# Think I'll get a negative vib from Diabetic Team



## hawalkden (Sep 7, 2010)

I have another Diabetic Consultant Appointment next week and my OH is coming with me this time as we want to emphasise our decision for trying for a baby and to be put onto the Pre-Pregnancy Clinic. We planned to try at the beginning of February but would love to start ASAP but cant really due to my Diabetes. 

Also after the year we?ve had I don?t want to have a horrid time in hospital while expecting. I was put into a Medical Coma in February due to DKA and I was ventilated for a week and then in for a month due to a blood clot. I was very poorly to be honest and we put planning a baby on hold until my blood clot went. That has gone and we?re waiting for results about being on Warfarin forever. My medical health doesn?t seem to be getting better. My only worry for next week is my Diabetic Consultant who is the Diabetic Midwife to which is a bonus. 

I know I have to have my HBA1C under 7%! Which I know it won?t be when I get my results back tomorrow and I?m trying so much to get it down. I just don?t want them to make me wait till the bloods are ?right? as I see Diabetes is never going to be ?perfect? for anyone, they are all different and even more so for females who want to become pregnant I don?t think anytime is the right time.

I have a little bit of selfishness inside of me to just try even if they say don?t try till when ever or you?ve got to go onto the Pre-Pregnancy Clinic. I know it could be the wrong choice and there probably be more complications during the pregnancy I just cant wait any longer and I just want to try now like every ?normal? female can, who don?t have complications!


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## Twitchy (Sep 7, 2010)

Hiya...

It's a bugger being a diabetic, isn't it?!  I can relate to how frustrated you feel... it took us 2 years both times to get the BGs straight & HbA1c in the zone before trying to conceive.  I would however really, really encourage you to stick with trying to get things straight first!  Pregnancy makes control even harder than normal  so the better your control is before, the better chance you have of keeping on top of things...

I know it feels like you are waiting forever, but it is soooo worth it - think of it like a house's foundations, except this is your son or daughter's health - sorry to be blunt, but that's the truth of it.  Although people do fall pregnant with higher than ideal HbA1cs, there are real and significant risks of congenital defects, miscarriage, etc - and a diabetic pregnancy is stressful enough as it is, trust me!   I honestly don't mean to lecture, but for your own sake, take the time you need to get ready - it will be worth it. 

All the best,

Twitchy x


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## bev (Sep 7, 2010)

Twitchy said:


> Hiya...
> 
> It's a bugger being a diabetic, isn't it?!  I can relate to how frustrated you feel... it took us 2 years both times to get the BGs straight & HbA1c in the zone before trying to conceive.  I would however really, really encourage you to stick with trying to get things straight first!  Pregnancy makes control even harder than normal  so the better your control is before, the better chance you have of keeping on top of things...
> 
> ...



Twitchy, you are very wise. I think everything you have said is spot-on and although I have no experience of a high risk pregnancy - I would imagine that the worry factor alone is enough to put you off - so getting one's body in tip-top condition is paramount for the health and well-bing of the growing baby and of course the mum.I know it must be awful to feel that you are waiting and waiting - but if you have a healthy happy baby at the end of it then thats all that matters.Bev


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## bex123 (Sep 8, 2010)

hiya , i can only give u the advice plz do all in your power to get good control! i had a very simmilar expereance as you and had my first child at 19 , been type 1 since i was 7 , any way long story short , we tried for a baby with a hba1 of 12 , i was uneducated and didnt know any better and had a poor diabeties team that offered me no advice (thankfully now i have an amazing team ) , i suffered 4 misscarages before i fell pregnant with my first son , i had an increadably hard pregnancy and kept on going into early labour ( started at 28 weeks) i had him premature at 35 weeks at 8lb 1oz and he was hypo on delivery , he had feeding problems and couldnt latch on or use a bottle , he spent 4 days in the nucu unit in an incubator , and suffered 2 weeks of jaundice (caused by his tiny liver kicking in and recovering the hypo) thankfully he is now a happy and healthy 9 yr old ,and i thank god he is here at all , my second pregnancy was much better , better control but still a higher than recomended hba1 he was also premature at 36 weeks and 7lb 1oz and is blind in is right eye (due to his optic nerve not developing in time) 

this is my little horror story and i hope any one thinking of trying for a baby will read and realise the inportance of good control , i was very lucky and so were my children , please be aware of what your health is doing before you start tring to create another life


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## PhoebeC (Sep 8, 2010)

You must really try your best to sort out your health as well as you can.

Im 17 weeks, and its been bloody hard. My hba1c has always been close to 7 for years. I have never had any bad issues with my diabetes. Our baby wasnt planned. But because i have been so lucky with my diabetes they werent worried about me. My hba1c is now 6, which is how it should be when pregnant.

