# What will it mean for us?



## Amberzak (Jun 24, 2016)

im putting this in here because it does directly affect us. This isn't meant to invite flaming. 

What does Brexit mean for us? My insulin comes from Denmark, as nordisk is a Danish company. The freestyle libre is a eu company. 

Nigel Farage is now saying that the money won't be put into the NHS like he said. 

So, what do people think? Should we have cause for worry?


----------



## Northerner (Jun 24, 2016)

I think it's too early to say. It's hard to see NHS funding increasing any time before the next general election, more likely to be cut so services put under even more pressure. We'll survive, but I think it has set us back from any sort of real recovery with all the uncertainty to come and no evident plan ever proposed by the Leave campaign.


----------



## Robin (Jun 24, 2016)

Abbott is a US company, I think the Libre is just made by their European arm. They have an HQ in Maidenhead, and a factory in Witney, just down the road from us, that makes part of the libre, and has just been recruiting.
Personally, I think it will stay very much business as usual, Eu countries want to sell as much of their stuff as possible, and selling it to us is all part of that.
Nigel Farage does not have a say as to how the NHS is funded, unless he got enough seats in the next election to form a government, and heaven forbid that happens!


----------



## grovesy (Jun 24, 2016)

I and many of my ex colleagues , NHS workers , never thought that money would be spent on the NHS!
Most of these companies were selling there drugs and products to UK pre us joining the EU , I worked in a Pharmacy back then and these companies have been around for a long time.


----------



## Mrs Mad Ronin (Jun 24, 2016)

He can't say where the money goes, he never could which is why it annoys me that people believed him. However my personal belief is this:- money will go into the NHS but how much i don't know. They SHOULD divide the money saved and put it into all  the areas we need it to go to. The thing is, nothing is going to change anytime soon. It's going to take 2 years to leave the EU and the negotiations won't start until October when the new PM comes in.

Also Brussels has just left David Cameron red faced.... they have said that they WILL still trade with us given the result. They don't have a choice really because us leaving will impact them alot


----------



## KookyCat (Jun 24, 2016)

I wouldn't worry Amberzak, the truth is nobody knows what will happen.  I don't think most people believe any more money will go to the NHS really, if we wanted to we could have done that already, it's unlikely to make a great deal of difference immediately, unless of course the pound keeps plummeting then we're in for a rocky ride.


----------



## trophywench (Jun 24, 2016)

It wasn't about money at all one way or the other.  Apart from the proportion of people who think carefully about economics, trading conditions, exchange rates and all the actually 'real' things that affect everyone's life much more than a lot of people realise - there was - is! - a large lump of people who wanted to stick two fingers up to the Government.  Oh well done folk - you've done that alright.

Personally I had decided that - much as I really wanted to kick David Cameron and co where it hurts - it actually would land up hurting my foot, much much more, than it would hurt their dangly bits.

Yet there he was this morning - taking his ball back home with him - and having said all along and being absolutely adamant that he'd invoke Article 50 'immediately' (which I didn't agree with, most 'advisers' didn't, and feared it, if it did go 'Leave') - stating that he wouldn't and resigning cos he wasn't the right person to negotiate the leaving despite having sworn he'd do it ALL!   That - I am glad about - cos I don't think he's the man for the job.  However - there are things in other walks of life that I haven't personally wanted to do - but have had to do, because it was actually better for the majority of the people who wanted me to represent them.  Other times I had to use my personal judgment - another thing I'd been elected to do.  It's called 'stepping up to the responsibilities of the job'.  You have to have all these arguments with yourself - and then stick by whatever you decided.  If it turned out you'd been wrong then you were duty bound - as far as I'm concerned - to admit that - ie HONESTY.

Nothing has changed folks - politicians will STILL carry on telling lies, as long as they can work their gobs.  QED.

I'm sorry - I think as has been said - we have all got to stick together now which this country hasn't really had to do since c.1939 - but a BOOing crowd outside Boris's house this morning?  Like he cast every bloody OUT! vote himself?  Is that what we are going to get every blinking day now?

Why oh why oh why ....


----------



## HOBIE (Jun 24, 2016)

Robin said:


> Abbott is a US company, I think the Libre is just made by their European arm. They have an HQ in Maidenhead, and a factory in Witney, just down the road from us, that makes part of the libre, and has just been recruiting.
> Personally, I think it will stay very much business as usual, Eu countries want to sell as much of their stuff as possible, and selling it to us is all part of that.
> Nigel Farage does not have a say as to how the NHS is funded, unless he got enough seats in the next election to form a government, and heaven forbid that happens!


"Don't Panic Mr Manron"  .  We can get our electric wiring back to "RED"  danger ! (keep mits off)


----------



## trophywench (Jun 24, 2016)

Oooh - will neutral be blue again and negative black? 

There'll be a run on 3 core cable rewiring Hobie - so you'll be busy - do we make any cable in the UK now? 

See?  - every cloud has a silver lining!!  LOL


----------



## Diabeticliberty (Jun 24, 2016)

I have spoken to 3 of my larger clients this morning and they are already drawing up summary redundancy plans for employees. My God, talk about not letting the grass grow. I very much doubt that the poor Joe Soaps (and their families) who may and probably will lose their jobs will want to share much in your sentiment that every cloud has a silver lining. Hang on though, all is not lost I am sure that the 'new unemployed' can go and fully enjoy some temporary employment in the fresh air and sunshine pulling up swedes and turnips on the farms that currently employ some European migrants as agricultural workers when Herr Farage and his UKIP Gestapo round them all up and send them back from whence they came


----------



## trophywench (Jun 24, 2016)

I am far from joyous mate, just enjoying Hobie's joke!

We are all stuck with it now though, it's done.  Whinging about it, or indeed crying over the milk that's been spilt, won't change it.

Neither UKIP not Nigel Farage, nor Boris, nor Michael Gove, nor either side of the arguments, sensationalism, hype and whoppers going back and forth recently  - actually CAUSED the vote to go this way.

Disaffected people who felt they'd been ignored for too long.

In 5 minutes or so - some of the ones who voted to leave, are also going to be moaning that their lot is now worse than before, and they still haven't got a council house .....


----------



## Cleo (Jun 24, 2016)

"In 5 minutes or so - some of the ones who voted to leave, are also going to be moaning that their lot is now worse than before, and they still haven't got a council house ....."

So true !


