# Theme parks



## Adrienne (Jul 24, 2009)

Hi

Someone asked what parks did the exit passes still for children with type 1.   At this moment in time, I know that Chessington do not but we are working on it.    The other parks in their group which I believe are : 

Thorpe Park
Alton Towers
Legoland (perhaps)

They all do provide exit passes at the moment.    According to Chessington they will all be changing that in the winter based on information from DUK that 80% of all diabetics are stable and provided them with a leaflet on adult type 1 and adult type 2.    This was to cover all children as well !!!! Beggars believe yet again on the part of DUK.    Do they now think kids get diabetes.   Where were they when the recent stats were collected and published   ie 23,000 type 1 children in England alone and 368 type 2 children in England.   Shame on them once again !    

Sorry I digress...........


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## Northerner (Jul 24, 2009)

It's utter nonsense for DUK to suggest that children are the same as adults - they are completely different. Goodness, I should know, I was once a child! Why don't they? Insulin is a hormone. Adrenalin and cortisol and glucagon are hormones. There are many other hormones, and they all have a significant effect on the way a body works and reacts -*particularly if you are a growing child!!!*

A day out at a theme park must be a particular treat for a small child with diabetes - who has to contend with so much each day that a non-diabetic child doesn't. It wouldn't cost these companies a fortune to give a concession, and I don't see how it could be abused if accompanied by the relevant documentation. 

Give the kids a break! Let them have fun! Live a day in their shoes (or, indeed, their parents shoes!)

Adrienne, I wish you and your friends every success in educating these companies and (for goodness sake!) DUK!!!


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## Adrienne (Jul 24, 2009)

Thank you very much Northerner.   We are going softly softly at the moment.  I happen to be going to Chessington with a group of 33 people, with the local childrens diabetes support group in September so I will damn well want some answers when I go !!!  Not so softly softly if they have been bad people !!!


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## bev (Jul 24, 2009)

Oooh - should we start a petition?Bev


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## Adrienne (Jul 24, 2009)

bev said:


> Oooh - should we start a petition?Bev



It may well get to that again if necessary Bev, you never know.   x


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## bev (Jul 24, 2009)

Well i will be on the list - and if you need help with anything let me know.Bev


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## katie (Jul 24, 2009)

good idea


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## Adrienne (Jul 24, 2009)

Thanks guys


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## aymes (Sep 1, 2009)

Resurrecting an old thread but saw this article and I thought it might be of interest to those of you who are campaigning for the theme park thing, obviously not diabetes related but it may be of help.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/8232633.stm


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## Sugarbum (Sep 1, 2009)

aymes said:


> Resurrecting an old thread but saw this article and I thought it might be of interest to those of you who are campaigning for the theme park thing, obviously not diabetes related but it may be of help.
> 
> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/8232633.stm



Thats a realy interesting article aymes....it certainly provokes some thought.

I used to do volly work with mencap and the winged fellowship and we would always use the exit passes, with wheelchairs and people with other requirements also. We used to have such amazing times, Ive got such fond memories of it although it was a few (decades?!) years back....I cant imagine how we would have done it otherwise. Its such an important topic.


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## SamInnocent (Sep 2, 2009)

Um... I've had Type 1 since I was 3 (30 years) and have never expected to be treated differently when it comes to queuing. Surely all you need to do is make sure you carry the kid's blood testing kit, insulin and glucose tablets so that if he's queuing for a long time you have all the "tools" to deal with whatever happens?

I've been to Alton Towers and other theme parks many times and never expected to be sent through the exit door and can't really see a good reason why I should be (other than the obvious benefit of not having to queue like the non-diabetics).

Are we really trying to say that kids with Type 1 can't queue for very long?? Sorry if I've got this thread confused!