'Normal' women who are very healthy can have a horrid time to.

You really dont want to cuase any issues with your own or your childs health. Pregnancy for diabetics is risky for mums too not just baby. And if your not well afterwards how can you look after a child.

I dont want to be mean but this is a little life that you have to protect and look after from before you concive, i wish we had planned. The guilt that i didnt get my body 100% ready is horrid, and im a lucky one.


xxx


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## Akasha (Sep 9, 2010)

Im the same as you, Hawalkden. My partner and i have discused children, and said I want one now, not 3 years time, NOW! 
Be as selfish as you want, but bear in mind you have to factor in things aswell as the diabetes. like Finance and property. 
Although im not pregnant, Im working with my team now to get my sugars level so when we do start trying, It wont be so long. 
Im sure that if you try to sort your levels out and they can see, they wont penalize you for it.

Good luck


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## Twitchy (Sep 9, 2010)

I've been thinking about this thread off & on for a few days now... I'd just like to detail my experience, in case that helps...

I took on board my consultant's advice, and made sure my HbA1c was at the target level and I was on the high dose of folic acid before trying to conceive.  It took around 2 years both times to get the levels 'in the zone' and I'll admit, was an extremely frustrating wait.

First time round, after I conceived, BGs weren't too awful at first, and I immediately notified my diabetic team & GP.  I did have some cramps at around 6wks, but no bleeding.  At about 11 wks we were at diabetic antenatal clinic when we met our obstetrics consultant for the first time - his comment was something like "well lets do a scan & see if there's anything alive in there shall we?" ... bearing in mind that was WITH good control & planning - hubby's & my jaws dropped to the floor.  However he scanned, and we saw our baby, a little peanut in there .  Things continued, I had morning sickness on & off, dawn phenomenon and so feeling ill most of the time & up at 3am every day was exhausting - not the healthy, blooming pregnancy I'd envied in my friends! From relatively early on it was clear that my bump was big - I had excess fluid, quite common for diabetics.  From almost day 1 I was also being told to expect a C section - when I challenged this (fresh from my nct brainwashing lol!) I was told the idea was to have a controlled, safe birth, preferably with a live baby & mum as an end result!   Erm... fair point doc...

From early on in the 3rd Tri, I noticed the weight was piling on - but it was fluid... face, hands, feet... I ended up being admitted with severe pre-eclampsia at 33 wks and told baby might have to be born at any time from then... and that his lungs would be about 2 weeks behind the maturity of a 'normal' baby... ie the risks to both of us were high.  Doc even asked hubby which of us to save if it came to it... yikes!!! In the event, they managed to stabilise me enough to get another week or so further along, & baby was born at 34w 5d, by 'semi-elective' emergency c secion.  I didn't get to see him for long after the birth, he was whisked up to the scbu, where he was in an incubator, on a nose tube & being checked because he had a shadow on his lungs.  He had severe jaundice & needed phototherapy for a week & half, during which time he had to stay in the incubator, under the lamps - I couldn't pick him up to cuddle him when he cried, or comfort him by holding him.  This was a planned pregnancy with good control remember...

Second time around was better, again carefully planned etc... this time we got to 35 weeks before the placenta failed and baby had to make an early appearance.  This time we got lucky and although her sugar levels did drop, and she did have a bit of difficulty breathing, most of the time she could be with me, she was better able to feed 'normally' and has generally been a much more robust baby.

I'm not trying to scare any diabetics out there who want babys... and to put this in context I'd already had diabetes 28 yrs by baby number 1... but what I'm trying to say is that unfortunately for us diabetics, it just isn't as simple as other mums... I now have quite a few diabetic mum friends and their experiences have all been similar in that the pregnancies have been more medical, often more complicated than 'normal' and the births by & large about as far from the perceived nct ideal as you can get!   The thing is, with careful planning & a lot of hard work you CAN have a healthy baby... but as some of the ladies on this forum have been kind & brave enough to share, if the levels aren't right, the consequences can be devastating.  It's NOT fair, and it's horrible having to plan something so carefully that should be so natural, but on the plus side, when I was diagnosed in '78 my dad thought I'd never be able to have my own babies... at least that isn't the case. 

I do hope you don't feel we've been telling you off or anything, I don't think that's the case - I'm sure we can all relate to your frustrations having to wait (I know I can!) and we just don't want you to rush into something & really regret it later... I am really sure with the support of your diabetic team you will get your levels right a lot sooner than you think possible, and sooner than you think will be on the way!

Wishing you the very best of luck with this, and sending you a big hug ((()))!

Twitchy xx


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## Akasha (Sep 9, 2010)

Thank you for sharing that twitchy, A real eye opener. 