----------



## Lilylou (Jun 24, 2016)

trophywench said:


> It wasn't about money at all one way or the other.  Apart from the proportion of people who think carefully about economics, trading conditions, exchange rates and all the actually 'real' things that affect everyone's life much more than a lot of people realise - there was - is! - a large lump of people who wanted to stick two fingers up to the Government.  Oh well done folk - you've done that alright.
> 
> Personally I had decided that - much as I really wanted to kick David Cameron and co where it hurts - it actually would land up hurting my foot, much much more, than it would hurt their dangly bits.
> 
> ...




Well said Jenny! everyone seems to be in _PANIC  _mode today! Anyone would think Britain was going to sink! It's only Mr David Cameron's ship is going down, and like any good Captain he is going down with it! Stealing the saying, but Keep Calm and Carry On *GREAT* BRITAIN for goodness sake


----------



## Adrasteia (Jun 24, 2016)

Lilylou said:


> Well said Jenny! everyone seems to be in _PANIC  _mode today! Anyone would think Britain was going to sink! It's only Mr David Cameron's ship is going down, and like any good Captain he is going down with it! Stealing the saying, but Keep Calm and Carry On *GREAT* BRITAIN for goodness sake



Except that is isn't just his ship sinking, as @Diabeticliberty has pointed out.

As an employee of a tech company in the midst of a buyout this result carries an immediate negative impact for me, not to mention the longer term concerns. Perhaps not a lot will change until we actually exit for a lot of people and therefore they don't need to panic, but don't imagine that covers everyone. There will be plenty who are justifiably worried right now.


----------



## Lilylou (Jun 24, 2016)

Worrying at the moment is only being caused by the TV coverage, politicians and scaremongers. Everything will be ok! Just be patient! NEVER say die!!


----------



## Diabeticliberty (Jun 24, 2016)

Lilylou said:


> Worrying at the moment is only being caused by the TV coverage, politicians and scaremongers. Everything will be ok! Just be patient! NEVER say die!!




I think you are completely correct. I have changed my mind  and will never say die. The silly scaremongers have had me hiding under my duvet. I will NEVER say die as you so eloquently suggest. Just a minor itty, bitty question you might be able to assist me with if you would be so kind? In a few weeks or a few months time when all of my major clients have had their spending cut completely because of the storm of uncertainty that Britain and British industry will now be forced to endure for an extended period of time and I am unable to pay my 22 employees because I have no work do you feel when they come knocking on my office door  if I tell them to be patient and NEVER say die and forget about paying their relative mortgages and feeding their kids that I should book myself an ambulance or take the short option and just get myself an undertaker? Oh no,  I think I might have just said die, oh bugger!!!!!!!!!


----------



## Lilylou (Jun 24, 2016)

Did you not listen to the Governor of the Bank of England this morning in amongst all the hype! Britain is in a fairy stable financial position, it's only a knee jerk reaction causing the Financial Markets to fall etc, and all the worrying in the world, (and maybe if you pass on your comment to your employees), won't help you or them! You are only adding to the scaremongering which is occurring today. It will take time, and effort of everyone of us in Britain to make it work ........ Be patient! It's not all going to fold! We are a strong and gutsy country. Time to stand up for our own priorities, not the EU's! 
You didn't say die you said Undertaker and that is the only certainty in life, we will all eventually require the services of one, hopefully later than sooner!


----------



## Austin Mini (Jun 24, 2016)

On a lighter note I start work on Monday designing a crossing bearer production line for Egypt Rail in Cairo.   Got the go ahead on Wednesday. Bad news is I have to make four expenses paid visits to Cairo.


----------



## Redkite (Jun 24, 2016)

Lilylou you don't understand what is happening here.  Companies are already drawing up plans to move thousands of employees out of Britain and into EU countries - jobs are being lost already, this is a catastrophe for this country.


----------



## Diabeticliberty (Jun 24, 2016)

Redkite said:


> Lilylou you don't understand what is happening here.  Companies are already drawing up plans to move thousands of employees out of Britain and into EU countries - jobs are being lost already, this is a catastrophe for this country.




JP Morgan (not a client of mine) are currently 'investigating options' regarding the 16000 employees they currently employ in Britain. Less than 12 hours after the vote


----------



## Redkite (Jun 24, 2016)

Diabeticliberty said:


> JP Morgan (not a client of mine) are currently 'investigating options' regarding the 16000 employees they currently employ in Britain. Less than 12 hours after the vote



Tens of thousands of jobs depend on the financial services industry in the City of London.  People sneer at "greedy bankers", but this industry generates a massive slice of our GDP.  Or it did.


----------



## trophywench (Jun 24, 2016)

Well if we've got brains we all are surely already scared stiff ? TBH.

However - PANIC-ing will NOT help.

It could be shit.  It could definitely be shit.

But - we ALL have to live with it now - however much shit there is.

And yes I am in some ways lucky as I'm a pensioner and like all of you - I rely on the NHS to keep me breathing actually.  If the Government can't afford to pay either of us our pensions cos the working hordes aren't paying Taxes because they are all actually now employed - and the occupational pension funds don't get any further investments and their interest rates slash and all the insurance companies go bust - I really am in shit way beyond me neck.

What the hell is worrying about it, going to help?  I cannot do a bloody thing to change it.


----------



## Amberzak (Jun 24, 2016)

I've had immediate effect. Being a self employed tutor, I've had parents contact me to say they would like to stop tutoring because of financial reasons. That's my livelyhood.


----------



## grovesy (Jun 24, 2016)

Sorry to hear this!


----------



## Redkite (Jun 24, 2016)

Amberzak said:


> I've had immediate effect. Being a self employed tutor, I've had parents contact me to say they would like to stop tutoring because of financial reasons. That's my livelyhood.



Sorry to hear that


----------



## Matt Cycle (Jun 24, 2016)

Well, according to Nigel Farage now it won't mean £350 million a week for the NHS.  Apparently, that was a mistake.


----------



## Diabeticliberty (Jun 24, 2016)

Amberzak said:


> I've had immediate effect. Being a self employed tutor, I've had parents contact me to say they would like to stop tutoring because of financial reasons. That's my livelyhood.



That is dreadful news.  Can you make up the shortfall elsewhere or is that not feasible?


----------



## khskel (Jun 24, 2016)

Amberzak said:


> I've had immediate effect. Being a self employed tutor, I've had parents contact me to say they would like to stop tutoring because of financial reasons. That's my livelyhood.


A bit premature that? Just looking for excuses by the sounds of it.


----------



## trophywench (Jun 24, 2016)

I've told people in the past I'm being made redundant when I've wanted to get rid of employing them - it's been a lie.


----------



## Martin Canty (Jun 24, 2016)

trophywench said:


> it's been a lie


Jenny, you should have gone into politics.....


