# Scales are stuck



## Radders (Jul 14, 2016)

Since February I've lost 21lbs through reducing eating and exercising more. It's been quite encouraging up til now, but the scales seem to have got stuck for the past three weeks. I want to lose another half a stone. 
I don't feel I can restrict my diet any more without being very hungry, and I'm already shattered with the exercise I'm doing (cycling 4 miles each way and a 1mile brisk walk at lunchtime). I'm eating between 75 and 150g carbs a day and am vegetarian so don't think a lower carb diet would work for me. I also have IBS and a tendency to heartburn and need to eat every 4 hours during the day and plenty of fibre. 
What really worries me is that if I am not losing weight, does this mean that I now have to stick to this amount of food for ever to avoid putting it back on again? If so it is only a matter of time before I will fall off the wagon! 
I'm not sure anyone can really help, but if you have experienced this and got over it I'd love to hear about it!


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## grovesy (Jul 14, 2016)

It is common to plateau at times when trying to lose weight. Sometimes it starts to fall off again.


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## Martin Canty (Jul 14, 2016)

Hi Radders, have you tried Intermittent Fasting? It's amazing what a day's fast can do to the body; I too was stuck for a while & then after fasting for a day the scales started to move again.

Another strategy is to drink a lot of water (not gallons but definitely more than a couple of liters a day)


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## Ljc (Jul 14, 2016)

Hi,  I've found when I've reached that plateau, if I eat more for awhile it tells the body it's no longer being starved, so it comes out of its starvation mode. 
You say you're shattered with all the exersize , I suggest you cut it down , maybe lose the lunchtime brisk walk.  Remember this D lark is a marathon not a sprint.
Sorry if this is not what you want to hear but I thought it needed to be said.


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## Radders (Jul 14, 2016)

Martin Canty said:


> Hi Radders, have you tried Intermittent Fasting? It's amazing what a day's fast can do to the body; I too was stuck for a while & then after fasting for a day the scales started to move again.
> 
> Another strategy is to drink a lot of water (not gallons but definitely more than a couple of liters a day)


Hi Martin, I have contemplated fasting but i think it would play havoc with My blood sugars in two ways: liver dumps while fasting, and hypos the next day. I already have these problems when attempting basal testing and on the days after a particularly low carb day. How do you find managing your sugars with the fasts?


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## Radders (Jul 14, 2016)

Ljc said:


> Hi,  I've found when I've reached that plateau, if I eat more for awhile it tells the body it's no longer being starved, so it comes out of its starvation mode.
> You say you're shattered with all the exersize , I suggest you cut it down , maybe lose the lunchtime brisk walk.  Remember this D lark is a marathon not a sprint.
> Sorry if this is not what you want to hear but I thought it needed to be said.


Thanks Ljc. Some things to think about. I fear that if I eat more, I will regain what I've lost. I thought starvation mode only happened on very low calorie diets? When you've done this have you still eaten less than you would need or do you eat what you think you would need to maintain? 

The lunchtime walk is quite useful in combatting post meal spikes as my job sometimes involves long periods seated in front of a computer. I think you're right about the exercise though, I overdid it a bit last weekend with an extra 7 Mile bike ride and a 750m swim - I probably need a bit of a rest at the weekends!


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## Ljc (Jul 14, 2016)

Hi.to be honest I've just eaten more. I don't mean cakes and other goodies, though I would if I gave myself half a chance lol. 
Could it be that your using up more calories than you think you are with the exersize.


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## Martin Canty (Jul 14, 2016)

Radders said:


> How do you find managing your sugars with the fasts


Ah, forgot to check if you were insulin dependent..... I guess that would change the game a little.

I control my T2 with diet, exercise & Metformin so it would be extremely unlikely for me to go Hypo. I would suggest LCHF, but the IBS might be an issue, but certainly more fat would help with the energy levels.

Ljc  has mentioned another strategy that may work & I have heard it mentioned many times.

At the end of the day, weight management is about balancing calories in vs calories out & a deficit will always result in weight loss no matter how our bodies piss & moan about it!!!

Another thought (right before I hit "Post") are you sure to are just not gaining a little more muscle mass because of the increased exercise? Muscle does weigh significantly more.


