# Cycling & Safety



## Dave W (Mar 3, 2018)

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Cycle Safety


As a car driver* I’m appalled by the number of obviously ‘keen’ cyclists riding in head to foot dark colours for against low sun or in low light as they are extremely difficult to see. I can’t understand why they do it. Fashion perhaps? Then there are those, often younger cyclists, riding without helmets - lack of imagination in this case perhaps.
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As a reborn cyclist* (MTB  e-bike with a florescent jacket that would make eyes water) I have to say that the vast majority of drivers I encounter round about here are extremely considerate and courteous . I’m very fortunate to live in an area with many B and unclassified roads and also several miles of 40 mph ‘walking & cycling’ roads. On the narrower roads cars or I will pull in to allow safe passage and there are usually waves of thanks exchanged.

I doubt if I would feel nearly as safe cycling in an urban environment and those who do get out on their bikes in heavy traffic have my admiration. It's a great shame that national and local goverment isn't more active in promoting cycling by creating cycle lanes as it would reduce pollution and improve health. Win-win!


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## HOBIE (Mar 3, 2018)

What annoys me is a Cycle lane that some cyclists don't use ? The council spend & they want to use the road ?


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## Radders (Mar 3, 2018)

HOBIE said:


> What annoys me is a Cycle lane that some cyclists don't use ? The council spend & they want to use the road ?


Some cycle lanes are absolute death traps. Because you are off the road, car drivers just don’t seem to see you and turn left across your path. Also many come to an abrupt end and someone parks across the exit. Not to mention the broken bottles etc in the cycle lanes that don’t get swept away.


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## HOBIE (Mar 3, 2018)

There is a Cycle lane on a road near me. More than half a mile long. An A road too. I regularly see cyclists on racers risking there lives in twos. I go on my Mountain bike out of the way from cars. I have Kevlar tyres so broken bottles are no problem at an extra couple of £. Life is not worth the risk peddling on the Main roads  That another reason why the council have less money ?


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## Matt Cycle (Mar 4, 2018)

Even darker clothing will normally have some reflective bits but certainly in low light I would have my lights on.  However, the SMIDSY (sorry mate I didn't see you) is no excuse.  I had a car pull out on me (an OAP driver), light was okay and I'd got my lights on - I saw him looking for traffic, then looked again right at me and just as I reached the junction he decided to pull out.  Luckily I'd slowed down in anticipation of this but he was certainly a danger on the roads. Either blind or slow reactions.  Should've gone to Specsavers or got one of those chariots.   I don't see many people not wearing helmets (hardly any in fact) but again it's not a legal requirement.  I'd certainly advise people to wear one but at the end of the day it's personal choice.

Agree with Radders as most of the cycle lanes I encounter are poor with little thought given to how they are laid out.  Sometimes stopping at busy roundabouts or bad junctions.  There is no legal requirement to use cycle lanes and often it's safer to stay on the road than trying to filter in and out of cycle lanes, never mind the broken glass and cars parked on them.  Cycling infrastructure needs serious investment for it to work properly and at the moment in most places it's just token measures.  The only place that has made a serious attempt at it is in London, they've spent millions and people are using them.

It's mainly semi rural where I am although I occasionally go in the city but I try to avoid the busy roads where possible (not always possible) but the vast majority of drivers I encounter are courteous, friendly and considerate as I try to be.  But I'll finish on a rant  about one type of driver who from my observations on the bike seem to be responsible for most of the dangerous manoeuvres I see.  What is it about BMW/Audi drivers?  They think they can defy the laws of physics by seeing around corners and overtaking on blind bends and that the rules of the road don't apply to them.  I've often thought it's like a chicken and egg situation in what came first, i.e. do only a**eholes buy BMW/Audis or does buying a BMW/Audi turn you into an a**ehole?  I apologise if you are a BMW/Audi driver and are not an a**ehole and just hope you get your normal car back soon.


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## HOBIE (Mar 4, 2018)

I used to visit Keswick a lot. Go out on my peddle bike nearly every day. Narrow roads & busy. I used to get off the roads as soon as I could. Latrigg was one of my favourites. 1200ft hillock 3 times in one week. Going around Derwent water which was good but not when it was buzzy. No cycle lanes but plenty "off road" if you did your homework. The old railway line (c2c) was perfect. !0 mile off road .


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## Chris Hobson (Mar 5, 2018)

I always wear a helmet and a bright yellow top when I'm cycling. I also use USB chargeable lights when it is even the slightest bit gloomy, these are very powerful and bright. On the subject of cycle paths, some of them are brilliant and I use them, but others are very poorly designed, poorly maintained or both. Some paths are constantly crossing side roads which means that the cyclist using them has to constantly give way to traffic from all directions, in these situations using the road is both quicker and safer. I always make an informed decision about whether to use the path or the road.