When i was diagnosed 6 years ago, i convinced myself that i didnt want children anyway. that i had to concentrate on looking after me. 
After 2 1/2 years with my partner we decided that we can and will (partner also diabetic). 
I was told by my team that with my Hba1c of 7.6 it wouldnt be overly concerning if i started trying now.  
When it comes to the idea of children, i do get conflicting thoughts. A child of my own flesh and blood, but also how selfish to want a child, and all the hell that goes with the 9 months. 
I myself wanted to get my levels sorted before trying, for my own peice of mind.


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## bev (Sep 9, 2010)

http://www.diabetessupport.co.uk/boards/showthread.php?t=192

The thread above is probably an extreme case, but I think it does serve to show just how high risk a pregnancy can be - never mind throwing diabetes into the mix.Bev


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## Copepod (Sep 9, 2010)

I'd like to speak personally - about the positive effects of not having children. This is what works for me - no reason why it's right for anyone else. To explain my history - 
In my 20s, I said to myself that if I didn't have any children by the time I was 30, I wouldn't; I never found a suitable partner, so didn't have any (mainly thinking about being young enough to continue to enjoy life when they grew up).
Within 6 months of turning 30, I developed type 1 diabetes, and must admit, along with being pretty pissed off at effectively losing use of Marine Biology degree, possibility of remaining in New Zealand (as work permit ended), having to return to UK, unable to rejoin TA (which I left, hoping to emigrate) etc, I also thought no bloke would be interested in me.
within a couple of years of diagnosis, I had led an expedition to Costa Rica, plus travelled alone round Dominican Republic, mountains of Mallorca etc, gained MSc and started a short term work contract (Jan 1999)
Within a couple of months of starting that contract, it was extended to another part of the organisation, where I met a bloke - initially I thought he was just spending time in the room where I worked because it was air conditioned to protect the computers, but he asked me out kayaking, and we're still together in Sept 2010. As he spends several months each year in Antarctica, even conceiving, let alone raising, children would be a challenge. However, we both thoroughly enjoy "borrowing" friends' and relatives' children - and the parents seem to think we look after / entertain the children OK. I also run activity birthday parties for children, something that none of the parents who work at the park want to do.

Of course, none of this is a substitute for having one's own children, but I feel it's worth explaining how we do things in a different way.


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## bigpurpleduck (Sep 9, 2010)

I'm slightly terrified about having children now 

Twitchy - if you don't mind me asking, what was your A1c during your pregnancies?


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## Twitchy (Sep 10, 2010)

Don't be terrified!  Just be really prepared for a lot of hard work, and nothing like the nct will brain wash you into thinking is 'normal'! 

My HbA1c s before conceiving were 6.5% and 6.8% (I think, from memory...I got told different levels were acceptable each time lol!).  

During pregnancy it varied around 6% ish, the best in the second preg being 5.7% - at which point the numpty doc told me off because "obviously" I "must be going hypo all the time"!!  Stupid doc...!!!!  I can't remember what my best during the first preg was, but during both pregnancies the good doc (the experienced consultant!) described my control with positive superlatives... 

I should point out that the longer you've had diabetes, the more chance of problems - I had been diabetic 28yrs first time round and 31 yrs the second time... so that's a factor too... but don't lose heart, the pre eclampsia I had first time round affects 10% of mums (admittedly not all to that extent, that's more like 1%, I'm special lol!).  From the mums I know, typical 'complications' with good control are early delivery (generally by c section, but depends on the hospital to a large extent), bigish baby for dates, and excess fluid.  All of us found breast feeding hard too, possibly due to the birth method or baby being given formula for hypos...

What I'm trying to say (waffling, sorry!!), is it can be done, don't panic!  Just needs a lot more care & work than 'normal' mums & you will probably feel better about the whole thing if you can come to terms with the likelihood that it won't be such an 'earth mother' type of experience as your friends might get


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## PhoebeC (Sep 10, 2010)

Twitchy said:


> What I'm trying to say (waffling, sorry!!), is it can be done, don't panic!  Just needs a lot more care & work than 'normal' mums & you will probably feel better about the whole thing if you can come to terms with the likelihood that it won't be such an 'earth mother' type of experience as your friends might get



Which is why you need to try your best before you have a baby in your belly to be as ready as you possibly can be.
Its hard work, people tell me i look like im blooming but i dont feel it. 
I have to take it day my day and its really hard work, Its not flying by like people say it does.
If its not hypos or sickness, its backahce or being so tired you dont want to move. 

I dont know how after all this i will be able to look after a baby, its like a 9 month work out with a big ending that is stressful for everybody then no rest because you have a tiny person to look after.