----------



## trophywench (Jun 24, 2016)

Oooh, I can't lie face to face Martin, nor can I dissolve into tears, like I can on the phone when I seem to think it might help .....


----------



## Amberzak (Jun 24, 2016)

Lots of my tutor friends have experienced the same thing. I will replace them I bet.


----------



## Northerner (Jun 25, 2016)

Amberzak said:


> Lots of my tutor friends have experienced the same thing. I will replace them I bet.


Maybe you'll get more people who need to work out how to balance their budgets?  Seriously though, I hope things pick up again once things settle down - everything is a bit hysterical at the moment because the result is not what was expected.


----------



## Sally71 (Jun 25, 2016)

It does worry me a bit that there are probably lots of people who voted Leave who didn't consider the economic aspect at all 
I voted Remain and am a bit disappointed and worried by the result, however what's done is done and we've just got to get on with it now.  There is a lot of hysteria and knee-jerk reactions at the moment, we can only hope that things will settle down soon!
Actually I would have voted for us to have the Euro all those years ago, my hubby works in export sales and it would be so much easier if he could just quote a price that was valid for everyone; as it is having to deal with exchange rates all the time is a bit of a nuisance for him.  HOWEVER now that half of the Eurozone are in serious financial difficulty I am now rather glad that we kept the pound!
So let's hope that us leaving the EU will be alright in the end; I think it will take a long time to get to that point though and will be a rocky road on the way 

I do think it rather amusing though that the French don't want to have our border controls at their end of the tunnel any more and are going to make us quite literally take back our borders. (Quite rightly in my opinion, I always thought it was a bit odd that the UK border control was on French soil in the first place.) Which means we might well end up with all the migration camps at our end instead of theirs.  Just what Nigel Farage and his cronies really wanted!


----------



## Amigo (Jun 25, 2016)

Amberzak said:


> I've had immediate effect. Being a self employed tutor, I've had parents contact me to say they would like to stop tutoring because of financial reasons. That's my livelyhood.



I agree with khskel on this Amberzak...sounds like an excuse. First day in and people are predicting a catastrophic effect on their finances. Some of the newspapers including the Daily Mirror (who embarrassingly printed a Remain win as their headline for yesterday), have gone into Doom, doom and disaster mode. Sounds to me that there are forces at work determined to make this a disaster. Now that worries me and I was in the Remain camp.


----------



## Amigo (Jun 25, 2016)

And now I see there's a petition circulating with already a million signatures asking for a second referendum because they didn't like the outcome of this one. I wonder if Nicola Sturgeon started it?


----------



## Northerner (Jun 25, 2016)

Amigo said:


> And now I see there's a petition circulating with already a million signatures asking for a second referendum because they didn't like the outcome of this one. I wonder if Nicola Sturgeon started it?


I've seen the petition, a bit pointless as we can't have another. Although perhaps there should have been a 'cooling off' period when we could nullify the result if they admitted it was won under false pretences - like they have done in the first 24 hours with the NHS money and free movement of labour... 

I suppose one good thing is that we will no longer have to worry about TTIP's potential effect on the NHS (just need to worry what even worse deal the privatisers might come up with  )


----------



## grovesy (Jun 25, 2016)

Northerner said:


> I've seen the petition, a bit pointless as we can't have another. Although perhaps there should have been a 'cooling off' period when we could nullify the result if they admitted it was won under false pretences - like they have done in the first 24 hours with the NHS money and free movement of labour...
> 
> I suppose one good thing is that we will no longer have to worry about TTIP's potential effect on the NHS (just need to worry what even worse deal the privatisers might come up with  )


Unless we do a deal with US and agree!


----------



## Amigo (Jun 25, 2016)

I see there's also a petition on the UK Gov website calling for Donald Trump (the unlovable chump) to be denied entry to the UK. It's already got more than half a million signatories including many UK polititicians. Interestingly, now it's past the 100,000 mark, the issue is eligible for debate in the House of Commons! 

But this is my personal favourite although it might prove costly especially with having to send a hairdresser with him;

'In contrast, a humorous petition calling on NASA to "send Donald Trump into Space and Leave Him There" on the change.org site has exceeded 30,000 signatures. Autumn Boehle from Michigan, who started the petition last Wednesday, says, if the petition garners sufficient signatures, she will provide a link where people can: "donate to make this happen. It wont be cheap, but it will be worth while."


----------



## Northerner (Jun 25, 2016)

Amigo said:


> But this is my personal favourite although it might prove costly especially with having to send a hairdresser with him;
> 
> 'In contrast, a humorous petition calling on NASA to "send Donald Trump into Space and Leave Him There" on the change.org site has exceeded 30,000 signatures. Autumn Boehle from Michigan, who started the petition last Wednesday, says, if the petition garners sufficient signatures, she will provide a link where people can: "donate to make this happen. It wont be cheap, but it will be worth while."


Perhaps the Mexicans will find it is cheaper, and preferable to, building a wall?


----------



## Redkite (Jun 25, 2016)

Sally71 said:


> I do think it rather amusing though that the French don't want to have our border controls at their end of the tunnel any more and are going to make us quite literally take back our borders. (Quite rightly in my opinion, I always thought it was a bit odd that the UK border control was on French soil in the first place.) Which means we might well end up with all the migration camps at our end instead of theirs.  Just what Nigel Farage and his cronies really wanted!



The migrants in Calais have always been a British problem, so I don't blame the French at all to want rid of the problem of holding them back.  How ironic it will be when they all come over to Dover, since Kent has been one of the most racist UKIP supporting counties.


----------



## Diabeticliberty (Jun 25, 2016)

The Europeans are now rounding on us by saying stop delaying and get the hell out like right now. Obama was in the media this morning stating that we were still America's special friends but reiterated his statement that regarding trade deals we would be right at the back of the queue. The equation can be made as complicated as anyone chooses but I see it in rather more simplistic terms. It is trade by which as a country we live or die. I have yet to hear or read anything that offers even the merest glimmer of optimism except a forum member yesterday who suggested 'Never say die'. I do not however envisage any form of business life in this country for the next ten years.


----------



## Redkite (Jun 25, 2016)

Diabeticliberty said:


> The Europeans are now rounding on us by saying stop delaying and get the hell out like right now. Obama was in the media this morning stating that we were still America's special friends but reiterated his statement that regarding trade deals we would be right at the back of the queue. The equation can be made as complicated as anyone chooses but I see it in rather more simplistic terms. It is trade by which as a country we live or die. I have yet to hear or read anything that offers even the merest glimmer of optimism except a forum member yesterday who suggested 'Never say die'. I do not however envisage any form of business life in this country for the next ten years.



