# Type 2 Diagnosed Today



## Utters (Mar 16, 2021)

Hi all, I'm just dropping in to say hello. I'm completely new to the world of diabetes, so I'll probably have endless questions to ask.
In a nutshell, I've not been well since December and finally got diagnosed as Type 2 today. It seems that my blood sugars have been quite high over the past few months (HbA1c 98). Like me, the doctors have no idea why my levels are so high, given my age, weight, diet and overall fitness. We are still trying to find the cause (if possible) but the main thing is is that I'm now being treated with metfomin, which should slowly get me back to some kind of normal.
Thanks for reading and hope to speak to some of you soon.


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## rebrascora (Mar 16, 2021)

Hi and welcome.

Can I just say that unless you have had specific C-peptide and GAD antibody tests, all you really have with an HbA1c of 98 is a diagnosis of diabetes rather than a specific Type 2 diagnosis. It is often assumed by medical professionals that you are Type 2 because you may be overweight or middle aged or have a family history of diabetes or have a poor diet but without the 2 tests mentioned above, it is just an assumption and it is still possible that you might actually be Type 1 or LADA (slow onset Type1) particularly if you don't fit the usual Type 2 profile. It happened to me 2 years ago at the age of 56 and took 4 months before I had those tests and was found to be Type1. Just something to bear in mind if your levels don't respond to treatment. 
Can I ask, did you have a sudden onset of symptoms and have you lost or gained any weight recently? 

The other thing I want to mention is that Metformin will have a minimal impact on your BG (Blood Glucose) levels. It is the go to drug for Type 2 treatment because it is cheap and relatively safe but it doesn't have a great impact on levels. By far the most powerful means of lowering your BG levels (short of injecting insulin) is to reduce your carbohydrate intake. That is not just sugar and sweet stuff but also starchy carbs like bread, pasta, rice, potatoes and breakfast cereals. Even "healthy" food like fruit and porridge are high in carbs and will raise your BG levels to some extent and are best rationed to a small portion. Not saying you should avoid all those foods but do reduce portion size and with fruit, it is best to keep the exotic fruits like bananas and pineapple and mango etc as an occasional treat and opt for a handful of berries (which are the lowest carb fruits and pack a nutritional and flavourful punch, so a little goes a long way).

Do make sure to take the Metformin with food to minimize digestive upset as it is not unaffectionately known as "Metfartin" for nothing and wind is sometimes the least of your worries with it.   I took it mid meal but still had the odd bout of nasty colic pain and urgent need for the loo, usually at the least convenient times!!

Don't suppose you have been supplied with a BG meter and test strips by your GP? Most Health Care Professionals advise against Type 2 diabetics testing their own blood unless they are on particularly strong medication which can make their BG go too low, but here on the forum we advocate the use of a meter to tailor your diet to what your body can tolerate. By testing before and then 2 hours after each meal, you will see how that meal affected your levels and be able to reduce portion size or avoid foods which cause your levels to spike too high. BG meters are relatively cheap to buy @approx £15 for the two we recommend for self funding here on the forum (the SD Gluco Navii or the Spirit Healthcare Tee2.... both available online) It is the ongoing purchase of test strips for them which tots up the costs and these have some of the cheapest test strips @£8 for a pot of 50 whereas some meters have test strips which are 2x or even 3x that price. 

Anyway, sorry to bombard you with so much information in a first post but hope it is of some help and if you have any questions, then feel free to ask.


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## Utters (Mar 16, 2021)

rebrascora said:


> Hi and welcome.
> 
> Can I just say that unless you have had specific C-peptide and GAD antibody tests, all you really have with an HbA1c of 98 is a diagnosis of diabetes rather than a specific Type 2 diagnosis. It is often assumed by medical professionals that you are Type 2 because you may be overweight or middle aged or have a family history of diabetes or have a poor diet but without the 2 tests mentioned above, it is just an assumption and it is still possible that you might actually be Type 1 or LADA (slow onset Type1) particularly if you don't fit the usual Type 2 profile. It happened to me 2 years ago at the age of 56 and took 4 months before I had those tests and was found to be Type1. Just something to bear in mind if your levels don't respond to treatment.
> Can I ask, did you have a sudden onset of symptoms and have you lost or gained any weight recently?
> ...