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## Radders (Jul 14, 2016)

According to the app on my phone, the cycling uses about 400 calories. I don't actually count how many I eat as I have to count carbs and it just seems too much to count calories as well, but I estimate my intake to be 1200-1500 a day. I was losing on average a pound a week until 3 weeks ago, which is a 500 a day deficit so  my daily needs on that account must be very low indeed.


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## Martin Canty (Jul 14, 2016)

Fortunately I have one of those clever scales which calculate other things & advises that my BMR is a little over 1750 calories so the assumption of 2000 calories a day may be off.....

Having said that I have not counted a calorie in years, its all about the carbs for me


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## Radders (Jul 14, 2016)

Martin Canty said:


> Ah, forgot to check if you were insulin dependent..... I guess that would change the game a little.
> 
> I control my T2 with diet, exercise & Metformin so it would be extremely unlikely for me to go Hypo. I would suggest LCHF, but the IBS might be an issue, but certainly more fat would help with the energy levels.
> 
> ...



I hope so about the muscle, But where's it coming from?! I eat a reasonable amount of fat in eggs, cheese, nuts and seeds, but probably not as much as average because of being veggie. I can't stand oil or any other kind of dressing on salad otherwise I would!


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## Radders (Jul 14, 2016)

Martin Canty said:


> Fortunately I have one of those clever scales which calculate other things & advises that my BMR is a little over 1750 calories so the assumption of 2000 calories a day may be off.....
> 
> Having said that I have not counted a calorie in years, its all about the carbs for me



Yes, me too. Doesn't BMR depend partly on your weight? Also I thought BMR was what you need if you stay on the sofa all day, hence why it is so low?


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## Ljc (Jul 14, 2016)

Martin Canty said:


> Ah, forgot to check if you were insulin dependent..... I guess that would change the game a little.
> 
> I control my T2 with diet, exercise & Metformin so it would be extremely unlikely for me to go Hypo. I would suggest LCHF, but the IBS might be an issue, but certainly more fat would help with the energy levels.
> 
> ...



You could well be right thanks for reminding me ,muscle does weigh more than fat , so if you gain muscle you would start to gain weight
@Radders , something else for you to think about , sorry.


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## trophywench (Jul 14, 2016)

Butter?  Cake made with almond 'flour' with Greek yoghurt as well as eggs to provide the moisture required,  fresh cream on berries, whipped and spread on the cake .....  Lots of ways of consuming fat, so so easily LOL


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## Radders (Jul 14, 2016)

I just did the BMR thing on a website and it says mine is 1430. They say if you are moderately active you multiply by 1.55 so that would put me at just over 2100 (no calculator handy but it's all rough anyway). So I must have been eating 1600 calories on average. i'd be happy to carry on losing at that rate or even more slowly.


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## Ljc (Jul 14, 2016)

trophywench said:


> Butter?  Cake made with almond 'flour' with Greek yoghurt as well as eggs to provide the moisture required,  fresh cream on berries, whipped and spread on the cake .....  Lots of ways of consuming fat, so so easily LOL


Thanks so much , that Barmbrack that was sitting quietly in my cupboard is now calling me, I will resist, I will resist .....


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## Radders (Jul 14, 2016)

trophywench said:


> Butter?  Cake made with almond 'flour' with Greek yoghurt as well as eggs to provide the moisture required,  fresh cream on berries, whipped and spread on the cake .....  Lots of ways of consuming fat, so so easily LOL


Liking the sound of the cake, how do you make it sweet? I eat Full fat Greek yoghurt once a week, yum. Not sure what I would put the butter on though. We're not cooking at the moment, just eating salads. I did have some beautiful mushrooms out last weekend which were probably cooked in butter, yum! I sometimes put cream on berries but not keen to be honest.


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## trophywench (Jul 14, 2016)

Granulated Splenda (well I use Tesco's OB) - it still has carbs but one heck of a lot less than sugar, and you only need a quarter as much of it as you would, sugar.  Liquid sweeteners are even sweeter.  You do need something to sweeten to counteract the tanginess of the yog.  I make excellent cheese muffins (no sweetener LOL) (plus eg onion, or sundried tomatoes - bit of cooked bacon, whatever you fancy - and these can be cheddar, blue stilton, parmesan, whatever cheese you happen to have handy - a mixture of all the bits left over if you want) using the same basis.