You're right, sadly.  The other EU countries won't do us any favours, not because they want to "punish" us, but because they can't be seen to offer us a better deal than we were getting inside the EU, otherwise other members would rightly see that as grossly unfair.  Yet the same chumps who voted us out will whine about the EU treating us unfairly, I guarantee it


----------



## Northerner (Jun 25, 2016)

Allowing the public to vote on things shouldn't be allowed. Alex Brooker made a good point on 'Last Leg' when he said how can you trust a public that kept on voting Wagner back in the X Factor?  

I think people thought long and hard about their decision in most cases. The problem was that 'Leave' identified a small issue with resentment of migrants and cynically blew it up out of all proportion in order to win, thus showing a distinct lack of a valid argument for leaving. On the other side, Cameron totally undermined his own arguments by saying we'd be fine whatever happened, then turned that into financial meltdown, thus lacking any credibility amongst those who were rightly suspicious of various aspects of the flawed EU. The Remain side failed to counter the sovereignty and immigration arguments. Also, there was no pressing reason for a referendum, and Cameron's 're-negotiations' were pathetic and barely mentioned once campaigning got under way, thus reinforcing how useless the 'reforms' were.

Should not have happened. All the pain that people have been suffering due to cuts over the past 6 years has been in vain because the economy has now been so weakened it will take years to recover before it gets close to where we were a week ago.


----------



## Diabeticliberty (Jun 25, 2016)

Before the referendum I refused to specify whether I was in or out. I felt that stating this to anybody, even family or friends might apply unfair influence. For the record and now that it longer matters much, I voted in


----------



## Northerner (Jun 25, 2016)

Diabeticliberty said:


> Before the referendum I refused to specify whether I was in or out. I felt that stating this to anybody, even family or friends might apply unfair influence. For the record and now that it longer matters much, I voted in


I was quite unsure to begin with. I actually read up quite a bit about the EU so I could understand it better, and there were some very worrying things happening that I wasn't at all happy with. However, as the campaigns progressed I realised that the Leave campaigners weren't actually concentrating on these genuine concerns, and the whole campaign turned nasty on both sides. Cameron and Osborne predicted Armageddon, and Johnson, Farage and Gove put themselves forward as champions of the underprivileged and working poor  . I ended up voting for the status quo, since that left the possibility of a future referendum should any radical change in the EU require it - leaving would be, in my opinion, for no good reason at this time and there would be no going back.


----------



## trophywench (Jun 25, 2016)

Once you load passengers onto a ship, or train, they become the shipping line's/train operator's responsibility.

How do you suggest the French Government persuade either entity to agree to embark them unless they can prove their status ?  Proving their status is impossible and that's why the non-refugees won't say their names, let alone their nationality, in the first place.

I'm sure they are a dreadful inconvenience to Calais and indeed the French Government - but that's the price they are paying for having one of their borders next to La Manche.  Nobody can change Geography.  We've already said we're prepared to patrol the busiest stretch of water in the world with gunboats if it gets silly - is that what you really want to happen?  And why/how would that be in Europe as a whole's best interests, let alone just France's?


----------



## Amberzak (Jun 25, 2016)

The second most googled phrase from the UK on google AFTER the polls closed was 'what is the EU'. That's worrying


----------



## Diabeticliberty (Jun 25, 2016)

Amberzak said:


> The second most googled phrase from the UK on google AFTER the polls closed was 'what is the EU'. That's worrying



The first most Googled item was 'How do I get out of this chickenshit country?' Apparently most of the hits were from Conservative Cabinet Members


----------



## LeeGee (Jun 25, 2016)

Well I voted in. I believe that Cameron only agreed to the referendum as a vote winner to get re-elected last year. The thinking was that he would be in coalition and that the LibDems would block it. He would get the votes - and we wouldn't get the referendum. However, when he unexpectedly won the election outright - he had to honour the pledge and here we are. It's not actually legally binding. Let's hope they don't rush and go for the exit door. If enough of those that voted out realise they've been duped and lied to - then there is no reason legally we can't have another referendum.


----------



## Copepod (Jun 26, 2016)

One thing that bothers me is that multi centre research, into many areas or research, including diabetes, marine biology, air pollution, climate change, non carbon burning energy etc will become much more difficult in coming years. I've worked in many of those fields with colleagues from all over UK, many EU countries and further afield, and I fear that it won't happen so much in the future.


----------



## DeusXM (Jun 26, 2016)

Well, here's a worst case scenarios - note I'm not saying this will happen, but it's a probability.

We've all seen the pound fall in value. Depending on how the next few weeks pan out, that could lead to an increase in costs. Lantus and Apidra are from Sanofi in France, Novorapid and Levemir are from Novo in Denmark and Humalog is from Eli Lilly in the US. If the pound stays low and the Euro and krone recover, that means the wholesale cost of insulin will increase to the NHS.

That then puts us even more in the firing line for awkward budget cuts.

Now, aside from Europe, the likely political winners in the UK will be Boris Johnson and Michael Gove - neither of whom have any love for the NHS or the other home nations. With EU money switched off in Wales, the British government is highly unlikely to divert funds to replace this lost cash, putting the Welsh Assembly under massive pressure, and I suspect in a cost saving exercise, free prescriptions will be cancelled for all in Wales.

Meanwhile, leaving the EU won't actually change the number of people currently here but will significantly affect our ability to recruit overseas medical staff, so you can kiss goodbye to regular appointments. The NHS will become unfit for purpose...at which point, the Conservatives will be able to dismantle it with relatively little public outcry.

So that's what Brexit means for us. More expensive medicine, fewer doctors, and you'll be paying for it all out of your own pocket. There'll still be migration from Nigeria, Pakistan etc. As theses places have nothing to do with the EU, so if you were one of these people complaining about Muslims, prepare to carry on complaining. And if you're Welsh, you'll be living in a third-world country as England turns its back on you.

But hey, at least you 'got your country back', eh?


----------



## Matt Cycle (Jun 26, 2016)

We may end up with Theresa May in charge - a T1 as PM.  CGM's, pumps and unlimited strips for all?  Er, probably not, more likely restrictions and a push for some sort of private health insurance with massive premiums for diabetics or a sub standard government subsidised programme.


----------



## Northerner (Jun 26, 2016)

Matt Cycle said:


> We may end up with Theresa May in charge - a T1 as PM.  CGM's, pumps and unlimited strips for all?  Er, probably not, more likely restrictions and a push for some sort of private health insurance with massive premiums for diabetics or a sub standard government subsidised programme.