Hi Barbara, thanks so much for your response and good information. As a result I've already purchased a BG meter on your recommendation.

I'm 48 and I was perhaps a little overweight back in December, but only by small amount. I'm generally healthy in that I am, or was a long distance runner. So large carbs intake was always part of my diet. 

I'll certainly mention the two antibody tests to my GP. I did ask her why she thought I had type 2 and her reasoning was that there were no ketone present in any of the urine samples that were tested. I initially thought that I might have Type 1, as I have lost weight over the past three months (approx 10lbs) however, I've had a lot loose stools in that period, not to mention reducing the amount that I've eaten. With regards to family history, my mum has Type 2 diabetes (14 years now).

On the metformin side of things, I've only taken one tablet and already felt its power :/

Thanks again 
David


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## ColinUK (Mar 16, 2021)

Hi David,

Just on the metformin issue, see how you cope with it for a week or so but if the side effects don’t settle down then tell your gp that you want to go on the slow release version.


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## rebrascora (Mar 16, 2021)

I didn't have ketones either, so the absence of ketones is not necessarily diagnostic but good that your GP considered it.

Pleased you have got yourself a BG meter. It really is invaluable in being able to see how your body responds to different foods and using that information to tailor your diet to your diabetes and your tastes and lifestyle and it can be highly individual in all respects.


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## Utters (Mar 16, 2021)

Anitram said:


> Hi. Welcome to the Forum. I had a similar reaction when my HbA1c result came back but as I learnt more about Type 2 diabetes I realised that what I thought was a healthy diet low in fat was actually high in carbohydrate in the form of things like rice, pasta, bread and potatoes. Even though I rarely ate sweets, chocolate, cakes or biscuits, made sure I ate an apple, banana and sometimes grapes every day as part of my 5-a-day and always chose low fat versions of everything, as well as being slim and reasonably fit, it was my body's inability to cope with my carbohydrate intake that was the issue.
> 
> Type 2 management revolves around diet, exercise, weight loss (if needed) and medication. Metformin helps the insulin you produce work better but won't bring your levels down on its own.
> 
> Martin


Hi Martin, thanks for the welcome. Your old diet sounded very similar to the one I used to have.

I'm really struggling with portion sizes at the minute and feeling a little frustrated at not knowing how my body is reacting to what I'm putting in it. The GP measured my BG at 18 today and that's with me following a strict low carb, low sugar diet for the past week. I know that it won't come down overnight and I'll have to be patient.

Today I had porridge with semi skimmed milk, some raspberries and blueberries for breakfast (small portion). At lunch I had an advacado (1/2) and chicken sandwich and for tea tonight I've had a brown basmati rice, chicken and mushroom recipe off the diabetes website. I didn't finish all of that as I'm terrified of overdoing every. It's leaving me all very hungry. 

Thanks,
David


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## Utters (Mar 16, 2021)

ColinUK said:


> Hi David,
> 
> Just on the metformin issue, see how you cope with it for a week or so but if the side effects don’t settle down then tell your gp that you want to go on the slow release version.


Great, thank you Colin, I will do. I'm just starting on one tablet per day for this week, but my gp wants me on 3 per day in the coming weeks.
But the slow release tablet already sounds like a better option.


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## Utters (Mar 16, 2021)

rebrascora said:


> I didn't have ketones either, so the absence of ketones is not necessarily diagnostic but good that your GP considered it.
> 
> Pleased you have got yourself a BG meter. It really is invaluable in being able to see how your body responds to different foods and using that information to tailor your diet to your diabetes and your tastes and lifestyle and it can be highly individual in all respects.


Ok, that's interesting with regards to the ketones. 
Looking forward to getting the BG meter. It can't come soon enough!

