i have been 'caught early' so to speak as only 12 months prior i was a 'non-diabetic' so within a year i became diabetic.   I am reading the book you mention at the moment and am finding it very interesting.  Yes, diabetes complications scare me (my late mother was diabetic) but i'm sure with the technology we have today (and improving all the time) we 'diabetics' have a better chance, i hope, of avoiding complications and leading a long, normal  healthy life.


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