# banana



## Owen (Aug 26, 2016)

Trying some stuff from the GL camp. So i ate a ripe banana and a tablespoon of peanut butter. Post prandial reading of 5.8. 

Summary, I am going to try again tomorrow and if it is the same. It will be kept as a regular. Prior to this I would have layout into double figures with the banana on its own.


----------



## Martin Canty (Aug 26, 2016)




----------



## Mark Parrott (Aug 26, 2016)

I tested a firm but ripe enough banana & peaked at 6.5 1hr after, so ok for me every now & then.


----------



## Northerner (Aug 26, 2016)

Bananas are fine for me, better if firm and yellow (not black and oozing! ) And peanut butter is perfect with them!  Good to see the GL approach seems to be working for you Owen


----------



## Marsbartoastie (Aug 26, 2016)

The combo that works for me is banana and full fat natural yogurt (the smell of peanut butter sets my teeth on edge).

I make a very tasty 'ice cream' with a frozen banana, some frozen strawberries (other berries are available), a little vanilla and some natural yogurt.  You just whizz them all up in a blender.  One banana's worth makes more than enough for two people.

NB: You need to peel bananas and wrap them in cling film before freezing them to prevent browning.  I like freezing them, because it means they never go to waste.


----------



## Lydia1960 (Aug 30, 2016)

They say that natural yoghurt with some berries and nuts make a good nutritious breakfast. Might try that and give it a go. Certainly a more lively start to the day that toast and jam!


----------



## Owen (Aug 30, 2016)

Northerner said:


> Bananas are fine for me, better if firm and yellow (not black and oozing! ) And peanut butter is perfect with them!  Good to see the GL approach seems to be working for you Owen


Somehow missed these replies, thanks for the link to the book. It may end up being a sanity saver.


----------



## Owen (Aug 30, 2016)

Marsbartoastie said:


> The combo that works for me is banana and full fat natural yogurt (the smell of peanut butter sets my teeth on edge).
> 
> I make a very tasty 'ice cream' with a frozen banana, some frozen strawberries (other berries are available), a little vanilla and some natural yogurt.  You just whizz them all up in a blender.  One banana's worth makes more than enough for two people.
> 
> NB: You need to peel bananas and wrap them in cling film before freezing them to prevent browning.  I like freezing them, because it means they never go to waste.


Thanks going to try that


----------



## bilbie (Aug 31, 2016)

The problem with fruit is because of the fructose that isn't measured by the glucose meter. Fructose has to be metabolised by the liver, like alcohol.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=KybOPCB2Qd4


----------



## Radders (Aug 31, 2016)

bilbie said:


> The problem with fruit is because of the fructose that isn't measured by the glucose meter. Fructose has to be metabolised by the liver, like alcohol.
> ]


Hi Bilbie, please could you tell me what you mean by "fructose that isn't measured by the glucose meter"? Sorry If this is explained in the attachments but I can't see the videos on my device.


----------



## grovesy (Aug 31, 2016)

I thought all carbhydrates and types of Sugars are broken down by the body to glucose!


----------



## bilbie (Aug 31, 2016)

The meter simply doesn't measure fructose, it is a glucose meter.
Table sugar, fruit sugars and high fructose corn syrup are basically the same sucrose. About half glucose, half fructose.
http://www.nofructose.com/introduction/discussion-nofructose-blog/

It gives a false sense of security because, Fructose has the lowest glycemic index (GI = 19)  Glucose has the highest glycemic index of 100 (GI = 100)

The problem is also that it is a double edged sword. As well as ingested fructose, the normal population turns 3% of glucose into fructose, where a T2 diabetic turns up to 10 time more, 30%. Through the polyol pathway. This has to be processed by the liver and is normally turned into fat. It is said to be a part of the obesity epidemic.




although as well as the site above, you can google the terms and the work of Dr. Robert Lustig, UCSF Division of Pediatric Endocrinology.
When you have access to a video player, this is also an excellent video on fructose


----------



## Owen (Aug 31, 2016)

Just read a brief summary of a meta analysis on the impact of fructose, it seems the jury is still out. High concentrations appear to be bad, but in small concentrations they appear to offer some benefit to glycemic control.


----------



## bilbie (Aug 31, 2016)

It also depends when the paper was written. The polyol pathway of T2's turning glucose to fructose has only recently been discovered. 

While true, the poison is in the dose. The benefit to glucose/glycemic control is that it doesn't register. Strychnine also won't register on a glucose meter and will benefit glucose/glycemic control. The body doesn't recognise it as a food. It is the same as alcohol, both won't read on a glucose meter and both have to be metabolised by the liver, turning to fat in part, causing alcoholic and non alcoholic fatty liver. Beer and carb belly.


----------



## Owen (Aug 31, 2016)

bilbie said:


> It also depends when the paper was written. The polyol pathway of T2's turning glucose to fructose has only recently been discovered.
> 
> While true, the poison is in the dose. The benefit to glucose/glycemic control is that it doesn't register. Strychnine also won't register on a glucose meter and will benefit glucose/glycemic control. The body doesn't recognise it as a food. It is the same as alcohol, both won't read on a glucose meter and both have to be metabolised by the liver, turning to fat in part, causing alcoholic and non alcoholic fatty liver. Beer and carb belly.