Thanks again


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## Leadinglights (Mar 16, 2021)

You may be one of those people who can't tolerate high carb foods like porridge and rice so the sooner your monitor arrives the better so you can start testing the effect they have on your blood glucose levels by testing before you eat and after 2 hours. There is plenty of information on a testing regime which should enable you to make some better choices.


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## Utters (Mar 16, 2021)

Leadinglights said:


> You may be one of those people who can't tolerate high carb foods like porridge and rice so the sooner your monitor arrives the better so you can start testing the effect they have on your blood glucose levels by testing before you eat and after 2 hours. There is plenty of information on a testing regime which should enable you to make some better choices.


I'll be sad if that's the case, but if I need to give up things to feel better, then I'm all for it.


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## Cherrelle DUK (Mar 16, 2021)

Hi Utters, welcome to the forum.

I know it's frustrating not knowing what's going on but hopefully your monitor will arrive soon. It can be really useful for the first week to keep a food diary and test before you eat in the morning and 2 hours after meals then you can get an idea of what impact your diet is having on your BG levels.

You'll get the hang of it, keep reaching out and have a read through the forum as there's a wealth of info about.


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## trophywench (Mar 16, 2021)

Now then young man - you should have picked the chicken and mushrooms out of the rice and finished them!

Just think about the carbs in that menu ..... carbs in the porridge oats, carbs in the milk (less fat in the milk = higher carb content) carbs in the bread in the sandwich, carbs in the rice.

You still need calories mate - enough to prevent you feeling starving - and there are a lot more calories in fats and proteins by weight than there are in starchy carbs.  The only thing our bodies have any trouble dealing with (in the main) are the carbs.

Let's think - eg chop, spuds and veg.  Decent size chop, one or two bits (or whole if they're little) less than usual of spud, at least 2 different other veg.


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## Utters (Mar 17, 2021)

Cherrelle DUK said:


> Hi Utters, welcome to the forum.
> 
> I know it's frustrating not knowing what's going on but hopefully your monitor will arrive soon. It can be really useful for the first week to keep a food diary and test before you eat in the morning and 2 hours after meals then you can get an idea of what impact your diet is having on your BG levels.
> 
> You'll get the hang of it, keep reaching out and have a read through the forum as there's a wealth of info about.


Hi Cherrelle, thank you. I'll definitely be having a good look through the forum today.


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## Utters (Mar 17, 2021)

trophywench said:


> Now then young man - you should have picked the chicken and mushrooms out of the rice and finished them!
> 
> Just think about the carbs in that menu ..... carbs in the porridge oats, carbs in the milk (less fat in the milk = higher carb content) carbs in the bread in the sandwich, carbs in the rice.
> 
> ...


Hi Jenny, funnily enough I did manage to pick out those bits, so at least I got that bit right 

I totally get what you're saying on the carbs side of things with my menu. I thought that as long I didn't go over the recommended daily amount (somewhere between 260g and 300g) then I would be ok? I'm learning a lot on here, which is great and I thank you all.

So should I just be eating fruit for breakfast? Salads for lunch and meat and veg for tea? Chops and veg will be on the menu for tea tonight,  but I was trying to avoid spuds due to their high carbs/sugar content. If I do have them, how many should I have ? Just one? On the veg side, I've seen that cabbage and broccoli are two of the best to have, but I'm guessing that most are OK.

Thanks,
David


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## ColinUK (Mar 17, 2021)

Utters said:


> Hi Jenny, funnily enough I did manage to pick out those bits, so at least I got that bit right
> 
> I totally get what you're saying on the carbs side of things with my menu. I thought that as long I didn't go over the recommended daily amount (somewhere between 260g and 300g) then I would be ok? I'm learning a lot on here, which is great and I thank you all.
> 
> ...


Fruit is often not something we can tolerate well at all. Generally the juicier the fruit the worse the impact on BG can be. 
Can’t remember if you’re getting a blood glucose monitor but using one will really  help you identify those foods which really cause you to spike.