I seem to remember that she runs on mixed insulin, so we'd probably all end up on that


----------



## Redkite (Jun 26, 2016)

Northerner said:


> I seem to remember that she runs on mixed insulin, so we'd probably all end up on that



Oh no!


----------



## Redkite (Jun 26, 2016)

DeusXM said:


> Well, here's a worst case scenarios - note I'm not saying this will happen, but it's a probability.
> 
> We've all seen the pound fall in value. Depending on how the next few weeks pan out, that could lead to an increase in costs. Lantus and Apidra are from Sanofi in France, Novorapid and Levemir are from Novo in Denmark and Humalog is from Eli Lilly in the US. If the pound stays low and the Euro and krone recover, that means the wholesale cost of insulin will increase to the NHS.
> 
> ...



Totally agree with all the above.  Also, I'm very worried about what will happen when we don't get this wonderful no-migrants trade deal that Brexiters were sure we'd be able to demand.  Xenophobia is already on the rise, so it will only get worse when the EU member countries don't give us a favourable deal.  We'd all better start saving up for our private healthcare - only don't put your savings in £s


----------



## Carolg (Jun 26, 2016)

Amberzak said:


> I've had immediate effect. Being a self employed tutor, I've had parents contact me to say they would like to stop tutoring because of financial reasons. That's my livelyhood.


Sorry to hear this


----------



## Amberzak (Jun 27, 2016)

DeusXM said:


> Well, here's a worst case scenarios - note I'm not saying this will happen, but it's a probability.
> 
> We've all seen the pound fall in value. Depending on how the next few weeks pan out, that could lead to an increase in costs. Lantus and Apidra are from Sanofi in France, Novorapid and Levemir are from Novo in Denmark and Humalog is from Eli Lilly in the US. If the pound stays low and the Euro and krone recover, that means the wholesale cost of insulin will increase to the NHS.
> 
> ...


Thank for actually being honest, rather than just trying to pasify me like some of my Brexit friends. I get that this is worse case, but it's still realistic. 

Do any of you know of any private health insurance that take one type ones? Because I haven't been able to find any.


----------



## grovesy (Jun 27, 2016)

This is what we don't have in our current Private Health insurance System, most don't cover for most long term conditions.If they cover some conditions my friends husband had heart problems they had caps on what they would pay out!


----------



## khskel (Jun 27, 2016)

Northerner said:


> I seem to remember that she runs on mixed insulin, so we'd probably all end up on that


Do they do a 100% rapid acting mix?


----------



## AJLang (Jun 27, 2016)

Whenever I've looked at private medical insurance it has excluded diabetes or anything related to diabetes. This meant that I decided not to take out insurance as so many things can be "claimed" to be related to diabetes.


----------



## trophywench (Jun 27, 2016)

I'm sorry - I always see the funny side of stuff - quite a lot of the time instead of going woe is me when the excrement is starting to hit the fan - it helps me.

This morning, Headline - Boris says, We'll always be in Europe!

What a relief!! - and there was me, thinking the septic isle(s) - pushed by the Beurocrats - were about to transport themselves to Africa ....


----------



## Northerner (Jun 27, 2016)

khskel said:


> Do they do a 100% rapid acting mix?


I'm with you on that one!


----------



## Amberzak (Jun 27, 2016)

trophywench said:


> This morning, Headline - Boris says, We'll always be in Europe!
> 
> What a relief!! - and there was me, thinking the septic isle(s) - pushed by the Beurocrats - were about to transport themselves to Africa ....



Love it.


----------



## LeeGee (Jun 28, 2016)

It's all going to get nasty before long. The UK can't leave on the strength of a referendum - it means nothing legally. What is required is that MPs in parliament vote to revoke the treaty of Europe. Considering that most MPs are in the 'Remain' camp - they won't vote us out. Also, one of the papers did a poll and found that over a million people now wanted to vote 'Remain' after it became clear that the £365 million per week to the NHS was a lie and the 'Free movement of goods and people' would still be in force and continue just as before. So basically, I really can't see the MPs voting to leave when it is now clear that the majority of the country have finally wised up and want to remain. What a complete waste of time. There'll be trouble at mill, Lad.


----------



## Matt Cycle (Jun 28, 2016)

The BBC have given a nice summary of the volte-face on the claims (i.e. lies) made by the leave group during the campaign.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36641390

Get ready for the leave apologists protesting it's a conspiracy by the BBC...3,2,1....


----------



## trophywench (Jun 28, 2016)

There is trouble at the Italian mill apparently, already.  I mean if we cast our collective minds back to when all these furriners had their own currency there were countries where stuff was dear when we went there (eg Switzerland, Scandinavia and Austria) and places where it was cheap(eg France, Spain, Italy, Greece)  Then France swapped to old Franc for the new Franc which was fine to begin with - instead of 100oF to the £1, it became 10nF.  No prob.  And then the Slump - lucky to get 7nF to the £1.  oooer.

But then it all got chucked in a pot and came out as Euros - so basically anywhere with a decent infrastructure and ditto currency - has been propping up the others ever since.  And we've also been doing our bit to keep it going.  Now we've said we aren't going to play that game any more - some of the rats are leaving the sinking ships.  The hairline cracks they've all been helping one another to stick back together with spit, now need proper old fashioned glue applied by an expert craftsman - if anybody makes it and there are any such artisans now!

It was the best of times and the worst of times ......


----------



## Redkite (Jun 28, 2016)

Matt Cycle said:


> The BBC have given a nice summary of the volte-face on the claims (i.e. lies) made by the leave group during the campaign.
> 
> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36641390
> 
> Get ready for the leave apologists protesting it's a conspiracy by the BBC...3,2,1....



All these things were denounced as lies before the vote, but "there's none so deaf as will not hear".


----------



## Diabeticliberty (Jun 28, 2016)

Watching Herr Farage making a complete arse of himself today in the European Parliament playing up to the cameras made a bloody joke of my country. The Europeans must think that we are all as much of a xenophobic crackpot as he is. I am beginning to think that they can't wait to see the back of us and to be honest I don't blame them.


----------



## Redkite (Jun 28, 2016)

Diabeticliberty said:


> Watching Herr Farage making a complete arse of himself today in the European Parliament playing up to the cameras made a bloody joke of my country. The Europeans must think that we are all as much of a xenophobic crackpot as he is. I am beginning to think that they can't wait to see the back of us and to be honest I don't blame them.



Oh I agree, what an utter embarrassment.  Everyone around him was winceing and grimacing.  I wanted to yell out that he does NOT speak for me!  .  Bad enough that his lies brought this disaster upon us, now he's ruining our slim chance of a good deal by insulting and threatening fellow MEPs.


