# Carbs



## Nicklby (Jul 7, 2022)

Hi. I would like to know why the dietary recommendations still include encourage Fruit and Veg over Red Meat. Surely the Fruit recommended , especially apples are high in sugar - fructose and glucose ? Has Prof Tim Noakes been discounted ?


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## Leadinglights (Jul 7, 2022)

Nicklby said:


> Hi. I would like to know why the dietary recommendations still include encourage Fruit and Veg over Red Meat. Surely the Fruit recommended , especially apples are high in sugar - fructose and glucose ? Has Prof Tim Noakes been discounted ?


Welcome to the forum
Whose dietary recommendations are you referring to?
There are many ways people manage their condition, and several approaches that people use to bring down glucose levels, low calorie, low carbohydrate, shakes based regimes and also dietary recommendation are quite generic and will be aimed at people of all diabetic types. People have to make their own decisions about how they manage their condition. Everybody is different and some may be able to tolerate fruit like apples others may not and will stick to fruits like berries which in general are lower carb. As for red meat again that has to be a personal choice as people may have other health considerations.
Certainly vegetables are an important part of most dietary approaches.


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## travellor (Jul 7, 2022)

Nicklby said:


> Hi. I would like to know why the dietary recommendations still include encourage Fruit and Veg over Red Meat. Surely the Fruit recommended , especially apples are high in sugar - fructose and glucose ? Has Prof Tim Noakes been discounted ?



Erm, red meat?
I believed you hunt it yourself, with a pointy stick, it's good.
If you drive to Tesco, and pick a shrink wrapped steak off the chiller cabinet, you shouldn't bother anymore.


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## helli (Jul 8, 2022)

Nicklby said:


> Hi. I would like to know why the dietary recommendations still include encourage Fruit and Veg over Red Meat. Surely the Fruit recommended , especially apples are high in sugar - fructose and glucose ? Has Prof Tim Noakes been discounted ?


As is said at the top of every page on the forum "Everyone manages their health differently."


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## Nicklby (Jul 8, 2022)

travellor said:


> Erm, red meat?
> I believed you hunt it yourself, with a pointy stick, it's good.
> If you drive to Tesco, and pick a shrink wrapped steak off the chiller cabinet, you shouldn't bother anymore.


Happy that you "Mediterranean Diet " is working - despite there being very little evidence to support it - the only study I am aware of is Ansel Keys now discredited study, where he went (during Lent, when they were fasting from red mat and dairy) and analysed the diets of a very small control group. The entire US and therefore UK dietary recommendation is based on this non - scientist's theories.


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## Eddy Edson (Jul 8, 2022)

Nicklby said:


> Happy that you "Mediterranean Diet " is working - despite there being very little evidence to support it - the only study I am aware of is Ansel Keys now discredited study, where he went (during Lent, when they were fasting from red mat and dairy) and analysed the diets of a very small control group. The entire US and therefore UK dietary recommendation is based on this non - scientist's theories.


Nope


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## trophywench (Jul 8, 2022)

Always made me guffaw - I'd love to adopt a Mediterranean diet, providing the hot sunshine and waiter service etc comes with it.  Plus I've never yet seen churros, gelato, stuffed vine leaves, saganaki or home brewed raki on offer at any pavement cafe round either Kidderminster or Bedworth .....


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## travellor (Jul 8, 2022)

Nicklby said:


> Happy that you "Mediterranean Diet " is working - despite there being very little evidence to support it - the only study I am aware of is Ansel Keys now discredited study, where he went (during Lent, when they were fasting from red mat and dairy) and analysed the diets of a very small control group. The entire US and therefore UK dietary recommendation is based on this non - scientist's theories.



Ah, I'm not a zealot.
I don't need anyone to "prove " my diet works or doesn't.
I don't need to quote studies off the internet to prove or disprove what I decide to do.
I don't need to force others to believe.
As to what you are "aware" of, again, what's that got to do with diabetes, or me?

I'm comfortable in my skin, all I need is a sample size of one for it to work for.


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## travellor (Jul 8, 2022)

trophywench said:


> Always made me guffaw - I'd love to adopt a Mediterranean diet, providing the hot sunshine and waiter service etc comes with it.  Plus I've never yet seen churros, gelato, stuffed vine leaves, saganaki or home brewed raki on offer at any pavement cafe round either Kidderminster or Bedworth .....