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## Utters (Mar 17, 2021)

ColinUK said:


> Fruit is often not something we can tolerate well at all. Generally the juicier the fruit the worse the impact on BG can be.
> Can’t remember if you’re getting a blood glucose monitor but using one will really  help you identify those foods which really cause you to spike.


I read that strawberries, raspberries and blueberries are ok though? Or does it depend on the person? 

Yes, I've got a BG monitor on order.


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## EllsBells (Mar 17, 2021)

Utters said:


> Hi Martin, thanks for the welcome. Your old diet sounded very similar to the one I used to have.
> 
> I'm really struggling with portion sizes at the minute and feeling a little frustrated at not knowing how my body is reacting to what I'm putting in it. The GP measured my BG at 18 today and that's with me following a strict low carb, low sugar diet for the past week. I know that it won't come down overnight and I'll have to be patient.
> 
> ...


It's very individual - some people are able to tolerate a good number of carbs, others may be under 60g a day and some are even lower. It will also vary as to which foods you're sensitive to. Once you're testing, you can experiment and find your tolerances.


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## Utters (Mar 17, 2021)

I have a question, if we're able not able to reduce BG by diet and medication does that all point to type 1? Or can people with type 1 still reduce BG through diet?


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## Utters (Mar 17, 2021)

EllsBells said:


> It's very individual - some people are able to tolerate a good number of carbs, others may be under 60g a day and some are even lower. It will also vary as to which foods you're sensitive to. Once you're testing, you can experiment and find your tolerances.


Yes I guess so. It's just going to be a matter of trial and error. Thank you.


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## EllsBells (Mar 17, 2021)

Utters said:


> Yes I guess so. It's just going to be a matter of trial and error. Thank you.


Have fun - you'll find a few surprises!


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## grovesy (Mar 17, 2021)

Utters said:


> I read that strawberries, raspberries and blueberries are ok though? Or does it depend on the person?
> 
> Yes, I've got a BG monitor on order.


I personal can tolerate blueberries and raspberries, but can only tolerate about half a dozen strawberries.


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## Utters (Mar 17, 2021)

grovesy said:


> I personal can tolerate blueberries and raspberries, but can only tolerate about half a dozen strawberries.


Ok, yes so very individual. Thank you.


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## adrian1der (Mar 17, 2021)

Utters said:


> So should I just be eating fruit for breakfast? Salads for lunch and meat and veg for tea? Chops and veg will be on the menu for tea tonight,  but I was trying to avoid spuds due to their high carbs/sugar content. If I do have them, how many should I have ? Just one? On the veg side, I've seen that cabbage and broccoli are two of the best to have, but I'm guessing that most are OK.
> 
> Thanks,
> David


Hi @Utters and welcome from me. You have had some great advice already so not a lot to add. On the menu side I cook exactly what I used to but have bigger portions of the tasty bits and leave out the dull and boring carb heavy bits. Last night I did a Chicken and Shiitake mushroom stir fry. The family had it with rice and I made myself some cauliflower rice seasoned with chilli flakes and sesame oil. My wife had the cauli rice in preference to boiled rice! Tonight I'm doing a chilli - I'll have a bowl of chilli (the tasty bit) while the family will have rice again.

I rarely eat breakfast (never have) but eggs and bacon is good or berries and full fat Greek yoghurt. Home made soup is great for lunch and omelettes are a great go to for using up anything left over in the fridge.

I started on slow release Metformin and only had mild symptoms which past after a while.

You probably have a mountain of questions - ask away!


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## rebrascora (Mar 17, 2021)

What hasn't been mentioned yet and is important is that you are best to reduce your carb intake slowly. We are all very keen to jump on the band wagon and say this in your diet is high in carbs and so is that, but by cutting carbs too radically, you can bring your levels down too quickly and risk potential damage to the small blood vessels in the eyes particularly, so a slow and steady reduction is best. The suggestion to keep a food diary and quantify the high carb foods (so x slices of bread and y pieces of potato and weigh out your porridge oats, so you know how many grams you are eating) is a good one and aim for perhaps half your regular carb intake for a week or two and then maybe half it again depending upon how your levels are looking.