For the savoury it's
Preheat oven to 100 c

55g yoghurt
55g butter melted
2 eggs
85g ground almonds
I rounded teaspoon baking powder (v important the baking powder with the almond flour)
25g strong cheese grated, plus a bit extra to sprinkle on the top
3 or 4 'pieces' of sundried toms, chopped (or chopped onion or whatever you decide to sling in)
Pepper to season (don't need salt cos of the cheese)

Combine the wet ingredients then fold in the dry ones, then beat the resultant batter a bit.  Doesn't require 'light hands' or anything complicated.

Makes about 8 muffins.  Divide between paper cases/silicon moulds on a baking sheet.  Put on middle shelf for 20 mins - try with a skewer - as per cake - if it's wet, leave it a bit longer till it isn't.

Take out and put on rack to cool - but don't try to get out of the cases till they've cooled a bit - then they come off dead easy.

Preparation start to finish takes about 15 minutes and you've washed up and been twiddling your thumbs quite a while before you can try one!


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## Ljc (Jul 15, 2016)

trophywench said:


> Granulated Splenda (well I use Tesco's OB) - it still has carbs but one heck of a lot less than sugar, and you only need a quarter as much of it as you would, sugar.  Liquid sweeteners are even sweeter.  You do need something to sweeten to counteract the tanginess of the yog.  I make excellent cheese muffins (no sweetener LOL) (plus eg onion, or sundried tomatoes - bit of cooked bacon, whatever you fancy - and these can be cheddar, blue stilton, parmesan, whatever cheese you happen to have handy - a mixture of all the bits left over if you want) using the same basis.
> 
> For the savoury it's
> Preheat oven to 100 c
> ...


Oh yum. 
Who fancies a day out at TWs


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## Radders (Jul 15, 2016)

Those sound wonderful, is almond flour widely available? Years ago I bought loads of different low carb flours online but I didn't enjoy the bread I made and most of it went in the compost after sitting in the back of a cupboard for a few months! 
I use Splenda to sweeten things but I wasn't sure it would work in a cake?


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## trophywench (Jul 15, 2016)

I'll have a look for the basic 'Pound cake' recipe to tell you the amounts.  Ground Almonds are available in all supermarkets, it isn't billed as 'flour' usually.  It's used in shedloads of ordinary bakery (eg Bakewell Tart) as well as marzipan and always has been!  I haven't bought any very recently but Aldi used to be a bit cheaper than Tescos etc. It's usually with the normal Baking stuff - but might just be with the Nuts.


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## Radders (Jul 15, 2016)

Oh! I always thought almond flour would be much more finely milled than ground almonds! Thank you for enlightening me! So do you just replace the normal flour with almond flour in recipes or do you need to adjust the fats as well?


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## Martin Canty (Jul 15, 2016)

Radders said:


> So do you just replace the normal flour with almond flour


Almond flour tends to be a little sweeter as well so adjust any sweeteners you may use....

As for the fat, 2/3 of the calories are from fat content (vs 0 for regular flour); I don't bake so I wouldn't know how to adjust for that but will be trying to make bread from almond & coconut flour when I get some "essential gluten"


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## Radders (Jul 15, 2016)

I think the bread I tried was a mixture of soya, flax and hazelnut with gluten. The rise was brilliant, I just didn't enjoy the rather greasy texture and flavour.


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## trophywench (Jul 15, 2016)

No - the batter needs to be wetter than eg a 'creamed' variety of ordinary flour cake, because the gr almonds don't absorb anywhere near as much liquid as wheat flour does, 'raw'.  It does as it heats up in the oven though.  It's one of the reasons you need to melt the butter and mix it with the yog then add the eggs, otherwise the hot butter will just start turning the eggs into omelette LOL - I didn't tell you that in the Method I know - sorry!

It's actually finer than you imagine, @Radders - sieve it through your normal metal flour sieve if you don't believe me!

The cheese buns are a tad greasy - use less butter and slightly more yoghurt? - but the final raw mix MUST be 'loose' and drop off a spoon easily into the baking 'mould'(s)


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## Radders (Jul 16, 2016)

Thanks Jenny, that's really helpful to know. I love almonds, so happy that I can use them in yummy lower carb baking!