Really? 
I have an excellent restaurant around the corner.
Not to say I don't have vine leaves in the house either.
Having said that, the Mediterranean diet covers a slightly bigger region than you are thinking of there I suspect.

As to churros,

The local Street market do them.

As to temperature, mid 20's, bright sunshine, drinks in the hot tub, that'll do me.


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## Nicklby (Jul 8, 2022)

travellor said:


> Ah, I'm not a zealot.
> I don't need anyone to "prove " my diet works or doesn't.
> I don't need to quote studies off the internet to prove or disprove what I decide to do.
> I don't need to force others to believe.
> ...


Excellent. Have a happy day.


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## trophywench (Jul 8, 2022)

Yeah but No but - churros have never tasted quite the same as they did in c.1976 available from a shack on a bit of waste ground just outside Palamos deep fried in - well - basically what always looked like a repurposed oil drum.  I'm not haying it isn't better for sanitary purposes or H&S generally to have mains electric and modern deep fat friers - just another bit of random nostalgia!

Last 'real tasting' ones I had were c. 20 years ago after attending the Valencia Moto GP but still on the race circuit site and not bothering to rush back to the carpark since we knew full well there'd be 'just a bit of traffic congestion' to plough through!


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## harbottle (Jul 8, 2022)

High expectations of Bedworth! (Or is out Bedduf?)


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## Lynne888 (Jul 8, 2022)

travellor said:


> Really?
> I have an excellent restaurant around the corner.
> Not to say I don't have vine leaves in the house either.
> Having said that, the Mediterranean diet covers a slightly bigger region than you are thinking of there I suspect.
> ...


Oh the joy of churros from Bridgnorth street food market. I'd crawl on my hands and knees to get them and I'm in Wales now! (miss Shropshire HUGELY though!)


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## NotWorriedAtAll (Jul 8, 2022)

trophywench said:


> Always made me guffaw - I'd love to adopt a Mediterranean diet, providing the hot sunshine and waiter service etc comes with it.  Plus I've never yet seen churros, gelato, stuffed vine leaves, saganaki or home brewed raki on offer at any pavement cafe round either Kidderminster or Bedworth .....


Lived in Greece for a few years and the mediterranean diet was very heavy on charred barbecued, grilled, fried and roast meat to the point where being a vegetarian was considered someone who only ate chicken!!!  Lots of chips, sugary, syrupy pastries and lots of cheese and butter. Not a lot of fish because that was sold to posh restaurants - the population mostly ate meat, gyros, pizzas with the wonderful horta which I loved.


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## Leadinglights (Jul 8, 2022)

NotWorriedAtAll said:


> Lived in Greece for a few years and the mediterranean diet was very heavy on charred barbecued, grilled, fried and roast meat to the point where being a vegetarian was considered someone who only ate chicken!!!  Lots of chips, sugary, syrupy pastries and lots of cheese and butter. Not a lot of fish because that was sold to posh restaurants - the population mostly ate meat, gyros, pizzas with the wonderful horta which I loved.


We really struggled in Greece as my daughter is vegetarian. Most of the starters in places were good so she just ordered a couple of those but it was difficult to get them to bring my main course at the same time. Mind you it was nearly 25 years ago.


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## trophywench (Jul 8, 2022)

Horta hot or cold - let's face it a salad (or cooked greens) anywhere around the Med just dressed with  a drop of good olive oil and lemon juice/wine vinegar is utterly fab.  Hardly ever the same greens on offer in different settings either years ago - whatever was growing locally and in season this week.


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## travellor (Jul 8, 2022)

The Turkish coast is the place for fish.
Freshly caught and cooked in front of you.


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## helli (Jul 8, 2022)

Leadinglights said:


> We really struggled in Greece as my daughter is vegetarian. Most of the starters in places were good so she just ordered a couple of those but it was difficult to get them to bring my main course at the same time. Mind you it was nearly 25 years ago.


I think things have improved.
Last time I went to Greece they called the, small plates and came out at the same time as the mains and had a huge veggie option.
It seemed to be common in lots of restaurants around Corfu.


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## travellor (Jul 10, 2022)




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## travellor (Jul 20, 2022)

Advent Calendars from Thursday, 03.11. at Lidl UK
					

Advent Calendars from Thursday, 03.11. at Lidl UK




					www.lidl.co.uk
				




And we have the weather as well now.