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## sueneil (Sep 2, 2009)

Sorry to be such a spoil sport but I totally agree with SamInnocent on this matter I was diagnosed at the age of 2 I am now 41 and have never queue jumped or had the need to, my parents and now of course myself have always had the necessary equipment close to hand to deal with any situation. And considering the equipment needed isn't enormous/heavy etc then what is the problem. Do we really want to be called diabled after all what we have is a condition. 
I am sorry if I have offended anyone with my viws but then they are just my views lol


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## aymes (Sep 2, 2009)

There was some debate when this topic was first discussed but the Mumsn who are looking at the issue gave us some really interesting points on the issue, the threads below point to some of them. You may or may not agree but I can certainly see a very valid view point for it:

http://www.diabetessupport.co.uk/boards/showthread.php?t=2820&highlight=chessington

http://www.diabetessupport.co.uk/boards/showthread.php?t=2819&highlight=chessington


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## sofaraway (Sep 2, 2009)

For myself as an adult I don't feel I would need the use of this, but from the mums on here they helped me understand why it's important for the kids to be able to do this.


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## Copepod (Sep 2, 2009)

Exactly, life is different for children and adults with type 1 diabetes - not all adults with type 1 diabetes have been through childhood with diabetes. For an experience of successful waiting (36 hours due to a glacial metlwater stream) after developing adult onset type 1 diabetes, see my post #15 on http://www.diabetessupport.co.uk/boards/showthread.php?t=3617&page=2


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## Adrienne (Sep 2, 2009)

Thanks guys for saying these last few posts and understanding the needs sometimes for added bonus' for our children.    A friend recently took her daughter to one of these parks and this child is normally fairly ok with levels apparently.   She was hypo upon arrival due to excitment, they battled hypos and hypers all day long and it was purely down to excitment and adrenalin.  They also had the exit passes.  Can you imagine their day without the passes.   They have the same rights as everyone else to have a great day out and the planning and preparation and heavy bags that go into a day out is so much above and beyond a family without a child with diabetes.

I will be totally honest here and no doubt upset a few people, for which I apologise in advance but I find myself increasingly having to justify how parents today deal with their children's diabetes as it is different to when they were kids.    I really want to shout out loud about this as I am so frustrated (sorry very tired, my daughter hit 29.0 last night for no reason so was awake for hours from 2 am trying to bring her down!).    Diabetes care today is so very very very very vastly different than 20 odd years ago.  We have glucometers now, we have MDI, we have pumps, we have different carb counting, we know what foods do, what exercise does (ie send you up instead of down if you are roughly above 14.0) what adrenaline does.   The info at our fingertips is so much more involved and we can therefore try to have much tighter control with our children.   This includes planning extensively for days out to keep this tighter control.  These queues can be 2 hours long and on a hot day with adrenaline, levels go up, the toilet is needed so you leave the line.   What happens then, you join the back again!

I won't apologise any longer for wanting my child to live a normal length of life and to not have the complications that could possibly happen.   I want to to be as normal as she can like her friends and like me.    

Sorry if I sound shirty but I'm knackered and got all sentimental when I read the messages sticking up for us mums which means so much to me.


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## aymes (Sep 2, 2009)

Adrienne said:


> I really want to shout out loud about this as I am so frustrated (sorry very tired, my daughter hit 29.0 last night for no reason so was awake for hours from 2 am trying to bring her down!).
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> ...





Hi Adrienne, hope she is ok now after that shocker? Hope you can both catch up on your sleep too! These things just happen don't they, I've been battling hypos for weeks now and hardly had a reading above 7 recently but then today suddenly hit 21!

Sorry, wasn't trying to resurrect the thread so you had to defend yourself again! Just saw the article and hoped it might be useful! Hope everything you've been working on in this respect is going well?


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## Adrienne (Sep 2, 2009)

aymes said:


> Hi Adrienne, hope she is ok now after that shocker? Hope you can both catch up on your sleep too! These things just happen don't they, I've been battling hypos for weeks now and hardly had a reading above 7 recently but then today suddenly hit 21!
> 
> Sorry, wasn't trying to resurrect the thread so you had to defend yourself again! Just saw the article and hoped it might be useful! Hope everything you've been working on in this respect is going well?