I would be surprised if your levels don't drop with a reduction in carbs. Even if you are Type 1, the onset tends to be slower in older adults (which is why it is often mistaken for Type 2) and will usually respond to changes in diet and sometimes Type 2 medication. Young people tend to get ill very quickly and go into diabetic ketoacidosis (DKA) hence the test for ketones but the attack on your insulin producing Beta cells is often less aggressive in more mature adults, so your pancreas will still be producing some insulin and a reduction in carb intake will take the strain off the remaining Beta cells and allow them to cope better with the steady trickle of glucose produced by the liver as well as the smaller portions of carbs you eat and you should still see a reduction in levels. That's not to say that you couldn't suddenly develop ketones and go into DKA but it is less likely.

As Jenny said, fat is now your friend as you reduce carbs. It provides calories/energy and it takes longer to digest so it keeps you feeling full for longer. It also slows the release of glucose from any carbs you eat with it, so eating cream with your strawberries/blueberries/raspberries/blackberries/gooseberries/black and redcurrants, rhubarb stewed with a little sweetener (think tangy fruits where a little gives you a big flavour punch) will slow the release of the glucose. If you treat yourself to a small banana occasionally, having it with cream will slow the effects on your levels. Cheese is our friend and eggs and quite a few of us have proper double cream in our morning coffee instead of milk, because it is lower carb than milk and keeps you feeling full and provides energy. Creamy Greek natural yoghurt is a regular item on the menu and works well for breakfast with berries and mixed seeds and maybe just a sprinkle of granola... look for the lowest carb varieties.... Learning to read nutritional information on food packaging is a key skill for us. You are looking for the total carb content and it will usually be in tiny writing on the back or side of the packaging. It will also say, of which sugars, but the total carbs are all you need to know. Take reading glasses when you go shopping because they really don't make this info easy to see!


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## Nemesis (Mar 17, 2021)

rebrascora said:


> Hi and welcome.
> 
> Can I just say that unless you have had specific C-peptide and GAD antibody tests, all you really have with an HbA1c of 98 is a diagnosis of diabetes rather than a specific Type 2 diagnosis. It is often assumed by medical professionals that you are Type 2 because you may be overweight or middle aged or have a family history of diabetes or have a poor diet but without the 2 tests mentioned above, it is just an assumption and it is still possible that you might actually be Type 1 or LADA (slow onset Type1) particularly if you don't fit the usual Type 2 profile. It happened to me 2 years ago at the age of 56 and took 4 months before I had those tests and was found to be Type1. Just something to bear in mind if your levels don't respond to treatment.
> Can I ask, did you have a sudden onset of symptoms and have you lost or gained any weight recently?
> ...


Found this really interesting thank-you, I have recently been told I am Type 2 Diabetic -  but all I have had is a HbA1c test.
 I am overweight but didn't have symptoms that I was aware of until recently when I gained a lot of weight - I believe through stress eating following my father's death early last year. Dealing with Probate/Return of Estate Information and the Post Office losing the Will did little to help my stress levels and then of course getting 3 hours sleep a night because I was waking up thinking I must deal with things and not waste time sleeping on top probably also didn't help.
Hoping I can turn things around and looks like this forum could be a great help.


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## ColinUK (Mar 17, 2021)

For me it’s raspberries, blackberries and strawberries which are ok in moderation. 

That said I can have the very occasional peach or nectarine without any issues if I’ve been controlled with my BG for a while.


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## Utters (Mar 17, 2021)

adrian1der said:


> Hi @Utters and welcome from me. You have had some great advice already so not a lot to add. On the menu side I cook exactly what I used to but have bigger portions of the tasty bits and leave out the dull and boring carb heavy bits. Last night I did a Chicken and Shiitake mushroom stir fry. The family had it with rice and I made myself some cauliflower rice seasoned with chilli flakes and sesame oil. My wife had the cauli rice in preference to boiled rice! Tonight I'm doing a chilli - I'll have a bowl of chilli (the tasty bit) while the family will have rice again.
> 
> I rarely eat breakfast (never have) but eggs and bacon is good or berries and full fat Greek yoghurt. Home made soup is great for lunch and omelettes are a great go to for using up anything left over in the fridge.
> 
> ...