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## Northerner (Mar 6, 2018)

Fancy this then, you bikers?


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## HOBIE (Mar 6, 2018)

Very good. My good friend is  stunt rider who has been on the TV with Mathew Kelly, jumping a Mountain bike


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## Matt Cycle (Mar 6, 2018)

Northerner said:


> Fancy this then, you bikers?



This is Danny MacAskill (from Skye) in and around Edinburgh in one of his first videos from 2009.  Amazing stuff - certainly one of the best trials riders in the world.  I never tire of watching this.


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## HOBIE (Mar 7, 2018)

I too like watching them "nutters" on bikes. My mate is Jez Avery. We used to work in a shop with a basement, concrete steps & an 800mm square at the bottom . A good drop & he used to ride his bike down & stop before he hit the wall.


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## RichardA (Mar 15, 2018)

As a cyclist for many years I have come to the conclusion it doesn't mater what you wear or you can have the brightest lights, if the motorist is not looking in your direction he will hit you FACT. The amount of time I see motorist come up to a T junction and looking LEFT first, right is were they should be looking not left and all they say “I didn't see you”, and now they have a “get out of jail card” if things go wrong “where's your yellow hi vis jacket, where's your helmet, where's your lights _(during the day time)_ ect there has been quite a few court cases were the judge has ruled in the favour of the motorist just because you wore the wrong clothes.

<rant over> now were did I put my lucky underpants.........


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## MikeTurin (Mar 16, 2018)

Matt Cycle said:


> most of the cycle lanes I encounter are poor with little thought given to how they are laid out.  Sometimes stopping at busy roundabouts or bad junctions.


This is true, in some cases I think they are unsafe, or worse designed with the leisuring cyclist with kids in mind, and in some cases are abruptly terminating in the middle of a nowhere, like a busy intersection or at the end of a city.
The other problem is bad maintenance, the presence of dehors and people parking on it.


> .  What is it about BMW/Audi drivers?  They think they can defy the laws of physics by seeing around corners and overtaking on blind bends and that the rules of the road don't apply to them.


I think it's not limited only to German luxury cars, I think that this way of thinking is spreaded inipendently in the population. Cyclists too are thinking they could defy the law of pysics. And the asshole retiree with a small car madly maintaines has a really high "donkeyness".
At least a new BMW has good brakes and lights...


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## trophywench (Mar 17, 2018)

Oh from the days A&E called all motorbikers admitted in ambulances 'organ donors', haven't we moved on?  Now it applies to cyclists........

We reckon it's beyond time SMIDSY encounters ceased ......


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## RichardA (Mar 17, 2018)

trophywench said:


> Oh from the days A&E called all motorbikers admitted in ambulances 'organ donors', haven't we moved on?  Now it applies to cyclists........
> 
> We reckon it's beyond time SMIDSY encounters ceased ......


Sadly two motorcyclists died in separate accidents in my area just hours apart today


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## trophywench (Mar 17, 2018)

We have long been completely invisible, Richard even after we've been on any number of   Police Bikesafe training days, always use headlights even when it's dazzlingly sunny (and it still doesn't work on main beam) and are members of the IAM etc etc.

The blind motorist still can't see us which is why we absolutely must invest in the best personal armour we possibly can and simply ignore the amount we need to spend on it.

Car drivers can't even see 44 ton artics at times and are totally clueless that anything bigger than a Ka needs more than the length of a 5p piece to stop!


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## Randomdiabetictype1 (Apr 9, 2018)

all i wear when i'm cycling is :
If weathers ok: helmet, hi-viz/reflective yellow waterproof gloves
if raining: Helmet/hi-viz/reflective yellow waterproof gloves and a hi viz/reflective helmet cover.  If it's raining i also wear a blue waterproof coat.  I just prefer to wear a helmet and some people might argue with this point: But motorbikes and horse riders are required by law to wear helmets so why not cyclists?. Some people might argue it does nothing in a crash but the whole point of helmets in the avoid impact.? Sure it's better then nothing.   The gloves are more so drivers can see hand signals easily and if you fall you won't get cuts/scrapes on your hands which you use daily.

If it's raining and foggy i always put my lights on or whenever cars have their dipped headlights most of the time i turn bike lights on. I also of course turn them on when dark hours. (I have three) bike lights front bike light, rear bike light and a built in helmet rear light. The shoes i have are already waterproof
I mostly just cycle to college, town and friends houses and just have hybrid bike.   I do have hi-viz/reflective vest but i rarely use this. Just mainly in winter afternoons and if i was to cycle when it's fully dark.