I am scared about the issues i will have towards the end because we didnt plan, They say im doing great now and are really happy with me but still its worrying.

xxx


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## hawalkden (Sep 11, 2010)

I?m feeling so frustrated at the moment. I just don?t want to even think about children anymore. I?ve had enough of my Diabetes already and only been diagnosed a year last march. 
I went into hospital with DKA and was in CCU for a week ventilated. I?m trying to control my bloods but I?m sick of not having or doing the ?normal? things everyone else can do and yeah people can reply to this saying stop being selfish but I?m sick of it.
I have a consultant appointment next week and I want to tell them I want to be on the Pre-Pregnancy Clinic but they?ll probably refuse and make me wait to get my HBa1C down, also make me have my bloods given before anything, which they know I cant do. My veins just shut down and refuse! So I just get more frustrated.  
Sorry I?m just at my wits end and envy every female who has a ?normal? pregnancy! I cant see myself being/feeling so horrid in and out of hospital and all the check ups in the 1st part. 
I think that adoption is the best option for me at the moment and think about other children who need our help and not being selfish for wanting to have a child so much. 
Hope I don?t seen to bitchy or selfish with my response but I just cant take any more of this!


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## Twitchy (Sep 12, 2010)

Hiya...

Just wanted to say don't lose heart - coming to terms with diabetes is a massive thing to do, and it sounds like you have had so much to deal with in the past year already.  I don't think your response is selfish - I think it's perfectly natural to feel frustrated at not being able to have what so many 'normal' people seem to be able to take for granted... diabetes can seem to present so many more challenges that we just don't ask for! 

The good thing is, with the right support, if it's what you want to do, you can have your own kids.  I really don't enjoy having bloods done and there is a lot of that when you're pregnant, but trust me, once you know that little life is in you, everything else becomes less important.  My scary first birth experience didn't put me off going for baby number too, and I will forever be grateful that I had the support of our obstetric consultant in making that decision - speak to your team if this is what you want, get them to help you.  Is your pre-pregnancy clinic geared up in order to help ladies get ready to try to conceive?  If so, it actually sounds ideal for your situation... if not, I'd let your diabetes team know you want to start a family and are asking for their support to 'get ready' as it were.  If they are a good team, they will be glad you've asked for help and will be keen to give it hopefully! 

Whatever you decide, take your time and look after yourself. xx


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## bigpurpleduck (Sep 12, 2010)

hawalkden said:


> Sorry I’m just at my wits end and envy every female who has a ‘normal’ pregnancy!



I'm with you there hawalkden! Thinking about pregnancy makes me feel really angry and bitter sometimes. It's the thing that bothers me most about having diabetes.

I'm afraid I can't offer pregnancy advice as I haven't been there. However, I would say that, although it's hard work to bring your A1c down, it's more than doable. Even just one hour a week spent looking at your BG readings, identifying patterns and changing your doses accordingly can make a huge difference. My A1c at its worst was around 10.4 a couple of years ago, and in December last year was down to 7.1. It's more than possible if you can put in some work.

I'd suggest talking to your nurse/doc about how you're feeling, and talk to your partner too. The way you're feeling is completely understandable, and having supportive people behind you will really help.

I hope things improve for you soon, and that you can start trying before too long. Keep us posted, and feel free to ask questions and rant - it's what we're here for!


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## bigpurpleduck (Sep 12, 2010)

Twitchy said:


> Don't be terrified!  Just be really prepared for a lot of hard work, and nothing like the nct will brain wash you into thinking is 'normal'!
> 
> My HbA1c s before conceiving were 6.5% and 6.8% (I think, from memory...I got told different levels were acceptable each time lol!).
> 
> ...



Thanks so much for your reply, Twitchy. I am terrified - but I guess the only thing which will help this is getting the control right before we start trying.

I am finding it a bit difficult to come to terms with the fact that it won't be the "natural" pregnancy and birth I would have loved. But I do have plenty time to prepare myself for this - babies are at least 3 years way yet!


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## PhoebeC (Sep 12, 2010)

hawalkden said:


> I?m feeling so frustrated at the moment. I just don?t want to even think about children anymore. I?ve had enough of my Diabetes already and only been diagnosed a year last march.
> I went into hospital with DKA and was in CCU for a week ventilated. I?m trying to control my bloods but I?m sick of not having or doing the ?normal? things everyone else can do and yeah people can reply to this saying stop being selfish but I?m sick of it.
> I have a consultant appointment next week and I want to tell them I want to be on the Pre-Pregnancy Clinic but they?ll probably refuse and make me wait to get my HBa1C down, also make me have my bloods given before anything, which they know I cant do. My veins just shut down and refuse! So I just get more frustrated.
> Sorry I?m just at my wits end and envy every female who has a ?normal? pregnancy! I cant see myself being/feeling so horrid in and out of hospital and all the check ups in the 1st part.
> ...