Hi Adrian, thank you. Your meals sound great - I'll have to look into the cauliflower rice as a substitute. So low fat beef is ok to use in a chilli? Again, it probably depends on what my body can tolerate.

I had bought low fat greek yoghurt, but I was surprised to see how much sugar was in it per 1/4 tube - 7g!

Thanks again,
David.


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## Utters (Mar 17, 2021)

rebrascora said:


> What hasn't been mentioned yet and is important is that you are best to reduce your carb intake slowly. We are all very keen to jump on the band wagon and say this in your diet is high in carbs and so is that, but by cutting carbs too radically, you can bring your levels down too quickly and risk potential damage to the small blood vessels in the eyes particularly, so a slow and steady reduction is best. The suggestion to keep a food diary and quantify the high carb foods (so x slices of bread and y pieces of potato and weigh out your porridge oats, so you know how many grams you are eating) is a good one and aim for perhaps half your regular carb intake for a week or two and then maybe half it again depending upon how your levels are looking.
> 
> I would be surprised if your levels don't drop with a reduction in carbs. Even if you are Type 1, the onset tends to be slower in older adults (which is why it is often mistaken for Type 2) and will usually respond to changes in diet and sometimes Type 2 medication. Young people tend to get ill very quickly and go into diabetic ketoacidosis (DKA) hence the test for ketones but the attack on your insulin producing Beta cells is often less aggressive in more mature adults, so your pancreas will still be producing some insulin and a reduction in carb intake will take the strain off the remaining Beta cells and allow them to cope better with the steady trickle of glucose produced by the liver as well as the smaller portions of carbs you eat and you should still see a reduction in levels. That's not to say that you couldn't suddenly develop ketones and go into DKA but it is less likely.
> 
> As Jenny said, fat is now your friend as you reduce carbs. It provides calories/energy and it takes longer to digest so it keeps you feeling full for longer. It also slows the release of glucose from any carbs you eat with it, so eating cream with your strawberries/blueberries/raspberries/blackberries/gooseberries/black and redcurrants, rhubarb stewed with a little sweetener (think tangy fruits where a little gives you a big flavour punch) will slow the release of the glucose. If you treat yourself to a small banana occasionally, having it with cream will slow the effects on your levels. Cheese is our friend and eggs and quite a few of us have proper double cream in our morning coffee instead of milk, because it is lower carb than milk and keeps you feeling full and provides energy. Creamy Greek natural yoghurt is a regular item on the menu and works well for breakfast with berries and mixed seeds and maybe just a sprinkle of granola... look for the lowest carb varieties.... Learning to read nutritional information on food packaging is a key skill for us. You are looking for the total carb content and it will usually be in tiny writing on the back or side of the packaging. It will also say, of which sugars, but the total carbs are all you need to know. Take reading glasses when you go shopping because they really don't make this info easy to see!


Hi Barbara, thanks so much for this, it's really informative! It gives me plenty to think about.


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## Utters (Mar 17, 2021)

ColinUK said:


> For me it’s raspberries, blackberries and strawberries which are ok in moderation.
> 
> That said I can have the very occasional peach or nectarine without any issues if I’ve been controlled with my BG for a while.


I'm happy enough to eat the berries, so I reckon that I'll stick with them for now . . . until perhaps, I find out that they're not happy with me.