Hi Aymes

No need to apologise.  Just feeling particularly touchy, not like me normally.

Jessica is fine now, just tired.  We are back at school tomorrow so up early, must go to bed in a minute.

The article was helpful, I have sent it to the UK Children with Advocacy Group's main man (or woman in this instance) to see if we can use it to fight our case.   People have been avoiding Chessington and going to Thorpe Park instead as they still issue the exit passes and people have such a more stress free day, it just takes away that extra stress that is unnecessary.

Thanks


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## SamInnocent (Sep 3, 2009)

Adrienne said:


> Thanks guys for saying these last few posts and understanding the needs sometimes for added bonus' for our children.    A friend recently took her daughter to one of these parks and this child is normally fairly ok with levels apparently.   She was hypo upon arrival due to excitment, they battled hypos and hypers all day long and it was purely down to excitment and adrenalin.  They also had the exit passes.  Can you imagine their day without the passes.   They have the same rights as everyone else to have a great day out and the planning and preparation and heavy bags that go into a day out is so much above and beyond a family without a child with diabetes.
> 
> I will be totally honest here and no doubt upset a few people, for which I apologise in advance but I find myself increasingly having to justify how parents today deal with their children's diabetes as it is different to when they were kids.    I really want to shout out loud about this as I am so frustrated (sorry very tired, my daughter hit 29.0 last night for no reason so was awake for hours from 2 am trying to bring her down!).    Diabetes care today is so very very very very vastly different than 20 odd years ago.  We have glucometers now, we have MDI, we have pumps, we have different carb counting, we know what foods do, what exercise does (ie send you up instead of down if you are roughly above 14.0) what adrenaline does.   The info at our fingertips is so much more involved and we can therefore try to have much tighter control with our children.   This includes planning extensively for days out to keep this tighter control.  These queues can be 2 hours long and on a hot day with adrenaline, levels go up, the toilet is needed so you leave the line.   What happens then, you join the back again!
> 
> ...



Apologies if this upsets you, but this is just my opinion, so feel free to ignore it!


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## Adrienne (Sep 3, 2009)

Hi

Once again someone has mis interpreted what I said totally.   SamInnocent, your first sentence says it all  'Understood, but was it really so easy all those years ago?'

Never once in any of my messages have I ever ever said it is more difficult today or it was easier all those years ago.   I think it was harder for parents (and I can only speak as a parent not as a person with diabetes) back then.  There was a lack of info compared to today and in 20 years time in the future they will look back at us now and think the same.   I have never said your parents had it easy.    I think it must have been absolutely horrendous and I do not envy what parents had to go through emotionally not knowing levels, having to use the implements they had.    

There is nothing wrong with making life easier for our kids and if that means exit passes then fine.   When they are adults they no doubt won't want to go to these parks unless they have kids themselves.   As adults they will have totally responsibility for themselves and will know how to deal with things themselves ie what works for a hypo etc etc.    As the parents we will do what we can to help them, as your parents did.

Please don't criticise me or my friends, we are trying the best for our kids with the tools we are given in the 21st century just as your parents did in the 20th century.    

Our kids are not disabled as someone suggested and we do not think of them as disabled and neither do our kids but the fact is that diabetes is deadly serious and serious enough to be totally covered under the Disability Discrimination Act so although people with or involved with diabetes do not think is is a disability, it is covered under the Act which is an aide to helping us live a normal life.   

Your opinions are fine, these are mine.    Please however, do not mis interpret what I have written.   Diabetes is not easy, now, in the future, or in the past and I have never said otherwise.


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## Adrienne (Sep 3, 2009)

"Glucose tablets are small so can fit in a pocket if necessary."


