# Petrol madness!



## Pumper_Sue (Mar 29, 2012)

After doing the weekly shoping run with Mum and then doing my own shopping, in my wisdom thought I would buy petrol as normal.
Panic buying at the pumps was an understatement, cars lined up for quite a distance and people actually squareing up to each other at the pumps 

Needless to say I didn't stop just went on towards home and pulled into the small village petrol station. This bright chap had decided enough was enough, he had his wife working the switches inside and no self service was allowed.
The most he would serve was ?20's worth to each customer.
Which was fine by me as that' was all I wanted


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## Northerner (Mar 29, 2012)

I blame the government!


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## J.Y.Kelly (Mar 29, 2012)

Northerner said:


> I blame the government!



So do I. I believe they are trying to turn the public against the tanker drivers before negotiations even start.
Kelly.


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## ypauly (Mar 30, 2012)

J.Y.Kelly said:


> So do I. I believe they are trying to turn the public against the tanker drivers before negotiations even start.
> Kelly.



Why? The last thing they need is the economy getting disrupted and having bad 1st quarter figures because people couldnt work, they dont win either way as people will always say its thier fault. but to say they want it for some sort of anti union thing is a bit daft.


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## HelenP (Mar 30, 2012)

It's so irritating!  My (naiive, it has to be said, as both put minimal amount of petrol in their cars at the beginning f the week) both only just have enough petrol to get to work and back today, and they both NEED to fill up for next week, especially my youngest who drives 30 miles there and back every day.  They will now have to queue for ages to get the petrol they actually need because people are panic buying - both our local Tesco and Sainsbury garages were sold out and closed yesterday evening - and we don't even know if there IS gonna be a strike yet.

xx


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## FM001 (Mar 30, 2012)

Stupid Francis Maude started the panic buying by opening his big mouth and suggested the public fill their cars up as well as gerry cans, the union has to give 7 days notice if they intend to strike so there's no need to panic.

Two of my local supermarket forecourts are completely dry and queues are forming down the street at the small independent garages.


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## Pumper_Sue (Mar 30, 2012)

Listening to the radio this morning, I do get the impression the presenters are also winding up the motorists by anounceing that !! garage is out and so is xx village/town city and queues are forming all over the place.

As to that prat Maude saying fill jerry cans as well  You can not store a full jerry can(20 ltrs) in your garage anyway it's against the law and also I've been told it invalidates your house ins if you do so.


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## mcdonagh47 (Mar 30, 2012)

toby said:


> Stupid Francis Maude started the panic buying by opening his big mouth and suggested the public fill their cars up as well as gerry cans, the union has to give 7 days notice if they intend to strike so there's no need to panic.
> 
> Two of my local supermarket forecourts are completely dry and queues are forming down the street at the small independent garages.



A news report says a woman in York has suffered 40% burns when the cans she was filling in the kitchen caught fire. I hope Francis Maude is going to send her a bunch of flowers.


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## Pumper_Sue (Mar 30, 2012)

mcdonagh47 said:


> A news report says a woman in York has suffered 40% burns when the cans she was filling in the kitchen caught fire. I hope Francis Maude is going to send her a bunch of flowers.



He may be stupid but, this women takes the biscuit 
Who in their right mind decants petrol near a naked flame in a kitchen?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-york-north-yorkshire-17560534


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## Medusa (Mar 30, 2012)

they are not going to strike anyway....


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## imtrying (Mar 30, 2012)

They have to give 7 days notice to strike...so there's no immediate risk and no need to be panic buying. 

Annoys me a lot as I have to fill my tank every 4 days for work...which is now going to be a nightmare. 

Only positive will be if I can't fill up and can't get to work


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## cherrypie (Mar 30, 2012)

Cannot get any petrol at all unless I am prepared to join a long queue.  I am not so will wait until the panic dies down as I can use my buss pass for longer journeys and my bike for everyday ones.
There is a plus side to being a pensioner when this happens as long as it does not happen and go on long term as there will be limited bus services as well I expect.


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## Steff (Mar 30, 2012)

My nephew had to wait for an hour and got to the front to top his car up to be told you can put no less then ?20 of petrol in your car, if you want less im afraid you need to go elsewhere


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## Ellie Jones (Mar 30, 2012)

Well it's all proof that not only has common sense left the country but what gullible idiots that common sense has been replaced with....  And the Government are so aware of this...  

A hint of a possible 24 hour strike by one union, whose drivers believe that the present working conditions actually compromise health and safety to the extent it puts not only themselves in danger but also the general public...