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## adrian1der (Mar 17, 2021)

The problem with low fat food is that they are generally higher in carbs than the full fat version





__





						Cauliflower rice recipe | BBC Good Food
					

Pulse cauliflower in a food processor to make cauliflower couscous or an easy rice-like side dish that's much lower GI and ready in just 10 minutes



					www.bbcgoodfood.com
				




will tell you all about cauli rice


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## Utters (Mar 17, 2021)

Nemesis said:


> Found this really interesting thank-you, I have recently been told I am Type 2 Diabetic -  but all I have had is a HbA1c test.
> I am overweight but didn't have symptoms that I was aware of until recently when I gained a lot of weight - I believe through stress eating following my father's death early last year. Dealing with Probate/Return of Estate Information and the Post Office losing the Will did little to help my stress levels and then of course getting 3 hours sleep a night because I was waking up thinking I must deal with things and not waste time sleeping on top probably also didn't help.
> Hoping I can turn things around and looks like this forum could be a great help.


Hi Nemesis, sorry to hear what you have been going through. As you say, it's really interesting and everyone on here have so helpful - a blessing to those of us who are new to the condition. I'll definitely be looking into the GAD antibody tests, etc. in relation to Latent-onset Autoimmune Diabetes in Adults (LADA) as I already have one autoimmune condition in having alopecia.


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## Utters (Mar 17, 2021)

adrian1der said:


> The problem with low fat food is that they are generally higher in carbs than the full fat version
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yes, I'm starting to see that now. That's great! Thanks for the link.


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## Leadinglights (Mar 17, 2021)

Utters said:


> Hi Adrian, thank you. Your meals sound great - I'll have to look into the cauliflower rice as a substitute. So low fat beef is ok to use in a chilli? Again, it probably depends on what my body can tolerate.
> 
> I had bought low fat greek yoghurt, but I was surprised to see how much sugar was in it per 1/4 tube - 7g!
> 
> ...


You will generally find that low fat versions have more carbohydrate so the full fat are a better option, it is not the fat you should be too worried about but the carbs. Many people avoid the low fat products like the plague other if theycan't tolerate because of conditions not related to their diabetes. No real need to have low fat meat unless that is what you prefer. But if you are cutting carbs than having higher fat will help you to not feel hungry. Good advice to reduce carbs slowly as I dropped my carbs to 60g per day immediately and have had some vision issues.


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## trophywench (Mar 17, 2021)

Far as I know, there is not any recommended amount of carbs to eat for people with diabetes.  I've been adult for rather a long time by now - I have never ever in my whole life eaten 2-300g of carb in a single day.  I'd have died of morbid obesity long before now if I had shovelled c 3 x as much carb as I've ever eaten - either before diagnosis or since - down my neck!

I admit I am 5' 3" and worked in an office between leaving school and retirement - but rarely eat much more than 100g if that.

I don't need more - I've never been in danger of fading away!  In truth - the question each of us with diabetes MUST answer for themselves if they want to live long & prosper - is how many g of carb can MY body cope with now? 

And we discover this my testing our BG and weighing our food until we find the answers.


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## Utters (Mar 17, 2021)

trophywench said:


> Far as I know, there is not any recommended amount of carbs to eat for people with diabetes.  I've been adult for rather a long time by now - I have never ever in my whole life eaten 2-300g of carb in a single day.  I'd have died of morbid obesity long before now if I had shovelled c 3 x as much carb as I've ever eaten - either before diagnosis or since - down my neck!
> 
> I admit I am 5' 3" and worked in an office between leaving school and retirement - but rarely eat much more than 100g if that.
> 
> ...


I've always, until now, packed in the carbs. Mainly because I enjoy(ed) training for and running marathons, etc. Something I'm going to have to figure out going forward.


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## trophywench (Mar 17, 2021)

Steve Redgrave didn't find it easy - but there again he had a LOT more help with his Type 2 (and everything else healthwise) than most are ever able to access.


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## Utters (Mar 17, 2021)

trophywench said:


> Steve Redgrave didn't find it easy - but there again he had a LOT more help with his Type 2 (and everything else healthwise) than most are ever able to access.


I bet that it was a huge challenge for him.  He did a great job too. To be honest, I've never found it easy, even when I wasn't diabetic. Short runs from now on.