Your not selfish daibetes is poo, but it does get better. I dont mind mine really, id like not to hvee it but i dont hate, maybe because its been 5 years and i cant really remember beore i had it.

I have always thought adoption must be an amazing thing to do, theres plenty of kids who need love and care. Either way it will still be stressful


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## emeraldgirl (Sep 13, 2010)

Hi 

It sounds like its still at the early stages for you re your diabetes, think you said you've only had it for about 18 months.  I think it does take a lot of getting used.  Quite a few people on here have probably had it for quite a long time.  I've been a diabetic for 24 years, so got it when I was 17 and do remember feeling, why me, and that I couldn't do what other people could do.  But those feelings will pass, but it might take a while.  Now I dont feel that there's anything that I cant do.  I know it sounds weird, but a lot of the time I feel healthier by having it, cause I try to eat the right foods and look after myself, I do have blow outs sometimes where I eat stuff I shouldn't but I'm sure we all do that.  What I'm trying to say is dont lose heart it will get better, it is a major adjustment in your life.  Takes quite a while to get the blood sugars levelled out.   I find the same re giving blood, its a nightmare for me, as the veins in my arms are a dead loss and I've given up with them, But do push to speak to your pre-pregnancy clinic, if they're like mine, they will be able to give you some good advice, and help you with your fears and worries. 

Take Care

Dee xx


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## hawalkden (Sep 13, 2010)

*update...*

Hi guys
Thanks for the honest and positive advice and experience. I know everyone would love not to have diabetes but it?s what makes us us really. Me and OH decided (I know it?s a little wrong) to NPNT we started last night and just see how things go. We?ll be stressing the passion for a child on Thursday when we got to see my Diabetic Consultant and telling them about our plans and whats happening. It?s not like I?m at school anymore they cant not let me have a child! 
I?m still worrying a little about my control but its in a way a denial and at the same time didn?t care but not thinking because we?re NTNP makes me think I?m already pregnant so want to start doing the right things well what I?m doing at the moment but even better and more often! 
I cant really get my head round carb counting and at the moment I?m on set units for meals and the main problem at the moment for me is at work during meals. Due to working in a nursery and in the pre-school part all the children are leaving to go to school so we?re getting presents and lots of chocolates so while we?re in the childrens areas we?re nibbling away at the chocolate. I know I can have them and I just add a few units onto my meal if its 2 hours within a meal time just if people say to me I ?cant? have the things to eat I?d just eat more to make a point. 
So that?s my weakness where I would just want to be like the rest of the girls at work and just eat and not like oh no cant my bloods will be out of their ?never normal? rage. 
So from now on with knowing we?re NTNP attitude I want to be more positive and be less frustrated with not getting it right   
Thank you 
x


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## bev (Sep 13, 2010)

hawalkden said:


> Hi guys
> Thanks for the honest and positive advice and experience. I know everyone would love not to have diabetes but it?s what makes us us really. Me and OH decided (I know it?s a little wrong) to NPNT we started last night and just see how things go. We?ll be stressing the passion for a child on Thursday when we got to see my Diabetic Consultant and telling them about our plans and whats happening. It?s not like I?m at school anymore they cant not let me have a child!
> I?m still worrying a little about my control but its in a way a denial and at the same time didn?t care but not thinking because we?re NTNP makes me think I?m already pregnant so want to start doing the right things well what I?m doing at the moment but even better and more often!
> I cant really get my head round carb counting and at the moment I?m on set units for meals and the main problem at the moment for me is at work during meals. Due to working in a nursery and in the pre-school part all the children are leaving to go to school so we?re getting presents and lots of chocolates so while we?re in the childrens areas we?re nibbling away at the chocolate. I know I can have them and I just add a few units onto my meal if its 2 hours within a meal time just if people say to me I ?cant? have the things to eat I?d just eat more to make a point.
> ...



Hi,
I completely understand why you want to go ahead and start planning your family - its only natural.
But I would urge you to speak with your team *before* you get pregnant.  Diabetes and pegnancy are very hard things to balance and taking any risks with a growing baby inside you far outweighs your need for a baby. I think you would benefit from learning to carb count as this will give you much better control than you have now. There is so much evidence that a *good* hba1c pre-pregnancy is essential in producing a healthy child that you should not ignore it. I know you might think I am being hard on you - but this is about bringing a healthy baby into the world and putting your wishes to one side until you gain a better hba1c. I would imagine that your team wont be too happy that you are trying against their advice. Please re-read all the advice that the ladies on here have already given to you.Bev


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## emeraldgirl (Sep 14, 2010)

Sorry I also meant to say in my earlier post, if you do go to see your diabetic team, ask to see the dietician.  When I first got pregnant, my hba1c was 7.3, but after a lot of good advice and help from the dietician is is now under 6.  She should have handouts and things that she can give you too. 