Glucose tablets do not work for my daughter, neither does Glucogel, dextrose tablets, lucozade tablets etc.    On the flipside lucozade drink works too fast as it starts her 2% of pancreas (rest was removed at birth) to start overproducing insulin even when hypo.   Coke seems to be the only thing that works.   We have to carry more than one can obviously on a day out.  Coke is very heavy.  We have to carry glucagon as well as I've had to use that before in an emergency.

Haribo does not work fast enough.  I am in the process of testing Hypo fit which will make the bag lighter and make things easier in general.   It has worked well twice but the third time she went down from 3.8 to 3.3 and continued going down so had to give coke !!!


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## SamInnocent (Sep 3, 2009)

Sorry for misinterpreting your post but when you say:
"Diabetes care today is so very very very very vastly different than 20 odd years ago. We have glucometers now, we have MDI, we have pumps, we have different carb counting, we know what foods do, what exercise does (ie send you up instead of down if you are roughly above 14.0) what adrenaline does. The info at our fingertips is so much more involved and we can therefore try to have much tighter control with our children. This includes planning extensively for days out to keep this tighter control. These queues can be 2 hours long and on a hot day with adrenaline, levels go up, the toilet is needed so you leave the line. What happens then, you join the back again!"

it's really hard to NOT interpret that as "we have it much harder than you did". Can you see how it could be interpreted that way?


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## sofaraway (Sep 3, 2009)

Aidrienne has said before that she doesn't think it's harder now, just different. Here is one of her posts explaining it
http://www.diabetessupport.co.uk/boards/showthread.php?t=2927


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## Patricia (Sep 3, 2009)

I sort of missed this, even the original post by Adrienne quoted by sofaraway...

Needless to say, I really take these points. And will, I reckon, more so as time goes on...

The only other thing I can think of to add is that we are products of our time, and ultimately responsive to our time. This means that we are alert to new research, to research done over the last 20 or 30 years which clearly outlines the increased risks associated with less than tight control. As parents we have a duty of care to provide our children with the best chances in life, in all ways. Dealing with t1 is another, rather all-encompassing provision of the best we can do. 

It is, yes, all about balance. But the balance is a moving target, as is diabetes itself. With more knowledge and science come more decisions, and most parents on any diabetes forum choose to make these decisions in fairly minute detail -- as did many parents years ago, I'm sure, with as much information as was available to them. It's from these things that the differences between 'then' and 'now' spiral out, and become so much more obvious. We can only act and react to what we know now, as has been the case through the ages.

The final thing I'd say is that 'running high' is always a tempting option for 'unusual circumstances'. Unfortunately a child's life is full of different and unusual situations, and it's clearly unwise always to take that route. So often things are riding quite tight on control, necessarily. Any help with that, esp with young children I think, is a godsend.

Saying all that, I'm sure there is a difference too between having things available, and things being taken up...My son, I know, would at the moment refuse to take up any exit passes etc...Even if we really, really asked him to in order to give himself a break. This may change in time.

Does my own son's stance mean that exit passes shouldn't be available, or DLA, etc? Absolutely not! As Adrienne and others have outlined, in my opinion too there are irrefutable reasons for them being available.


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## bev (Sep 3, 2009)

I think Adrienne has said it all really - there is very little i can add to what is a very honest and genuine account of what it means to be the parent of a diabetic child these days.

I also think there is a huge difference between *being* the diabetic and being the *parent* of a diabetic. I am fairly certain that if you asked your parents whether they would have taken the option of using the 'exit' passes at a theme park - they would have jumped at the chance. Not because as parents we want our little darlings to be spoilt rotten - just simply because our children have so much extra to deal with than a child without diabetes, and if there is somethng so very simple as letting a diabetic child not join huge queues - then what difference does it make to anyone? In the big scheme of things - it really doesnt affect anyones lives does it? Adrienne is spot on when she says we would have to leave the queue - if a child is high and needs the toilet - then has to rejoin the queue - nobody would want you to take your place where you left - there would be uproar as most would assume you were queue jumping! Adrenalin plays a huge part on days out with children - why should a diabetic child have to suffer unnecessarily?All the other children in the queue are excited and produce adrenalin - but none of them need an injection or a hypo treatment - sometimes A wont inject in public as he is too shy ( now on pump though) and this would have meant leaving a huge queue and then try to rejoin etc.. This is not about letting our children become spoilt and expect things in life to be easy - its about making small allowances to make their lives a little bit easier - and also the lives of their parents - who are under considerable amounts of stress!