The impact of a 24 hours strike, would be a blip in supply if that, as they've got to give 7 days notice more than plenty of time for garages to ensure that they've got enough stock to cover local need...  And if Joe Public uses it's common sense and ensures that they keep their tanks at least half full, then no real impact involved...

The Government must have thought all their Christmas had come at once, after all they've got the euro problem, the budget problems, and the 'cost' to dine at 10 downing street saga and in one comment they've averted the whole nations attention on matters that could lead to their downfall to something else...  Which ever way you look at it, it's one hell of a political coo one a scale of a once in a life time coo...

Me I'm sat here, pondering my fuel gauge is on red, I've got my diabetic appointment on Tuesday morning which is a 40 mile round trip, so do need more diesel to get there...  But do I go out searching now or do I wait and use my local garage is a couple of pennies more expensive, whose deliveries are made on a Sunday, due to the hassle involved as the road is closed down for the delivery due to the tanker has to park across the road to while it's transferring the fuel!  I only want about ?20's worth as this last me at least a month..


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## ypauly (Mar 30, 2012)

I have just watched the francis maude interview and Ican't see why all the fuss. The sky interviewer was obviously looking to get a silly quote but on the whole I don't see what maude said that was so wrong.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EYqxBmtOkvM


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## Austin Mini (Mar 30, 2012)

I went to the dentist on Tuesday morning and on the way home dropped into the local Jet station and put ?25 in the tank not realising what was to develope. I was the only customer there. 
During the real fuel crisis of 1973/4, when we were all issued with petrol coupons, we were told that you could NOT store more than two gallons of petrol on your property. Mind you in those days motorists did their own repairs and servicing and wernt like the muppet motorists of today.


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## grainger (Mar 30, 2012)

Personally think it's all madness... I need petrol, but the queues at Morrisons down the road from my house are so hideous I just can't be bothered to join them!

Bought a bike instead... so maybe it's a good thing this panic buying - I'm about to get a lot fitter cycling the few miles to work and back each day!

I do blame the government for even slightly suggesting everyone needed to top up in advance - 7 days notice is plenty and if people don't panic then problems wouldn't arise anyway. I believe some people are probably making extra trips to petrol stations when they don't need their cars much anyway!


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## trophywench (Mar 30, 2012)

Fraid we laughed - we had some 6p off a litre coupons from Tesco's a while ago, and having both cars with pretty well in at the time is was expiring, Pete filled the Motorhome up with diesel instead to take advantage of the offer.  (?80 ish when we do)  And on the basis that although we wereen't going anywhere in it imminently, we would be soon.  And we are.

So we can get there next week; we can use it or our bus passes to get around - and if we can't get home again after Easter - we probably won't care that much, really!  LOL


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## Garthion (Mar 30, 2012)

I wonder how many people realise that it is against the law to transport 2 or more full fuel cans in a motor vehicle? And, as you can only store 2 cans at your property at any one time, why would you need to purchase so many cans?


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## mcdonagh47 (Mar 31, 2012)

Garthion said:


> I wonder how many people realise that it is against the law to transport 2 or more full fuel cans in a motor vehicle? And, as you can only store 2 cans at your property at any one time, why would you need to purchase so many cans?



I bet Francis Maude doesn't know that 

Anyway, there hasn't actually been a panic at all - people reacted calmly and rationally, queuing patiently at filling stations on the basis of advice from Govt Ministers.
OK the advice was bs - playing politics and trying to discredit what looks like a perfectly reasonable Trade Union who are more into negotiation than confrontation on this issue.


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## FM001 (Mar 31, 2012)

Most of the fuel stations where I live have ran dry and awaiting deliveries, the government have ended up with egg on their face yet again by panicking the public unnecessarily.

What is frightening in times like this is our dependence on oil, it's like the whole world would cease to exist when the black stuff runs dry.


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## Northerner (Mar 31, 2012)

toby said:


> Most of the fuel stations where I live have ran dry and awaiting deliveries, the government have ended up with egg on their face yet again by panicking the public unnecessarily.
> 
> What is frightening in times like this is our dependence on oil, it's like the whole world would cease to exist when the black stuff runs dry.



People are far too reliant on their cars these days. Most of my neighbours have cars, usually two if there are two adults in the house, and they never walk anywhere, even if it's just nipping to the shops for a paper (a ten-minute walk). What's more, their kids grow up thinking it's the only way to get around. My Dad didn't buy a car until I was about 17, before that he had a Honda C50 that I wouldn't have been seen dead on!