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## DeeM (Jul 26, 2022)

Nicklby said:


> Happy that you "Mediterranean Diet " is working - despite there being very little evidence to support it - the only study I am aware of is Ansel Keys now discredited study, where he went (during Lent, when they were fasting from red mat and dairy) and analysed the diets of a very small control group. The entire US and therefore UK dietary recommendation is based on this non - scientist's theories.


Hi @Nicklby. I’m new too - newly diagnosed late onset Type 1, which has led me to dust down and remind myself of some of my former reading and knowledge around healthy eating.

I have just re-read the updated ‘Eat, Drink and Be Healthy: The Harvard Medical School Guide to Healthy Eating’ by Prof Walter Willett, so my eye was caught by your mentioning lack of evidence re the Mediterranean diet. The book sums up the best guidance from the most robust scientific evidence (eg decades of prospective studies, clinical trials, RCTs etc, following thousands and thousands of people) about healthy eating and nutrition, roundly condemning the official US and UK guidance (which has always been skewed by lobbying from the meat and dairy industries, plus other business and/or agricultural interests) and being totally clear about what can be proved and what can’t in this very complex field. The science has gone well beyond Ancel Keys and does largely point to the key elements of a ‘Mediterranean’ diet - loads of fruit and veg (with the emphasis on veg), fish, chicken, nuts, pulses etc for majority of protein, plenty of healthy (mono or polyunsaturated) fats, and relatively low carb ie. lower amounts of whole grain (low GL) carbs, as the healthiest diet for the majority of people. 

This pretty much backs up what the healthy eating sections in the Learning Zone are saying. However, it very much supports the mantra on here that everyone needs to find what works for them - as the science shows that there isn’t a ‘magic bullet’ that works for everyone, and some people apparently do better on low fat while others do better on low carb (I mean in the general pop, not amongst those of us with diabetes).

Here is the link to the book if anyone is interested:





						Eat, Drink, and Be Healthy: The Harvard Medical School Guide to Healthy Eating eBook : Willett M.D., Walter, P.J. Skerrett, P.J. Skerrett: Amazon.co.uk: Books
					

Eat, Drink, and Be Healthy: The Harvard Medical School Guide to Healthy Eating eBook : Willett M.D., Walter, P.J. Skerrett, P.J. Skerrett: Amazon.co.uk: Books



					www.amazon.co.uk


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## travellor (Jul 26, 2022)

World Cup Crazy from Thursday, 10.11. at Lidl UK
					

World Cup Crazy from Thursday, 10.11. at Lidl UK




					www.lidl.co.uk
				




We're on a roll here.


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## Drummer (Jul 26, 2022)

I feel completely rejuvenated by my diet - so much so that I have taken a couple of weeks off work and bought a camper van - not quite a VW microbus, and I am going to a folk festival.
As the smell of my breakfast wafts across the morning air I will be the envy of many.


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## Martin62 (Jul 26, 2022)

travellor said:


> World Cup Crazy from Thursday, 10.11. at Lidl UK
> 
> 
> World Cup Crazy from Thursday, 10.11. at Lidl UK
> ...


Good old Lidl, I was in a Lidl in Portugal a couple of weeks back and wondered if they had a  U.K. week


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## travellor (Jul 26, 2022)

Drummer said:


> I feel completely rejuvenated by my diet - so much so that I have taken a couple of weeks off work and bought a camper van - not quite a VW microbus, and I am going to a folk festival.
> As the smell of my breakfast wafts across the morning air I will be the envy of many.



Folk festival?
Breakfast is any left over cans of lager from the night before with bacon on a nice couple of slices of thick crusty white bread.
What van have you got?


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## travellor (Jul 26, 2022)

Martin62 said:


> Good old Lidl, I was in a Lidl in Portugal a couple of weeks back and wondered if they had a  U.K. week


Cheddar cheese specials.


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## Drummer (Jul 26, 2022)

Breakfast most mornings will be water to wash down the mushroom stir fry with the local butcher's sausages, cooked with a little onion.
I got a 2005 Volkswagen lt46 tdi, LWB, rebadged down for a normal licence. It has a couple of solar panels on the roof and a chimney for the little stove.


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## travellor (Jul 26, 2022)

Drummer said:


> Breakfast most mornings will be water to wash down the mushroom stir fry with the local butcher's sausages, cooked with a little onion.
> I got a 2005 Volkswagen lt46 tdi, LWB, rebadged down for a normal licence. It has a couple of solar panels on the roof and a chimney for the little stove.


Sounds good.
Ready for a few off grid adventures this summer.


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