Dee xx


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## hawalkden (Sep 16, 2010)

Well went to Diabetic Consultant today. Was a rather positive outcome. Talked about general diabetes and health. Night long lasting insulin has been dropped down. Woo and I?ve not had many  high blood reading this week. Mainly between 8-12 before meals, which is a huge improvement from a few weeks ago and I know they need to be better than that. We're just waiting for the HbA1C. I  hinted about the Pre-Pregnancy Clinic. Didn?t mention about we're planning but trying/not protecting. Got to wait for HbA1C before we go any further. 
Me and OH will being going back to the hospital tomorrow to see my Diabetic Nurse to tell her about our plans and we want to be going onto Folic Acid; just if we're pregnant by the end of the month and if we're not then we'll be on then ready for the next consultant appointment in 3 months. 
I hope tomorrow she proscribes us with the tablets just so I know the ball will be rolling. 
Thank you for the advice and I know it's not the right way but thinking about it, my bloods are better than ever and hope everyone sees the positive side of this thread from today. 
Heather and Jason 
XxX


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## Twitchy (Sep 16, 2010)

Hi Heather.

It's really good that you had a good appointment with your team & have some ideas to be going forward with.

Could I just please, *please* urge you to at the very least make sure you are careful not to get pregnant before you have been on the 5mg dose of folic acid, ideally for 3 months - this is to reduce the higher risk diabetics have of having babies with problems such as spina bifida.  I would also really urge you to wait til your BG levels are right too - the ideal BG levels Diabetes UK mentions are no higher than 5.6mmol/l before and 7.8mmol/l after meals. DUK do a publication (magazine sized) called 'pregnancy & diabetes' - I really really recommend you read it, so you understand the risks to you & baby, and what you need to do & what medical support you can expect.  My edition states HbA1c should be below 7.5% before trying (or allowing yourself) to conceive.

Just to give you an idea of why the docs bang on about good control prior to conception so much, "the risk of malformation (of the baby) is 4 - 10 times greater in babies of women who have diabetes...but... it was found that women who had tight blood glucose control during the early weeks of pregnancy greatly reduced the risk of malformations".  I think you need to take a long hard think about whether your urgent (& totally understandable) desire for a child as soon as possible, is at any cost, or whether for for child's sake, you are willing to take things a little more slowly, get your ducks in a row & give this child the best possible chance of a healthy start in life.  After all, I'm guessing you wouldn't just dash into the car & zip off without putting your seatbelt on because you were in a hurry, would you?  When baby arrives your whole world will change - it will revolve around them, for a start!  You pretty soon find that their needs are paramount & you would do anything for their wellbeing - why not start with that mindset now? I promise you the waiting will be worth it, if for no other reason than if things do go awry, at least in your head you will be able to say "I did everything I could" - trust me, that means a lot.

I'm really sorry if this sounds a bit harsh, but we are talking about another human being here, who will be totally dependent on you for their health, well being & safety - for your own peace of mind long term, please try & see the 'big picture' here.  Sorry if that sounds like a lecture, but I would feel awful if no one cautioned you about the risks you are taking & bad things happened. No one can stop you doing what you say you will, but at least you can know the facts.


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## bev (Sep 16, 2010)

Twitchy said:


> Hi Heather.
> 
> It's really good that you had a good appointment with your team & have some ideas to be going forward with.
> 
> ...



Hi Twitchy,
I dont think your being harsh at all - just completely realistic and telling it like it is. I agree with every word you have said and just hope that Heather takes some of this on board - after all - it is a life we are talking about here.Bev


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## hawalkden (Sep 16, 2010)

First off I?m not happy and a little upset with what you have written. I know you have the right for your opinion like I?ll be having my opinion now. 
Like I said about the Folic Acid. Me and Jason are going to be going to see my Diabetic Nurse for prescribing them tomorrow for us or if not we'll be working together to try to get them asap. I maybe 'young and immature' but I'm sure I know and researched on what I need to do, take and what the risks I'm taking myself and another human being I'll be creating. 
As you know everyone who has Diabetes is an individual and all the 'risks' are statistics and don't necessarily mean it happens to every Diabetic I appreciate that your being 'harsh' but has anything personally happened to you while you was expecting due to your diabetes?   
Don't you think I've thought about everything from raising a child to money issues. Like I said in the last post. Realistically no one is ready for a child and me and Jason may not be the wealthiest of people but we'll get by like everyone else has to do in life. I'm not just any 'normal' female who can just get pregnant without thinking about the problems. 
I am doing everything at the moment I can. I'm waiting for my HbA1c results before trying hardcore. My last one was 9.6% better then expected and my bloods lately have been rather good for my situation. I have been through a lot over the past year and I think I know more than many who have had Diabetes about suffering from DKA and being ventilated for a week of my life because I was under educated off my local Diabetic Team.