How do they think people managed without cars in the past? What's really needed is huge investment in public transport so that people are more encouraged to leave their cars at home or even not bother buying them. This worked extremely well in South Yorkshire when fares were frozen in 1974 - everyone used the buses and trains, so there was less traffic and much more regular buses. People could afford to work some distance from home because they knew they could get there easily and cheaply, and you didn't get the rush hour gridlock that plagues most cities these days. Unfortunately, Thatcher deregulated the buses and fares rose 2000% almost overnight, so it became uneconomical for many people. One thing I've never forgiven David Blunkett for is not actively promoting a good public transport policy when Labour got in, since he had been leader of Sheffield City council for many years prior to becoming an MP, and knew how well it all worked.


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## Austin Mini (Mar 31, 2012)

The amount of peps who travel 30-80 miles to work by car every day is beyond belief. Before I retired there was ten peps in the design office who traveled over 50 miles to and home again every day. The most I have ever worked from home is seven miles, easily cycled in the summer. During the war my Mum cycled seven miles to the airfield and home again for dinner. Then she would cycle seven miles to Chippenham and home again every night to dance with the Yanks (?). She told me cycling was fun!!


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## cherrypie (Mar 31, 2012)

Times have changed and people have to go where the work is.  This involves travelling many miles for some and public transport is not reliable as it used to be.
Cycling locally was always the norm when I was growing up but that is not possible anymore because of the long journeys some people have to do daily.

We always cycled everywhere as a family, 7 miles to the beach, 8 miles to Nan's on a Sunday for dinner.   It was the norm but now it is a form of exercise thanks to the car, TV and sedentary lifestyles.  When I was a kid you could play in the street because there were only a couple of cars parked and you could hear one approaching and got out of the way.  There were no streets congested with traffic throughout the day.  The milkman had a horse pulling his buggy before they modernised and used electric floats.  Now you are lucky if you get a milkman, the supermarkets supply the milk.  Tradespeople came to you with deliveries instead of you having to pick items off shelves and do your own packing and transporting of groceries.

I don't think that everyone who queued was desperate for petrol but caught up in the panic spread by the Govt. and Media.  If you rely on your car then you need petrol and with Easter fast approaching some thought they would fill up in case they decided to go anywhere.

I think it is ironic that the Govt. has now relaxed the rules on the hours tanker drivers are permitted to drive so that petrol outlets can replenish their stocks.  This is part of the grievance that drivers have about the hours that they are expected to work.  Most of them have to do a 6 day week and overtime.  Until there is a clear message from the Unions that the strike has been averted then this panic buying will continue IMHO and a shortage will happen.


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## Northerner (Mar 31, 2012)

Whatever happened to the 'leisure society' we were promised in the late '70s, early '80s? 

We do indeed live in different times. People discovered they could live further from where they worked because they could drive there. This, along with the push to become homeowners led to the prices of property being pushed up in formerly cheaper areas as more towns and villages became part of the commuter belt of larger cities. Cars and fuel were cheap, attracting people away from trains, trains stations closed en masse. Trams, trolley buses disappeared, people became more and more reliant on cars and children grew up spoilt by them.

Now we have people unable to manage without their cars, paying huge mortgages and ever-increasing fuel costs - and spending many of their waking hours sitting non-productively in their little tin boxes. When I used to work in town I would walk to work and run home. The shortest route was 2.4 miles door-to-door and the quickest I ever ran it in was 15' 05", yet there was several people 20 or more years younger than me and living on the same street as me who took their cars and would take 45 mins to an hour (or more) to get home. I suspect people in this situation outnumber those who genuinely need a vehicle for a 50-100 mile a day commute - they certainly did where I worked.


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## MeanMom (Mar 31, 2012)

We have never had a car and have no intention of getting one. 

We chose this house because it is close to a bus route but also near a common  and local (small) shops When we moved here OH had a 45min journey to work by bus. He was made redundant from that job so took the first job offered to him which was 30 miles away. Many wouldnt even have applied. It involved a mile walk to the bus stop then two buses which took a couple of hours if he got the 7am there and the 5pm back. If he went later it took longer because of traffic. He managed to get another job closer to home after about 5 years - he still has the mile walk to catch a bus but it is a bus provided by his employer - usually takes about 30mins. 

My daughters school is a 20 min bus ride away (her primary was a 10 min walk)

We have gone on several camping holidays carrying everything on our backs (tent included) 

We go everywhere by foot, bus,train,coach or rarely taxi. Yes, taxis aren't cheap but we only use them if there is no alternative (eg if there is no bus to get anywhere near or if weather too bad to walk) .