Although some people are still a bit odd. When it was raining the other day had a local police van overtake closely and they could clearly see  i was about to take up middle of the lane as i was approaching a small roundabout and you would think police veichles are the least likely to do stupid things as there the ones that know the law . I obvisouly didn't do anything wrong as if i had they would off pulled me over afterwards. But weird thing is there was a cycle path after roundabout the way i was going so could of at least just waited till pass the roundabout to get past. Has anyone else had things happen with Police veichles?  *Still confuses why a police van would do this when they clearly know to give space as there in charge of the law.* .     (I never confront drivers because no point), It seems like the police in my area don't care that much about cyclists because there was a time i was going over a roundabout i signalled and a car pulled out without checking roundabout so i had to brake quickly and when i exited i noticed there was a police car waiting to join roundabout but he didn't do anything. But surely he could of seen that car?

But most of the time 99% of the time most drivers are fine there's 1% that aren't and in my area that's mostly buses. The odd car and van.  However i've only been cycling since end of September so around 7 and half months. I've had two things said to me:
1. Like just before a mini roundabout a driver close passes and then said my bike lights were too bright. Erm this was in the daytime when it was about to rain. Lights are not as bright as headlights/brake lights.
2. Another time a van drive said don't be in middle of the road (i wasn't was in middle of the lane to the far right as i could (so others know what my attention was) waiting for a gap in traffic so i could complete right turn. 

I don't see the point confronting drivers because it would just cause a argument and possibly lead into road rage or law getting involved.

(I still need to attach a bottle holder to my bike. Do you guys know how you attach a bottle holder? i thought you used a allen key but that doesn't fit on the screws on my bike that would go wear bottle holder would go. i keep my water bottle in my bag at the moment.


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## Robin (Apr 9, 2018)

Randomdiabetictype1 said:


> But motorbikes and horse riders are required by law to wear helmets so why not cyclists?


Only horse riders under 14 are required by law to wear them, though I don't know any adult who doesn't! ( apart from the Queen, and she probably doesn't ride on the roads very much). They are only 'recommended' for adults.


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## Matt Cycle (Apr 9, 2018)

Randomdiabetictype1 said:


> (I still need to attach a bottle holder to my bike. Do you guys know how you attach a bottle holder? i thought you used a allen key but that doesn't fit on the screws on my bike that would go wear bottle holder would go. i keep my water bottle in my bag at the moment.



Hi, yes bottle cages are usually fitted with allen bolts.  Often bottle cages will come with allen bolts to fit to your frame.  If you haven't got the correct mounting points on your frame you could use something like this:

https://www.decathlon.co.uk/300-universal-cycling-bottle-cage-mount-black-id_8339445.html

You then attach a bottle cage (cost a couple of quid) to the mount.


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## Randomdiabetictype1 (Apr 10, 2018)

HOBIE said:


> What annoys me is a Cycle lane that some cyclists don't use ? The council spend & they want to use the road ?


Sometimes cycle paths may be in the wrong direction in tending to travel. Like there's shared path on a pavement near me and it's just annoying as i was soon go right and not left/straight and also  when school kids are out. Pavements really do become annoying and cycle paths not everyone use as there's too many hazards in them since there right by the gutter.


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## Randomdiabetictype1 (Apr 10, 2018)

Matt Cycle said:


> Hi, yes bottle cages are usually fitted with allen bolts.  Often bottle cages will come with allen bolts to fit to your frame.  If you haven't got the correct mounting points on your frame you could use something like this:
> 
> https://www.decathlon.co.uk/300-universal-cycling-bottle-cage-mount-black-id_8339445.html
> 
> You then attach a bottle cage (cost a couple of quid) to the mount.


thanks


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## HOBIE (Apr 10, 2018)

I have cycled all over the country. Driven all over the country & Europe. There are ways to get where you want. Been to Asia on a Motorbike. Its not worth the risk ? When I see a cycle lane & cyclists not using them & being on a main road ????


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## Radders (Apr 10, 2018)

HOBIE said:


> I have cycled all over the country. Driven all over the country & Europe. There are ways to get where you want. Been to Asia on a Motorbike. Its not worth the risk ? When I see a cycle lane & cyclists not using them & being on a main road ????


We all weigh up risks, and sometimes it’s more risky on the cycle path. I think a few people have made this point.


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## HOBIE (Apr 10, 2018)

Where I live now the council made a cycle lane (more than a mile). When I see Two cyclists riding two abreast on that 60mph road I cringe for there safety. I know where I would be ?


