# ketones when ill?



## tracey w (Sep 17, 2010)

I dont feel great today, very sore throat 

BG in normal range but feel  a bit nauseous.  Tested ketones and 0.3, I know this is not high, but my brain doesnt seem to be functioning properly today.

I know why we get ketones when the bg is high (acid caused by breakdown of fat for fuel as not enough insulin to get glucose into system), and can lead to DKA, but why do we get ketones when ill and bg in normal range? Can anyone shed some light please? 

All I can think of is that body not utilising insulin properly as its ill and although its there its not able to get the glucose out for fuel so breaks down fats? I have no idea what im talking about


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## novorapidboi26 (Sep 17, 2010)

I am not entirely sure myself, but is 0.3 not equivilant to a trace from the ketostix...............

When ill your body stimulates release of glucose to help fight off the illness at molecular level......usually this will be from the liver stores, muscles etc....but may need to break some fat down if stocks are low.......

I am sure I read somewhere that ketones (possible different varieties) occurr naturally and are food for the brain....................

Hope someone else has the answer........


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## Caroline (Sep 17, 2010)

I'd agree that ketones are more likely to happen when inslin is not being used properly, although I have also been told that as a type 2 because I produce some insulin I'm less likely to get ketones, so perhaps it has something to do with the functioning or of the pancreas.

I hope you feel better soon. If it's any consolation inmy office there are several of us with hacking coughs and my manager went home early yesterday because she wasn't well.

Advice given to me was drink plenty, especially water, try and eat as it helps meds work and if necessary seep. It works slightly differently for everyone, and I'm sure some one more kowledegebl than me will be along soon.


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## tracey w (Sep 17, 2010)

Thanks for your replies. Am drinking plenty of water at the moment.

Just intrigued me as although only trace, why it happens as my bg is normal?


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## Caroline (Sep 17, 2010)

Not an expert, but perhaps if we all knew it as a natural level we have a trace? A trace is too low to make us ill. Perhaps DSN or doctor can explain it?


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## Northerner (Sep 17, 2010)

tracey w said:


> Thanks for your replies. Am drinking plenty of water at the moment.
> 
> Just intrigued me as although only trace, why it happens as my bg is normal?



Hi Tracey, ketones are also produced by a process known as ketosis. Ketones are formed a s a by-product of fat-utilisation as an energy source, so it may be that, if you are not eating well, that your body is using some of your fat stores to help fuel your body. This is perfectly natural and is also what happens when we lower our calorie intake to try and lose weight. The Atkins-style diets are particularly notorious for producing large amounts of ketones due to their dependence on fat as an energy source, and very low carbohydrate.

Ketones are only a problem if they are allowed to build up in the blood - too high a level and this then becomes ketoacidosis/DKA. The body can normally expel or process ketones, but only if there is an adequate supply of insulin available, as this is necessary to the process. Ketones will also be flushed through the kidneys and even the breath (hence the pear drop smell). So, ketones are only a big problem if the person hasn't got sufficient, or any, insulin circulating. Lack of insulin is also indicated by high BG levels - so if you have high BG AND ketones, this is when they can be dangerous and need extra insulin.

If yours remain at very low levels then it should be nothing to worry about, and you can increase your insulin to counteract them should they climb too high.


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## tracey w (Sep 17, 2010)

Northerner said:


> Hi Tracey, ketones are also produced by a process known as ketosis. Ketones are formed a s a by-product of fat-utilisation as an energy source, so it may be that, if you are not eating well, that your body is using some of your fat stores to help fuel your body. This is perfectly natural and is also what happens when we lower our calorie intake to try and lose weight. The Atkins-style diets are particularly notorious for producing large amounts of ketones due to their dependence on fat as an energy source, and very low carbohydrate.
> 
> Ketones are only a problem if they are allowed to build up in the blood - too high a level and this then becomes ketoacidosis/DKA. The body can normally expel or process ketones, but only if there is an adequate supply of insulin available, as this is necessary to the process. Ketones will also be flushed through the kidneys and even the breath (hence the pear drop smell). So, ketones are only a big problem if the person hasn't got sufficient, or any, insulin circulating. Lack of insulin is also indicated by high BG levels - so if you have high BG AND ketones, this is when they can be dangerous and need extra insulin.
> 
> If yours remain at very low levels then it should be nothing to worry about, and you can increase your insulin to counteract them should they climb too high.



Thanks Northe, makes perfect sense when you explain it!

I am trying to loose weight (have lost 6lbs ), but am not doing atkins or anything similar. Just being healthy and plenty of exercise. So i presume because my levels are normal its just my bodies way of coping with the weight loss? And nothing to worry about?  So you are saying ketones at a low level (with plenty of insulin circulating, of course), is normal and nothing to worry about?

Thanks I feel much better already. When things happen I just have to know why!


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## Steff (Sep 17, 2010)

Tracey hun sorry your feeling under the weather sweet xxx


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## Northerner (Sep 17, 2010)

tracey w said:


> Thanks Northe, makes perfect sense when you explain it!
> 
> I am trying to loose weight (have lost 6lbs ), but am not doing atkins or anything similar. Just being healthy and plenty of exercise. So i presume because my levels are normal its just my bodies way of coping with the weight loss? And nothing to worry about?  So you are saying ketones at a low level (with plenty of insulin circulating, of course), is normal and nothing to worry about?
> 
> Thanks I feel much better already. When things happen I just have to know why!



Yup! Just the weight melting away!  Incidentally, I remember reading years and years ago that the 'Wall' that a marathon runner experiences is when the available stores of glucose have been exhausted and the body switches to using fat stores. The fitter you are, the later and less intense this is, and for the top runners isn't experienced until the end of the race, or possibly not at all. Not that they carry much in the way of fat, mind you!


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## tracey w (Sep 17, 2010)

Northerner said:


> Yup! Just the weight melting away!  Incidentally, I remember reading years and years ago that the 'Wall' that a marathon runner experiences is when the available stores of glucose have been exhausted and the body switches to using fat stores. The fitter you are, the later and less intense this is, and for the top runners isn't experienced until the end of the race, or possibly not at all. Not that they carry much in the way of fat, mind you!



I dont think Ive been hitting any walls during my exercise regime Northe! But like the sound of my fat melting away because of it!   I feel confident that it is nothing to do with me feeling under the weather. Thing is I only tested because I dont feel well, probably happening all the time when we are trying to loose weight.


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