Don't have enough knowledge to argue either way, but I don't have large amounts in my diet and will be interested to see how this pans out


----------



## Radders (Sep 1, 2016)

I'm sorry for being slow, but I still don't understand what you mean by saying it doesn't register on the meter. If I drink fruit juice, my meter certainly registers an increase, in fact I use it to treat hypos.


----------



## Owen (Sep 1, 2016)

I think from reading there is carbohydrate and fructose, the carb will register but the fructose does not. Maybe Bilbie can clear this up.


----------



## Matt Cycle (Sep 1, 2016)

Gobbledegook to me.  What the hell is a polyol pathway when it's at home?  Can someone explain it in simple terms.


----------



## Owen (Sep 1, 2016)

Bilbie, are you suggesting that the primary cause of NAFLD is from fructose. In the same way that alcohol causes liver disease?


----------



## bilbie (Sep 1, 2016)

Radders said:


> I'm sorry for being slow, but I still don't understand what you mean by saying it doesn't register on the meter. If I drink fruit juice, my meter certainly registers an increase, in fact I use it to treat hypos.


The sugars in OJ are sucrose, half glucose, half fructose.
The glucose content in the OJ treats the hypo and registers on the meter. The fructose doesn't treat the hypo, or registers. It has to be metabolised by the liver, like alcohol and turned to fat.


----------



## Radders (Sep 1, 2016)

bilbie said:


> The sugars in OJ are sucrose, half glucose, half fructose.
> The glucose content in the OJ treats the hypo and registers on the meter. The fructose doesn't treat the hypo, or registers. It has to be metabolised by the liver, like alcohol and turned to fat.


I think I understand, this is good to know. I admit I had assumed that all the sugar in fruit was fructose. A table I found says that apple juice is 56% fructose, so in that case it's not a very efficient  hypo treatment, but my experience is that it works! When I drink 100 ml apple juice (10 g sugar)  it seems to behave just like 10 g Dextrosol tablets, but a bit quicker. If I am only getting 5g of hypo treatment I am surprised at the effect!


----------



## bilbie (Sep 1, 2016)

Owen said:


> Bilbie, are you suggesting that the primary cause of NAFLD is from fructose. In the same way that alcohol causes liver disease?


It's very much a part of it. as well as the videos above. Professor Taylor and fatty liver and NC diet.

pick up the video at the 5 minute mark, a near 30% increase in liver fat in just 3 weeks of extra Sucrose, a small bag of lollies, a soft drink and a fruit juice
http://www.fend-lectures.org/index.php?menu=view&id=94


----------



## Owen (Sep 1, 2016)

Is there some debate on wether the fructose is processed or from natural fruits. I understand that the juicing fad may be causing some possible risks.

Certainly the trend for HFCS is dangerous.


----------



## Martin Canty (Sep 1, 2016)

Owen said:


> Certainly the trend for HFCS is dangerous.


Agreed...... It was a disaster for nutrition when they invented the stuff.....

I advocate made from scratch wherever possible (helps that I enjoy cooking).... Sounds familiar doesn't it, kinda the way our Mothers & Grandmothers fed us.


----------



## Radders (Sep 1, 2016)

Matt Cycle said:


> Gobbledegook to me.  What the hell is a polyol pathway when it's at home?  Can someone explain it in simple terms.


Thanks Matt, I was thinking it was just me!


----------



## Radders (Sep 4, 2016)

I've been thinking about this a lot. It is a huge revelation to me that fructose doesn't raise blood glucose and it has made me wonder a few things: all my ratios for insulin dosing for fruit (and veg containing fructose) must be wrong, assuming fructose is included in the carbs shown in nutritional info. I now feel I need to know the carbs excluding fructose in foods so I can dose correctly, can anyone point me to a reliable source of this info please? I am also wondering why I haven't noticed that I've been overdosing insulin for fruit for the past 10 years since I've been carb counting? 
Also if fructose and alcohol are both turned straight into fat, does that mean they are basically bad for us full stop? 

Very interested in others' observations and wondering why I have never been told this by dietitians who have advised me!


----------



## Northerner (Sep 5, 2016)

Radders said:


> I've been thinking about this a lot. It is a huge revelation to me that fructose doesn't raise blood glucose and it has made me wonder a few things: all my ratios for insulin dosing for fruit (and veg containing fructose) must be wrong, assuming fructose is included in the carbs shown in nutritional info. I now feel I need to know the carbs excluding fructose in foods so I can dose correctly, can anyone point me to a reliable source of this info please? I am also wondering why I haven't noticed that I've been overdosing insulin for fruit for the past 10 years since I've been carb counting?
> Also if fructose and alcohol are both turned straight into fat, does that mean they are basically bad for us full stop?
> 
> Very interested in others' observations and wondering why I have never been told this by dietitians who have advised me!


Haven't looked into this too closely, but I'm sceptical about this theory already. As you say, your carb counting has worked for years by accounting for the fructose as carbs that will raise levels, so need to be injected for - exactly the same for me, and since I've never heard this as a problem from anyone else here over the past 8 years it I find it difficult to believe


----------



## bilbie (Sep 5, 2016)

Together as sucrose they are 58 GI. I did put up the GI of fructose by itself, it's 19, about the same as a peanut. Glucose by itself is 100,


----------