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## Radders (Jul 17, 2016)

Not happy. I decided to do some research into weight loss plateaux and discovered that the idea that I might not be eating enough, and therefore not losing weight, is a myth, so somehow I just have to either cut back more or exercise more. Darn! 
http://www.weightwatchers.com/util/art/index_art.aspx?tabnum=1&art_id=35501


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## Ljc (Jul 17, 2016)

All I can say Radders is that it worked for me.


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## Radders (Jul 18, 2016)

Thanks Ljc, did it work straight away, ie did you start losing weight when you were eating more, or was it only after you had started reducing your calories again?


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## Radders (Jul 22, 2016)

According to the scales at the clinic I am one pound less, so maybe my scales are indeed stuck!


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## Ljc (Jul 22, 2016)

Radders said:


> Thanks Ljc, did it work straight away, ie did you start losing weight when you were eating more, or was it only after you had started reducing your calories again?


It's been a while , I think I took in a few more calories for a week then reduced them again.
Ah it like looks like it was your scales fault


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## Radders (Jul 27, 2016)

Grrrr! After finding the bad news that plateaux are more often than not the result of eating more calories than you think, I have been counting, weighing and measuring everything and am confident that my daily intake is around 1300 Kc per day, but still no weight loss. This is getting very frustrating!


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## Radders (Jul 30, 2016)

Finally! After 9 weeks of being "good" I seem to have shed approximately 3lbs in the past week! Bizarre.


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## Robin (Jul 30, 2016)

Radders said:


> Finally! After 9 weeks of being "good" I seem to have shed approximately 3lbs in the past week! Bizarre.


I'm not aiming to lose weight, just maintain the status quo, and I mysteriously gained two pounds in as many days the week before last. Then I shed them this week. The only thing I can put it down to is the hot weather, I think the body tends to hang on to fluid when it's hot, and release it when it cools down. (I know I always need the loo a lot if the weather suddenly turns cold, or I go into a chilly air conditioned atmosphere)


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## Lilian (Jul 30, 2016)

Splenda is one of the powdered sweeteners that work very well being cooked.    I remember the time when Splenda was not licensed in the UK so had to order it from the U.S.    One day I had put in a bulk order, quite costly especially with the duty added on.  It was so long ago now that I cannot recall how it happened or why, but my dog ate through the carboard and spilled the whole lot all over my kitchen floor.


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## Radders (Jul 30, 2016)

Robin said:


> I'm not aiming to lose weight, just maintain the status quo, and I mysteriously gained two pounds in as many days the week before last. Then I shed them this week. The only thing I can put it down to is the hot weather, I think the body tends to hang on to fluid when it's hot, and release it when it cools down. (I know I always need the loo a lot if the weather suddenly turns cold, or I go into a chilly air conditioned atmosphere)


Oh I hope that's not it, I really want to shed fat!


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## Robin (Jul 30, 2016)

Radders said:


> Oh I hope that's not it, I really want to shed fat!


You probably have! What I'm trying to say is, you probably lost those three pounds of fat a couple of weeks ago, it just didn't show up because of the water retention thing. So hopefully you're on your way to shedding the next few pounds already.


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## Radders (Jul 30, 2016)

Robin said:


> You probably have! What I'm trying to say is, you probably lost those three pounds of fat a couple of weeks ago, it just didn't show up because of the water retention thing. So hopefully you're on your way to shedding the next few pounds already.


Oh yes, I see what you mean. Yay! I like that theory and shall definitely adopt it, thank you!


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## Lilian (Jul 30, 2016)

When you are not losing weight, measure yourself.   You often find that when weight is not being lost (and you have not cheated) then size is.   As the fat cells release fat they fill up with water until eventually the water goes as well.