----------



## LeeGee (Jun 28, 2016)

I don't believe Brexit will ever happen. If the pound stays low then prices will soon start to rise and even the unintelligent will wonder why. No extra money for the NHS, no reduction in migrants and an extra  twenty to thirty quid on your weekly outgoings. It's like voting to double your Council Tax. All because the 'Leavers' liked to tell lies.


----------



## Redkite (Jun 28, 2016)

LeeGee said:


> I don't believe Brexit will ever happen. If the pound stays low then prices will soon start to rise and even the unintelligent will wonder why. No extra money for the NHS, no reduction in migrants and an extra  twenty to thirty quid on your weekly outgoings. It's like voting to double your Council Tax. All because the 'Leavers' liked to tell lies.



All this will happen, and also poorer regions that used to be in receipt of EU regional funding will suddenly find themselves without.  But I don't think leave voters will realise the connection.  They will just suck up whatever new lies are told - probably that it's all the EU's fault for not giving us a special cherry picked deal!  So unfortunately I think Brexit is inevitable (anyway how could the other 27 ever trust us again?), and the best case scenario is a Norway type deal, ie. we'll be paying just as much (but without our old rebate), there will still be free movement of people, and (I sincerely hope) trade with the single market, but we'll have lost our seat at the table and have no say in matters that affect us.  Crazy . So nobody will be happy, neither Remain voters nor leave voters


----------



## LeeGee (Jun 29, 2016)

I don't believe that it will happen. That's why Cameron has stood down - so he can't invoke article 50. There are 'Leave' voters in this forum - so let's here from them. Do they now think they were duped?


----------



## LeeGee (Jun 29, 2016)

Also, an out vote means the break-up of the United Kingdom. Just what were people thinking when they voted 'Out'?


----------



## DeusXM (Jun 29, 2016)

> Just what were people thinking when they voted 'Out'?



That anyone foreign or foreign-looking would magically disappear and that we'd all be rich. 

And that we'd finally have a democratic government, where a political party with less than 35% of the popular vote gets to make all the laws, which are then approved by a collection of lords and dukes (just like Game of Thrones!) and signed off by a woman in a sparkly hat because her great-great-great-great-great grandfather was good with a sword.


----------



## Northerner (Jun 29, 2016)

LeeGee said:


> I don't believe that it will happen. That's why Cameron has stood down - so he can't invoke article 50. There are 'Leave' voters in this forum - so let's here from them. Do they now think they were duped?


I think Cameron has done this to leave a poisoned chalice for his successor. Before the vote he said he would stay on and immediately invoke Article 50 - he's done the exact opposite. 

Love the way Corbyn is being blamed for something that was entirely Cameron's fault, firstly for calling it, secondly for doing a pointless deal on 'reforms', and finally for setting the highly negative tone of the Remain campaign. The Labour support for remain was actually higher than the Scottish remain vote, it was Cameron and Osborne that failed to persuade sufficient Tory voters that lost it. Doesn't surprise me though, Corbyn is now being blamed for the chaos in the Labour party, despite the fact that the efforts to remove him have not been in the slightest bit democratic. 

All our politicians have let us down very badly with their incompetent response to an unexpected result - there was clearly no plan on either side for a Leave vote.


----------



## Robin (Jun 29, 2016)

I don't normally enter into political debate on public forums, but since you asked, I will stick my head over the parapet, but please don't shoot! 

No I don't feel duped, because that's not why I voted leave. I voted the way I did because I think the EU has become an unworkable, unelected juggernaut that does not have all its members best interests at heart, and costs us a lot more money than it need. And since the Lisbon Treaty ( which I did feel duped about at the time) it has also morphed into something that I didn't vote to join in the first place.

I also thought that the Uk could successfully go it alone, given a collective will to achieve what we need to do. What concerns me most now, is that there is no political will to implement a good exit strategy because the majority of MPs (and more importantly Civil Servants who will be doing the actual advising and negotiations) are in the Remain camp.

I'm afraid it's going to turn into a rerun of an England football match. We have all the players, all the strategy, yet we limp off vanquished at the end. ( In fact, someone commented to me that maybe Roy Hodgson should be he next Prime Minister. Nobody else is capable of getting us out of Europe quite so quickly and efficiently)


----------



## LeeGee (Jun 29, 2016)

I like the Roy Hodgson bit. Lol. The whole problem as I see it, is that we can't trade with Europe in the free trade area unless we accept freedom of movement. It's still going to cost us big money, but we have no say at the big table as to which way Europe goes. Maybe it will go like the old football league and a new 'Premiership' of top nations will be born.


----------



## Northerner (Jun 29, 2016)

I do understand why many chose to leave - I quit my job 10 years ago without another one to go to or any real plan as the way the company was going and my role in it wasn't great. I did struggle for a while financially, but have come through it all intact. It will be a different world and it will most certainly cause short-term pain for those least equipped to endure it. My enthusiasm for the EU and the way it was run was probably lower than Jeremy's 7.5  However, I was only making decisions that affected me, not that of the entire country and generations to come. It was not a gamble that should have been taken for no good reason.


----------



## Robin (Jun 29, 2016)

LeeGee said:


> I like the Roy Hodgson bit. Lol. The whole problem as I see it, is that we can't trade with Europe in the free trade area unless we accept freedom of movement. It's still going to cost us big money, but we have no say at the big table as to which way Europe goes. Maybe it will go like the old football league and a new 'Premiership' of top nations will be born.


I was debating this point with my son, who works for a large car manufacturer.  He said, if we leave we will have to comply with European regulations, (on things like exhaust emissions etc) but we won't have any say in the drawing up of those regulations.....but then nor do we at the moment, because whatever BMW, Audi etc want, that's what they get!


----------



## Northerner (Jun 29, 2016)

I'd also add that I understand why so many Leave voters feel angry that they are being linked to the vocal fringe xenophobic element - in my case I am being tarred with being a 'hard-left Corbynista' rather than an ordinary member of the public who wanted someone who opposed the austerity choices being made both by the Tories and the other candidates in last year's GE. The current revolt in Labour is portrayed as the PLP having the support of the 'voters', as though I'm not one and my views are invalid.


----------



## Diabeticliberty (Jun 29, 2016)

Northerner said:


> I'd also add that I understand why so many Leave voters feel angry that they are being linked to the vocal fringe xenophobic element - in my case I am being tarred with being a 'hard-left Corbynista' rather than an ordinary member of the public who wanted someone who opposed the austerity choices being made both by the Tories and the other candidates in last year's GE. The current revolt in Labour is portrayed as the PLP having the support of the 'voters', as though I'm not one and my views are invalid.