My point being it is possible to manage without a car (and it's cheaper if you ask me) -it just takes more plannng, I know public transport can be horrendous , but it's not as bad as people who don't actually use it assume; if more used it then it would get better. IMO


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## Ellie Jones (Mar 31, 2012)

I can never believe the public transport where I live, as it's not very commuter friendly at all and expensive.  So I do have a car because without it you life gets difficult, expensive and long winded...

Take my diabetic appointment on Tuesday, I've got to go over to the main hospital which is 15 miles away for 9.30am...  Now by car it takes 25 minutes to drive there, so my time out of the house will be around 2 hours including the appointment...  But if I go on Public Transport which I have two options, bus or train..

If I go by train, 

Walk to station 15 minutes
Train time..    8.08
Return train   11.04
Walk home    15 minutes

Total time, 3 hrs 42 minutes

Cost, ?6.20 x 2 return tickets ?12.40(assuming that trains are on time, not cancelled and clinic is on time.. next train after is 12.07)

If I go by Bus

30 minute walk to bus station
Bus 7.55
return bus 11.40
Walk home 30 minutes

Total time 4 hours 45 minutes (again assuming that clinic isn't late and I don't miss the home bus, next bus an hour wait)

Cost ?7 X2 return tickets ?14.00

If I take my car,

Leave home 8.50

Arrive home around 10am depending on appointment finishes..

Cost, diesel ?2.50
Parking        ? 1.30 

So which one do you think I will be opting for on Tuesday?

But it's like most things here...  Using public transport isn't only time consuming but expensive compared to using your car..  It take me 10-15 minutes to drive to my doctors, well over an hour to walk, by bus would have to use two buses changing at the bus station which is out of my way..  Taxi would cost over ?10...

Shopping well, you can only carry so much even using a bus, which would cost about ?3.50 to get home, a Taxi is over a ?5'er depending on traffic..

And if I need to get either of the dogs to the vets, I'm stumped bus's won't always allow Ellie on the bus, and only a few taxi's will take animals and charge extra ?10 if they do..  And the Vets is further way than my doctors..


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## MeanMom (Mar 31, 2012)

But EJ you haven't factored in the original cost of buying the car, insuring it , tax, repairs, ...
There is no way we can afford (or want) to spend thousands of pounds initial outlay(including the cost of lessons if I wanted to drive - S'pose OH would need refreshers after 25 years 'off the road') Don't expect K will ever bother to learn even if her eye sight get fixed enough) with the DLA being so mean to diabetics


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## Northerner (Mar 31, 2012)

MeanMom said:


> But EJ you haven't factored in the original cost of buying the car, insuring it , tax, repairs, ...
> There is no way we can afford (or want) to spend thousands of pounds initial outlay(including the cost of lessons if I wanted to drive - S'pose OH would need refreshers after 25 years 'off the road') Don't expect K will ever bother to learn even if her eye sight get fixed enough) with the DLA being so mean to diabetics


 
There was a thing on TV ages ago on this very topic - they compared the cost of buying and running a car as opposed to making journeys by the most appropriate form of alternate transport (i.e. bus/train if convenient or taxis if not, or on foot, bicycle if possible for short journeys). The cost of the car far outweighed the perceived 'extra' costs of using occasional taxis on those occasions where absolutely necessary. I must admit that, when my employers in Sheffield moved right over to the other side of town and into Derbyshire I found it difficult as I had to catch two buses in the morning then walk a mile, and there was only one bus for part of the route that would get me to work on time. On the way home I would run the mile, catch a tram then run the remaining 3 miles from the town centre. I didn't leave because of the commute, but because I got fed up with the company.

I think that, to a large extent, it is what you are used to. I can read on long (or short!) bus or train journeys, don't have to worry about finding somewhere to park, and don't have to deal personally with all the dreadful drivers around.  I imagine a car is easier and maybe less expensive if you have several of you using it e.g. a family with small children etc. but me and my sister survived quite well!


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## cherrypie (Mar 31, 2012)

I am seriously thinking of getting rid of my car next year.  It has recently been taxed, insured and MOT's so will rethink this next year.  This panic buying saga has made me reassess my need.  I have a free bus pass and a rail card so will not pay as much as most would do on public transport.

I am luckier than most that I do not need it for work which would have meant an impossible journey on public transport unless I was prepared to travel for 2 -3 hours each way.  I did do car sharing for the journey so it was not too bad with 3 of us involved.