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## xxlou_lxx (Sep 16, 2010)

Although my pregnancy was unplanned i totally agree with you twitchy! and if im honest being pregnant was and probably always will be the most traumatic time of my life for all of the reasons mentioned above and also some deep emotional distress I put myself through with worry! 

End result was fab as all children are, and now to me gracie will be my greatest life achievement..... but it really was hard going


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## bev (Sep 17, 2010)

hawalkden said:


> First off I?m not happy and a little upset with what you have written. I know you have the right for your opinion like I?ll be having my opinion now.
> Like I said about the Folic Acid. Me and Jason are going to be going to see my Diabetic Nurse for prescribing them tomorrow for us or if not we'll be working together to try to get them asap. I maybe 'young and immature' but I'm sure I know and researched on what I need to do, take and what the risks I'm taking myself and another human being I'll be creating.
> As you know everyone who has Diabetes is an individual and all the 'risks' are statistics and don't necessarily mean it happens to every Diabetic I appreciate that your being 'harsh' but has anything personally happened to you while you was expecting due to your diabetes?
> Don't you think I've thought about everything from raising a child to money issues. Like I said in the last post. Realistically no one is ready for a child and me and Jason may not be the wealthiest of people but we'll get by like everyone else has to do in life. I'm not just any 'normal' female who can just get pregnant without thinking about the problems.
> I am doing everything at the moment I can. I'm waiting for my HbA1c results before trying hardcore. My last one was 9.6% better then expected and my bloods lately have been rather good for my situation. I have been through a lot over the past year and I think I know more than many who have had Diabetes about suffering from DKA and being ventilated for a week of my life because I was under educated off my local Diabetic Team.



Your hba1c is 9.6% - this means that you are at risk of complications yourself if you dont get this figure down. I would be very worried with an hba1c this high. You obviously will already know the complications that I am talking about so I wont state the obvious.

I run a support group for diabetic children and their families in our area. One mum came along with her 2 young boys and husband - and another lady. The mum is diabetic herself and 'abused' (her words) her diabetes when she was a teenager (she is now 28). She is blind in one eye, has partial eyesight in the other and her kidneys are showing signs of failing. Her husband is also diabetic and her 2 boys are diabetic. The other lady was a 'carer' that was supplied by the social services as this poor mum couldnt see properly to be able to look after her own children and she couldnt read the blood glucose meter results. If you dont bring your hba1c down you run the risk of complications like this. 

The only reason people on here are being honest with you is that nobody wants you to have complications, and more importantly, they dont want your baby to have any. You came on here to ask for advice, and that is what you have been given. Obviously it is your choice as to whether or not you take it, and it seems that you have already made your mind up. There is a wealth of knowledge on this pregnancy section and you would be wise to take it on board. I do wish you and your future baby the very best of luck.Bev


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## getcarter76 (Sep 17, 2010)

I am going to stick my oar in here too which I never do for any thread where there is a bit of a heated debate - i'm outta here i say. But, with this one you are talking about another life and the preventable risks that you can do before you get pregnant.

I for one am a healthy woman who has a young daughter. I have been T1 for 28 years and like Twitchy and Bev, wholeheartedly agree in all that they say. I have just recently had a miscarriage as my hubby and I are trying (I also had one prior to my daughter being born) and my HBA1c was and is in the good parameters (6.2%, 6.4%) prior and during the early weeks of this pregnancy I lost. It is traumatic in addition to feeling useless and 'diabetic'.

This isn't to gang up on you and make you feel bad but as a mother and a long term diabetic you really need to get yourself on the straight and narrow before even entertaining the idea of getting pregnant. Didn't you say that you were in a coma and had hospitilisation due to a blood clot? I am sorry that you had to go through all this to come out the other side to then feel like you have hit another barrier with wanting a baby but with a high HBA1C for a period of time will count against you and your unborn baby. 

If you look after yourself and have excellent control before pregnancy then the risks are no higher than that of a non diabetic woman. But, believe you me, you need all the support and help and knowledge of diabetes helps too during the pregnancy itself let alone the bit before and the bit after. Pregnancy for a high risk woman is like walking the long green mile! 