I for one do not tar you as being a hard left Corbynista or anything else for that matter. I do not agree with some of the austerity measures either and I am certainly no Corbynista either. I do feel that however that I could not vote Labour under any circumstances with Jeremy Corbyn and John McDonnell at the front end of it. That leaves me and a lot of people like me with some rather unpleasant choices


----------



## grovesy (Jun 29, 2016)

I though when I saw Corbyn speak to the crowds on Monday, reminded me of the days of Aurthur Scargill rally the miners!


----------



## LeeGee (Jun 29, 2016)

I don't understand why no-one is questioning the validity of this referendum. If I fill out my tax return with a load of false claims and it comes to light that I have done so, I will have to fill out another accurate tax return (and face a fine). Does the tax man say, "Oh never mind, we are where we are, we'll accept your bogus return"? 
So can someone please explain why we can have a referendum (that's far more important than my tax return), filled with outright lies, and yet it is accepted by all and sundry?
 "The people have spoken, this is democracy, we are where we are, we must move forward.." etc etc. 
Am I living in some alternative reality whereby this is justifiable? Where's my tax return?


----------



## Pumper_Sue (Jun 29, 2016)

I hope this gives a clear explanation of the EU membership


----------



## Northerner (Jun 29, 2016)

Pumper_Sue said:


> I hope this gives a clear explanation of the EU membership


Prescient


----------



## Annette (Jun 29, 2016)

There's currently a trailer (on Dave I think) for a rerun of Yes Minister. it goes:
Its the truth, Minster.
I dont want the truth, I want something I can tell parliament!


----------



## trophywench (Jun 29, 2016)

I'm rally hacked off - because although I wanted 'out' for all the same reasons as Robin - I never imagined we'd get rid of the layabouts we want to get rid of - good grief, shedloads of them are home-grown anyway!

But then - I began to realise that people who are considerably more bolshy poisonous and detrimental than Nigel were actually gaining ground rapidly all over civilised Europe - and Donald Tusk could too and knows very well that if it wants to continue without serious public unrest throughout the continent - it MUST change.

I reckon Tusk amongst others who agree with him - was more than somewhat thinking, brill, this will be a scarily close result but they will Remain - and together we can get the changes we need and you want too, done!  So - I voted stay.

But - we have now collectively pulled the rug from under his feet.  I have absolutely no idea how bad it is going to get for anyone in Europe - and we are still part of the same continent we have been in since we floated away and became a collection of islands, so that includes us.

There is absolutely no point whatsoever of any of us being scared about it - it won't change a thing !


----------



## palmoff (Jun 29, 2016)

Don't worry although I would like to the leave the EU...
I knew from the outset and I know that we will be having a second referendum, and a third until we vote remain, happened before many times in other countries and it will happen again.
In the meantime expect the remainers in parliament to make the prospect of leaving the EU as painful as is possible, this is why cameroon isn't signing article 50 as he promised he would if leave won!


----------



## khskel (Jun 29, 2016)

Jeremy Corbyn reminds me a bit of some of the Joes I used to meet at area meetings when I was a civil service union rep in the early 80s


----------



## palmoff (Jun 29, 2016)

What is happening now with JC and cameron is that they are effectively causing as much chaos as possible, I expect the Cameron replacement to have swarms of people begging to hold another referendum to remain after the next few weeks terror campaign that is likely to ensue. Just watch gideon raise taxes, cut spending, while inflation rises and they create general pandemonium in order to get people to change their vote.

They will make it as uncomfortable as possible for us while they delay the signing of article 50 with a leadership election.


----------



## LeeGee (Jun 29, 2016)

Well we all know the song, "You can check out any time you like - but you can never leave."
If The UK splits from Europe - then Europe will fold. If Europe collapses, then the Soviets will want their old satellite countries back. That puts the Russians head-to-head with NATO. It's not beyond the realms of possibility that we are seeing the build up to WW3. Crazy? We live in a crazy world.


----------



## Northerner (Jun 30, 2016)

Ah! No worries, there has been interest in trade deals from Nigeria...! 

http://newsthump.com/2016/06/30/nig...trade-deals-claims-triumphant-leave-campaign/


----------



## Abi (Jun 30, 2016)

Hunt not now standing for PM I understand. Much as I loathe the mand and his handling of the NHS and uncompromising stance toward junior doctors, that latter may have stood the nation in good stead re EU negotations
" Dear EU. You will continue to trade with us without enforcing continued freedom of movement or any other restrictions/ caveats on our behalf. Love Jeremy H"


----------



## trophywench (Jun 30, 2016)

Yeah - and if you don't agree - I'll just impose it on you!

Oooer, they must be quaking in their boots ......


----------



## Amberzak (Jul 1, 2016)

I don't see that the government can call for a second referendum, or undermine the referendum. I voted remain, but I fear if the government said 'actually, we aren't listening to you lot who voted leave and we are staying in the EU,' there would be outcry. Riots. And the Xenophobic few (a very vocal but very small percentage of the leave voters) will simply take their frustrations out on the foreigners. It would turn very nasty, and just increase the chances of someone like Nigel Farage getting in. 

If we have to leave, then us remain voters should be putting our efforts into campaigning for the best possible deals, and making it clear to Europe that Farage doesn't speak for us.


----------



## Michael12420 (Jul 1, 2016)

I have refrained from contributing to this thread until now because I live in Spain and am British and therefore have a very personal 'Remain' standpoint. A week on from the vote I am still in a state of shock which is now careering towards one of desperation owing to the uncertainty that the British in Spain face. The present prime minister of Spain, who even after last Sunday's general election still has no overall majority, made his position clear before the referendum, Britain leaves the EU then British residents in Spain can 'look forward' to a) increased taxes on their properties, b) having to purchase yearly or two-yearly residence visas and most frighteningly of all c) the withdrawal of health care.

I have made one or two tentative Internet explorations of private health insurance, even more frightening.  Given my age and existing conditions, principally diabetes, the lowest monthly premium is just €4 short of my monthly state pension.  Totally unaffordable given that I also need to eat and pay taxes etc.  

It's all very sad and given that Article 50 has not yet been invoked it gives me a little more time to consider what I should be aiming to do over the next two years.