I do realise this is a sensitive issue and i respect the fact that some were not allowed these sort of things as a child - but things have moved on considerably - and for the better in most cases - it is very difficult dealing with a young diabetic child at a theme park - everything goes crazy! I dont think it is the end of the world if our children are given a tiny bit of slack!Bev


p.s. Well said Adrienne! I hope J is feeling a lot better now after the 29!!!? Your stress levels must be high too! Bev x


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## Copepod (Sep 6, 2009)

*a disabled adult's view on theme park queues*

A somewhat tongue in cheek opinion about ADHD and queue jumping at theme parks - just want to bring it to attention of board users here, not to upset, although I'm sure it will cause some distress to parents.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/ouch/opinion/b1tch/db_theme_parks.shtml


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## Northerner (Sep 6, 2009)

Copepod said:


> A somewhat tongue in cheek opinion about ADHD and queue jumping at theme parks - just want to bring it to attention of board users here, not to upset, although I'm sure it will cause some distress to parents.
> http://www.bbc.co.uk/ouch/opinion/b1tch/db_theme_parks.shtml



Thanks Copepod - very interesting. I liked the bit about the train guard. When I was trying to get my money back from the insurance company for missing the Stockholm Marathon, they said they needed proof that I didn't take the holiday - the fact that I was in hospital at the time didn't seem to be sufficient, so they needed proof from the hotel that I didn't turn up! In a parallel universe maybe!!!! These people need to take a reality check.


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## Adrienne (Sep 6, 2009)

Copepod said:


> A somewhat tongue in cheek opinion about ADHD and queue jumping at theme parks - just want to bring it to attention of board users here, not to upset, although I'm sure it will cause some distress to parents.
> http://www.bbc.co.uk/ouch/opinion/b1tch/db_theme_parks.shtml



Brilliant, absolutely brilliant.  I've never seen this column before.   I click on the first link 'some disabled people get to skip queues' and that is also brilliant.   And it is sooooo true.   Why do people in wheelchairs have to queue jump !!   Lets all forget the word 'disabled' it is a horrid word and we all agree that we don't like that word and what it stands for, however does someone in a wheelchair have to check their bloods are ok, possibly every 30 minutes to an hour (for kids anyway) whilst in a queue in the theme park, does someone in a wheelchair have to maybe give a shot of something (in our case insulin) via a needle be it pen or syringe, whilst standing in a queue, the list could go on.   Probably not.    Some rides have stair, ok fair enough, skip the queuing but they could still stand (or sit) at the exit for the required amount of time it takes for their 'real' place in the queue to get to the front !!! I could carry on.....................

Great article.


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## katie (Sep 6, 2009)

I can totally understand why wheelchair users need to skips queues, so many reasons, especially in an airport situation.

This bit is so funny:
"He decided to go alone and then realised he'd need written proof he didn't have any legs and his lack of lower limbs wasn't just an optical illusion."


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## Adrienne (Sep 6, 2009)

katie said:


> I can totally understand why wheelchair users need to skips queues, so many reasons, especially in an airport situation.
> 
> This bit is so funny:
> "He decided to go alone and then realised he'd need written proof he didn't have any legs and his lack of lower limbs wasn't just an optical illusion."



Katie, I agree re the wheelchair user, of course they need to skip the queues, it would be a nightmare in those lines.


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