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## TrevA (Apr 10, 2018)

Reasons why I often don't use cycles lanes/paths:

The council build them but don't maintain them. So you get small stones, bits of trees, broken glass, etc on them over time. They really need to be swept every so often. Car tyres do a very good job of sweeping the roads clean so which do you choose - the nice smooth Tarmac road, or the gravelly, twig and glass infested cyclepath/lane?

Many of them are sub-standard and some are downright dangerous. They aren't wide enough, they cross from one side of the road to the other and back again for no apparent reason. They are often just converted pavements and often shared with pedestrians which means that you have to ride very slowly and give way to the pedestrians.

You lose priority over side roads and entrances. Again, this means that you have to keep slowing down or stopping, whereas on the road you retain priority over side roads.

So the council builds a sub standard farcility and we are  expected to use it, whatever? No thanks, I'll take my chances on the road. I've been cycling for 45 years, done close on 200,000 miles on my bike and have only been knocked off once.


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## RichardA (Apr 12, 2018)

> The council build them but don't maintain them


They only build them to get “brownie points” most of the time they are disgrace with weeds pocking up through the poorly made path after a few months of use.
I have been told off from “plod” that there is a maximum 10mph on a mixed cycle/peds path, I'm not too sure if this is law or not.


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## Chris Hobson (Apr 12, 2018)

I had a van pull out of a side road on me yesterday. It was very early in the morning and a sort of half dark damp overcast day. I had a bright yellow top on and twin re-chargeable lights that are like searchlights. Fortunately I was going slightly uphill so not riding very fast and my road positioning was good so I managed to avoid getting hit.


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## Radders (Apr 13, 2018)

RichardA said:


> They only build them to get “brownie points” most of the time they are disgrace with weeds pocking up through the poorly made path after a few months of use.
> I have been told off from “plod” that there is a maximum 10mph on a mixed cycle/peds path, I'm not too sure if this is law or not.


I doubt it, but there probably should be. That includes runners! A friend of mine was stopped and given an on the spot fine for not wearing a cycle helmet! He was very surprised when he found out there is no such law but wouldn’t be persuaded to put in a complaint. Makes me wonder if he wasn’t doing something else he didn’t tell us about. On the other hand it does illustrate that the constabulary sometimes aren’t as all knowing as we might expect!


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## Matt Cycle (Apr 13, 2018)

RichardA said:


> They only build them to get “brownie points” most of the time they are disgrace with weeds pocking up through the poorly made path after a few months of use.
> I have been told off from “plod” that there is a maximum 10mph on a mixed cycle/peds path, I'm not too sure if this is law or not.



No, more made up b*****ks from Britain's finest.  As bikes are not required to have speedometers how are people supposed to know how fast they are going?  Although cyclists have to abide by the law e.g. stopping at red lights, riding on pavements etc according to the highway code on public highways speed limits don't apply to bikes only motor vehicles.  In reality how many cyclists are going to break the speed limit anyway?  A DoT code of conduct for cycling and walking stated that for cycle paths if you wish to ride over 18mph consider using the road but this isn't law.  Royal Parks are an exception where cycle speed limits can be applied and in theory local laws could also be created and enforced.  Be careful out there as there's the 150 odd year old law of 'riding furiously', yes seriously!


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## RichardA (Apr 13, 2018)

Bornemouth Shore Road the council think otherwise........


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## Matt Cycle (Apr 13, 2018)

RichardA said:


> Bornemouth Shore Road the council think otherwise........
> 
> View attachment 7965



Ah, that will be a byelaw created by the council as in the local laws I mentioned above.  Just found this:

http://www.bournemouthecho.co.uk/ne...ng_on_the_seafront_to_be_restricted_all_year/

It states the law is self-regulated although the seafront rangers can enforce it presumably if they get bored of collecting deckchairs.  I'm still not sure how they could prove what speed you were doing.  In general most people would ride to the conditions.  It was busy then take it steady.  Quieter then go a bit quicker.

Any other shared cycle lanes without applicable byelaws then it's no limit although people should be considerate of others. 

I always go on the roads anyway.


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## HOBIE (Apr 14, 2018)

Matt Cycle said:


> No, more made up b*****ks from Britain's finest.  As bikes are not required to have speedometers how are people supposed to know how fast they are going?  Although cyclists have to abide by the law e.g. stopping at red lights, riding on pavements etc according to the highway code on public highways speed limits don't apply to bikes only motor vehicles.  In reality how many cyclists are going to break the speed limit anyway?  A DoT code of conduct for cycling and walking stated that for cycle paths if you wish to ride over 18mph consider using the road but this isn't law.  Royal Parks are an exception where cycle speed limits can be applied and in theory local laws could also be created and enforced.  Be careful out there as there's the 150 odd year old law of 'riding furiously', yes seriously!


Might go out for a "Furious" ride this weekend


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