----------



## Northerner (Jul 1, 2016)

Michael12420 said:


> I have refrained from contributing to this thread until now because I live in Spain and am British and therefore have a very personal 'Remain' standpoint. A week on from the vote I am still in a state of shock which is now careering towards one of desperation owing to the uncertainty that the British in Spain face. The present prime minister of Spain, who even after last Sunday's general election still has no overall majority, made his position clear before the referendum, Britain leaves the EU then British residents in Spain can 'look forward' to a) increased taxes on their properties, b) having to purchase yearly or two-yearly residence visas and most frighteningly of all c) the withdrawal of health care.
> 
> I have made one or two tentative Internet explorations of private health insurance, even more frightening.  Given my age and existing conditions, principally diabetes, the lowest monthly premium is just €4 short of my monthly state pension.  Totally unaffordable given that I also need to eat and pay taxes etc.
> 
> It's all very sad and given that Article 50 has not yet been invoked it gives me a little more time to consider what I should be aiming to do over the next two years.


Extremely sorry to hear this Michael  Clearly, you need to make plans for the future, but I hope that once things have calmed down things will improve for you and all the other Brits living abroad.


----------



## Redkite (Jul 1, 2016)

Michael12420 said:


> I have refrained from contributing to this thread until now because I live in Spain and am British and therefore have a very personal 'Remain' standpoint. A week on from the vote I am still in a state of shock which is now careering towards one of desperation owing to the uncertainty that the British in Spain face. The present prime minister of Spain, who even after last Sunday's general election still has no overall majority, made his position clear before the referendum, Britain leaves the EU then British residents in Spain can 'look forward' to a) increased taxes on their properties, b) having to purchase yearly or two-yearly residence visas and most frighteningly of all c) the withdrawal of health care.
> 
> I have made one or two tentative Internet explorations of private health insurance, even more frightening.  Given my age and existing conditions, principally diabetes, the lowest monthly premium is just €4 short of my monthly state pension.  Totally unaffordable given that I also need to eat and pay taxes etc.
> 
> It's all very sad and given that Article 50 has not yet been invoked it gives me a little more time to consider what I should be aiming to do over the next two years.



Michael, you have my sympathy, this is just an appalling state of affairs .  Did you even get a vote in this travesty of a referendum?  My son's Dad is French and has lived and worked in the UK for 30 years.  He's paid tens of thousands in taxes in that time, and has never worked or paid taxes in France.  However, he had no vote in this idiocy, and now faces a very uncertain future indeed.  Nobody knows whether he will still be entitled to NHS healthcare, state pension, or any welfare benefit if he should fall on hard times.  Nobody thought through the consequences of leaving, there was no plan, and now millions of people like yourself and my ex husband are facing an abyss.


----------



## Michael12420 (Jul 1, 2016)

Thanks Redkite, yes I did have a vote although I had to fight hard for it and make a series of 'phone calls to the electoral registration department. I have only been away from the UK for 11 years and I know that voting privileges are withdrawn after 15 years away. I wanted to send my vote back by express post but this was denied as, for the first time ever, I had a pre-paid postal envelope.  I'm sure it got there in time.  A message for you and the father of your son - Doigts croisés.


----------



## LeeGee (Jul 1, 2016)

I know three couples in Spain that wanted to come back to the UK before the referendum, but couldn't do so because of the Spanish property crash. If Michael is correct, then they will have no choice but to sell up and return home for health reasons as none of them is overly well. This in itself will cause chaos on the Spanish market as there'll be a sudden glut of available properties and no UK buyers. I'm still hopeful that a deal will be done and we'll stay in, but then again I expected that the remain vote would easily win last week. It's going to be a rough road for a lot of innocent people.


----------



## Northerner (Jul 1, 2016)

Well, some 'good' news, sort of. Gove has said the NHS will get an extra £100m a week if he becomes PM.

From the Guardian website:



*Michael Gove has promised the NHS an extra £100m a week by 2020 at the launch of his bid to be the next Tory leader and prime minister. *The Vote Leave campaign, masterminded by Gove, had pledged an extra £350m a week for the NHS. Gove also said he would end free movement, introduce an Australian-style points-based system for immigration and bring numbers down. Gove said he was a reluctant candidate but “the best person to lead Britain out of the European Union”. Only five Tory MPs were at the launch despite previous reports that there had been a stampede of Johnson supporters to Gove.


----------



## Bloden (Jul 1, 2016)

We're determined to stay in Spain and enjoy living in the property my hubby's been pouring all his energy into for the last six years, but realise that it could be expensive. Also, will Europeans be so keen to learn English now that we're out - there goes my job! - or will German replace it as the EU's lingua franca? Hopefully, they'll choose a random (but beautiful ) language like Welsh and hubby'll be guaranteed work! We'll just have to take every day as it comes, both Brits living in the UK and abroad. We've been right royally screeeewed!


----------



## Robin (Jul 1, 2016)

Bloden said:


> We're determined to stay in Spain and enjoy living in the property my hubby's been pouring all his energy into for the last six years, but realise that it could be expensive. Also, will Europeans be so keen to learn English now that we're out - there goes my job! - or will German replace it as the EU's lingua franca? Hopefully, they'll choose a random (but beautiful ) language like Welsh and hubby'll be guaranteed work! We'll just have to take every day as it comes, both Brits living in the UK and abroad. We've been right royally screeeewed!


I think English speakers will still be needed. We were talking to one of our Spanish guides on holiday recently, and she said that she does a lot of guiding in English for the Korean, Japanese and Chinese tourists, because that's what the common language is. Mind you, in Córdoba, Cadiz and Granada, our English speaking guide was actually German!


----------



## Northerner (Jul 1, 2016)

A response to Gove's 'promise':


The British Medical Association has warned Michael Gove against using his pledge of £100m a week more for the NHS as “a false bribe to attract voters” and warned that the £5.2bn a year involved is small beer compared to the service’s projected £22bn deficit by 2020. 

Dr Mark Porter, the chair of council (leader) of the BMA, which represents 170,000 of Britain’s 250,000 doctors, said:

The NHS must not be used as a political football, as we have seen so often. There is a clear public appetite for extra NHS funding, but this shouldn’t be used as a false bribe to attract voters.

We must also be clear that even £100m per week would fill less than a quarter of the funding shortfall created by the current government.

The next prime minister must outline a clear and achievable plan to support the NHS and deliver on any promises made on NHS funding.

In the wake of last week’s vote they must also provide clarity and reassurance for the many thousands of EU citizens working in the health service, without whom the NHS could not survive.


----------



## LeeGee (Jul 1, 2016)

I love the way the Brexit mob demonise migrants, but suggest we spend £100m per week on more doctors and nurses - who come from where? We pinch doctors trained from all over the world. What we need is medical students to sign a contract to work for the NHS for ten years after their training. No sign up - no place at Med School (unless they fund themselves).


----------