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## Radders (Jul 30, 2016)

I've recently been measuring my waist so will see what happens. My waist measurement goes down considerably overnight: I wear a Velcro belt to hold my pump and it's always very loose in the morning. Still 35" though. :-(


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## Radders (Aug 14, 2016)

Yay! After seeing no loss for two months, the last half stone has finally departed! Only an inch off the waist though (and only if I measure it first thing in the morning). I now have to decide whether I believe the crude rule of thumb that tells me that my waist measurement puts me at high risk of cancer, high bp, insulin resistance etc and attempt to continue, or accept that I am meant to be apple shaped and work out how to maintain my current weight.
Maintenance has always been difficult for me because I don't want to continue counting calories for the rest of my life and saying no to temptation constantly, but in the past I have managed to maintain until something stressful or sad happens and then the weight has piled back on and my overeating has returned. 
Does anyone else suffer chronic compulsive overeating except when they're on a diet?


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## Robin (Aug 14, 2016)

I've decided to ignore the waist hip ratio thing. I'm borderline, and if I plug in one set of figures to an online calculator, it says I'm low risk, but if I pull the tape measure tighter and knock half an inch off my hips, it immediately tells me I'm high risk for heart attacks, high BP, et etc ( and my current BP is 98 over 52). If I tried to lose weight to reduce my waist, chances are I'd lose it off my hips, (as I did when I got very skinny pre diagnosis) and be even worse on the scale.
As to the compulsive overeating bit, I always do that when I'm stressed. I'm trying to teach myself to chill out a bit.


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## Radders (Aug 14, 2016)

Robin said:


> I've decided to ignore the waist hip ratio thing. I'm borderline, and if I plug in one set of figures to an online calculator, it says I'm low risk, but if I pull the tape measure tighter and knock half an inch off my hips, it immediately tells me I'm high risk for heart attacks, high BP, et etc ( and my current BP is 98 over 52). If I tried to lose weight to reduce my waist, chances are I'd lose it off my hips, (as I did when I got very skinny pre diagnosis) and be even worse on the scale.
> As to the compulsive overeating bit, I always do that when I'm stressed. I'm trying to teach myself to chill out a bit.


Thanks for your response Robin, it's good to know I am not alone. Trouble is it's not just the waist to hip ratio that's too high but also the actual waist measurement. To get my waist below 32" I would have to weigh less than 10 stone which makes me look gaunt. I have a slendertone belt which I have successfully used in the past to reduce my waist a little, but I understand that it does not reduce visceral fat so although it will make it easier to buy clothes that fit, it does nothing for the risk!


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## Robin (Aug 14, 2016)

Radders said:


> Thanks for your response Robin, it's good to know I am not alone. Trouble is it's not just the waist to hip ratio that's too high but also the actual waist measurement. To get my waist below 32" I would have to weigh less than 10 stone which makes me look gaunt. I have a slendertone belt which I have successfully used in the past to reduce my waist a little, but I understand that it does not reduce visceral fat so although it will make it easier to buy clothes that fit, it does nothing for the risk!


There was a thing about this on Trust me I'm a Doctor recently, when they had various groups doing different things. They discovered that only losing weight all over had the effect of losing visceral fat, and those who did sit ups to develop their stomach muscles lost inches round their waists, but no actual visceral fat. But presumably that group then had OK hip/waist ratios, but hadn't actually lowered their risk.
My waist is 29 in the morning, and 30-31 later on in the day. I'm very short waisted, so there's not a lot of room between the bottom of my rib cage and my hips, so it's all got to go somewhere! When I was pregnant, I flummoxed my GP by the top of the uterus meeting my ribs months earlier than it should have done, causing her to question my dates!


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## Radders (Aug 14, 2016)

Robin said:


> There was a thing about this on Trust me I'm a Doctor recently, when they had various groups doing different things. They discovered that only losing weight all over had the effect of losing visceral fat, and those who did sit ups to develop their stomach muscles lost inches round their waists, but no actual visceral fat. But presumably that group then had OK hip/waist ratios, but hadn't actually lowered their risk.
> My waist is 29 in the morning, and 30-31 later on in the day. I'm very short waisted, so there's not a lot of room between the bottom of my rib cage and my hips, so it's all got to go somewhere! When I was pregnant, I flummoxed my GP by the top of the uterus meeting my ribs months earlier than it should have done, causing her to question my dates!


You're positively hourglass compared with me with my 34" girth! 

The results you quote do cast doubt on the use of waist measurement as the sole indicator of visceral fat. I have always been puzzled about how 32" can be the cut-off point for every female regardless of height and build. I wonder whether there's any other way of working out how much of the stuff I am carrying.


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