I see you say that they are just statistics the risks, but this information will be from tragedys and cases where things have gone wrong and not just plucked out of thin air. The nurse at the EPAC clinic said to me that any woman can miscarry at any stage of their pregnancy (including still birth) and is far more common than anyone realises. As a 'normal' woman you have a 1 in 4 chance of miscarrying and i know lots of women who have who aren't even diabetic. With a long standing health condition, these risks increase, its just maths, but i hope and pray that you aren't one of the unlucky ones.

My final word to you is get that HBA1C down as you aren't just risking your life in pregnancy, but that of your unborn child. This counts against you i can assure you. 

Bernie


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## Cate (Sep 17, 2010)

getcarter76 said:


> I see you say that they are just statistics the risks, but this information will be from tragedys and cases where things have gone wrong and not just plucked out of thin air. The nurse at the EPAC clinic said to me that any woman can miscarry at any stage of their pregnancy (including still birth) and is far more common than anyone realises. As a 'normal' woman you have a 1 in 4 chance of miscarrying and i know lots of women who have who aren't even diabetic. With a long standing health condition, these risks increase, its just maths, but i hope and pray that you aren't one of the unlucky ones.



Hi,

I'm afraid I'm going to agree with Bernie.

To give you an idea of how common problems in pregnancy can be, I have had diabetes for 27 years, and have 2 children.  HOWEVER I have been pregnant with 5 children.  Two of them I miscarried, one was stillborn, and that's an experience I would never wish on anybody.  My control nowadays is good (HbA1c below 7% for the last 6 years) and I was taking the recommended dose of folic acid both pre-pregnancy and during pregnancy too, plus baby aspirin and other recommended things.  None of it helped, and I think we were just lucky with the two living children we have.

In addition, during both successful pregnancies the pregnancy itself caused changes in my eyes, after my daughter was born in 2007 I had to have a vitrectomy in one eye.  This involved spending 2 weeks post-op upright, to keep the air bubble holding my retina in place in the correct position.  I am likely to need a vitrectomy in my left eye within the next year or so, again this is because pregnancy accelerated the changes in it despite extensive laser treatment.  I also had to deliver my babies by csection, as my eye consultant was very concerned about my losing even more vision from the stress of labour.

Finally, I knew a lady through my GP surgery diabetes nurse, she died when her little girl was 4 years old because of diabetic complications - her kidneys were put under stress from the pregnancy and basically they never recovered.  This scares me silly, but it's far more likely to happen if you aren't sufficiently well controlled before getting pregnant.

Please please do think again about trying right now.

Best wishes,


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## Pigeon (Sep 17, 2010)

Thanks to everyone who's put their own experiences on here - I'm always a bit daunted by the thought of having children, so it's nice to hear honest reports from ladies who have. 

I tend to think of the risks as being like smoking - as you say, the complications won't necessarily happen to everyone, but they are related by data which has been gathered over many years. Everyone knows someone who has smoked all their lives but not had cancer, and some people who have never smoked but got cancer. But it's not denied that smoking is linked to cancer and your risk of cancer would be cut if you quit smoking.

So in terms of pregnancy, I see it that not everyone who has a high HbA1c would have a complicated pregnancy (e.g. I think Lou had a higher A1c when she got pregnant, but got it down quickly), but if your results are higher than the recommended range then the risk of complications increases, for you and the baby. Obviously complications can happen anyway, to healthy mums, but I think if I had a baby who was ill or disabled then I would always question if it was something I had caused, and if I knew that I hadn't followed medical advice then I would find that quite hard to deal with.


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## rachelha (Sep 20, 2010)

Hello - sorry for the late response to this.  

I can understand where you are coming from.  My hba1c was 8.4 when I first spoke to the pre-pregnancy team at my clinic. It took be about 7 months(and alot of effort) to get it down to 7.4 when they said I could start ttc.  This was one of the most frustrating times of my life.  I was 35, and was v v worried about getting old, and that adding to the posibility of complications. Everyone at my work seemed to be having babies and I could not even start trying.  I took the decision to start ttc before getting my pump (which I am still waiting for) as we decided 7.4 was ok, and waiting for the pump would drive me nuts.

I am glad I did not start ttc straight away.  Managing blood sugar levels whilst pregnant is alot harder than when not, although you do have the best motivation possible to do it.  If you look through some of my posts you will see how hard I found it.  If possible you really need to get as much understanding and control of your levels beforegetting pregnant to give you a good chance of controlling things when you are.

My hba1c was under 7 for the whole of my pregnancy and I still had a large baby 9lb 11oz.  He is fine (now 2weeks + 3 days), but the birth was v tough and I am still recovering from it, and having regular hospital check ups now.


big hugs

Rachel


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