Now that I am on my own I really am thinking seriously.  My son says that I should not even consider it unless I am in bad health because he always feels that I am a good driver.  He forgets that there are some bad drivers out there of all age groups.  It is the cost off keeping it on the road that is the main worry and cars do not get any younger do they?  I would hate to think of all this money I have spent in the past and am spending on it yearly and then having to buy another one later.
Taxis are a luxury but there are times when I do use one and I think that when I remember that the working man never even considered a taxi years ago, it reminds me how times have changed.

Walking and cycling are an every day occurrence for me and the car is only used when it has to be so is it a luxury that I do not need?

My great grandsons come on the train and bus with me as a treat as they are ferried everywhere by car for convenience and time factors with both parents having to work.  The family unit has dispersed as it used to be that families were local and helped each other out.  There would not have been so many journeys with extended families helping each other with transport and childcare. 

Is this modern world better or worse?  All the stress and chronic conditions that are happening to the population makes me wonder.


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## Ellie Jones (Mar 31, 2012)

But even if I factored in the costs of running and maintaining a car,  if I add on what it cost per day for my insurance 0.75p and car tax 0.63p. MOT/service which has to be rounded up to a 1p a day...  Still not getting any near to the cost of public transport...   

Now if I use the costs of my last car, which I had for 8 years spent ?500 in repair/maintenance and cost me ?4000 to buy and tag that on to the car I've got now it's replacement brought from the insurance (last car written of in accident) it works out about 150p a day..

So another ?2.59

So a total ?6.39 

But what needs to be remembered is it assumes that I'm only completing one journey on that day...  If I make another journey then the daily cost of my car sitting on my drive will need to be divided between journey's made...

I live in a country town, not a city where regular time tables means buses every 15 mins or so, here regular mean every hour between 9-5 and sod all after 5


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## cherrypie (Mar 31, 2012)

Now ambulances are having to join queues for petrol, putting lives at risk. 

If, as the article says, emergency rationing could be brought in force within 24 hours then that may be the solution.  If people carry on panic buying then we will all be without fuel as stocks cannot be replenished quickly enough.  What a mess!!!!!
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/en...s-999-crews-struggle-to-get-hold-of-fuel.html


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## Northerner (Mar 31, 2012)

I think it's fair enough to see that not everyone could manage without a car, but there are certainly many people who believe they depend on them that don't, or who make many journeys they don't need to. Again, I would cite some of my neighbours who travelled exactly the same distance as me, did practically the same job in the same building, but chose instead to spend long hours in traffic and thousands of pounds in parking fees rather than use their legs.


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## ypauly (Mar 31, 2012)

Northerner said:


> I think it's fair enough to see that not everyone could manage without a car, but there are certainly many people who believe they depend on them that don't, or who make many journeys they don't need to. Again, I would cite some of my neighbours who travelled exactly the same distance as me, did practically the same job in the same building, but chose instead to spend long hours in traffic and thousands of pounds in parking fees rather than use their legs.



Part of this problem has been town planning. The last 20-30 years has seen a massive rise in out of town shopping malls, garden centres, cinemas and pretty much anything else you can name. Here in birmingham all the public transport is centred around city centre travel yet the last time I went there was for the diabetes meet. Most people just don't bother with public transport because it's not going to the same place as they are.  It is the same with industrial units, I work in an area called minworth and until a few years ago it was a sleepy village about 7 miles from birminghams centre with a sewerage works and an asda there and not much else, now there are many many new industrial estates and virtually no public transport to get there. The shifts I work mean I would have a two mile walk at minimum.

I dread losing my licence as it will undoubtedly mean a pushbike lol


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## Northerner (Mar 31, 2012)

ypauly said:


> Part of this problem has been town planning. The last 20-30 years has seen a massive rise in out of town shopping malls, garden centres, cinemas and pretty much anything else you can name. Here in birmingham all the public transport is centred around city centre travel yet the last time I went there was for the diabetes meet. Most people just don't bother with public transport because it's not going to the same place as they are.  It is the same with industrial units, I work in an area called minworth and until a few years ago it was a sleepy village about 7 miles from birminghams centre with a sewerage works and an asda there and not much else, now there are many many new industrial estates and virtually no public transport to get there. The shifts I work mean I would have a two mile walk at minimum.
> 
> I dread losing my licence as it will undoubtedly mean a pushbike lol



I agree Paul, but in Sheffield with the subsidised public transport you actually could get to where you wanted to go. The transport was subsidised from the rates, but there was no reduction in rates when deregulation came, just a reduction is services and a massive hike in prices, with companies now competing on popular routes and dropping the less profitable ones. It's got to happen one day that people go back to public transport, but they won't do it until it can work practically for them and that needs vision and investment which are lacking in our car-centred society.


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