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## TinaD (Mar 17, 2021)

Hi Utters. You will get a lot of support on here from the long standing members - I did when diagnosed last summer. You may find it useful to have a book which helps you calculate carbohydrates....Many people recommend "Carbs and Cals (ISBN 978-19082611-5-1). I use it and have found it helpful. The BG monitor is really helpful in finding which carbs cause your BG to reach for the sky. I am following a ketogenic diet (20gms of carb a day - sounds terrifying but bacon and eggs/steak and salad/chicken in creamy garlic sauce/tandoori etc takes the sting out of no toast/spuds/pasta/pizza etc) and as a result now have normal BG on every day that I do not cheat - and a normal HbA1c. Some lucky so and sos on here can eat lots more carbohydrate and get equally good results - we are all individuals and respond differently.

You might try searching for Prof Tim Noakes - he found his running improved on the LCHF diet after his diagnosis with Type2.


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## Utters (Mar 18, 2021)

TinaD said:


> Hi Utters. You will get a lot of support on here from the long standing members - I did when diagnosed last summer. You may find it useful to have a book which helps you calculate carbohydrates....Many people recommend "Carbs and Cals (ISBN 978-19082611-5-1). I use it and have found it helpful. The BG monitor is really helpful in finding which carbs cause your BG to reach for the sky. I am following a ketogenic diet (20gms of carb a day - sounds terrifying but bacon and eggs/steak and salad/chicken in creamy garlic sauce/tandoori etc takes the sting out of no toast/spuds/pasta/pizza etc) and as a result now have normal BG on every day that I do not cheat - and a normal HbA1c. Some lucky so and sos on here can eat lots more carbohydrate and get equally good results - we are all individuals and respond differently.
> 
> You might try searching for Prof Tim Noakes - he found his running improved on the LCHF diet after his diagnosis with Type2.


Hi Tina, thank you for the Carb and Cals book recommendation. That will come in very handy.

Bacon, eggs, steak . . . now you're talking my language  That's great that you've managed to get your BG levels and HbA1c to normal using the ketogenic diet. 

I'll have a look into to LCHF diet - thank you. It sounds interesting. I have had little bit of a look into managed running along side diabetes now and not surprisingly it's mainly about keeping your sugars stable and keeping hydrated.


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## grovesy (Mar 18, 2021)

Utters said:


> Hi Tina, thank you for the Carb and Cals book recommendation. That will come in very handy.
> 
> Bacon, eggs, steak . . . now you're talking my language  That's great that you've managed to get your BG levels and HbA1c to normal using the ketogenic diet.
> 
> I'll have a look into to LCHF diet - thank you. It sounds interesting. I have had little bit of a look into managed running along side diabetes now and not surprisingly it's mainly about keeping your sugars stable and keeping hydrated.


There is an app too!


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## Utters (Mar 18, 2021)

grovesy said:


> There is an app too!


Thanks grovesy


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## Utters (Mar 18, 2021)

My GlucNavii BG meter has arrived! I had breakfast at around 7:30 (small portion of Greek yogurt, raspberries, blueberries and two boiled eggs). 

I didn't get to take my before reading, as the meter hadn't turned up, but I took one at 9:30 (2 hrs post) and it was 132mg/dL. Is that heading in the right direction?


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## Leadinglights (Mar 18, 2021)

The units you mention are not the ones familiar in the UK, which are normally in mmol/l. I'm sure there must be a conversion factor but not sure what it is. There may be a setting you can change on the monitor.


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## silentsquirrel (Mar 18, 2021)

Divide by 18


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## rebrascora (Mar 18, 2021)

Hopefully there will be a means of changing the setting to mmols/l but I believe you need to divide the mg/dl by 18 which gives a result of 7.3 which is a lot better than your 18 or whatever it was when you were diagnosed at the Docs and is a good post meal reading.

Do be careful about cutting your carbs too quickly though and bringing those readings down too quickly. Slow steady reduction is better. You don't want to damage your eyes.


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## Utters (Mar 18, 2021)

Leadinglights said:


> The units you mention are not the ones familiar in the UK, which are normally in mmol/l. I'm sure there must be a conversion factor but not sure what it is. There may be a setting you can change on the monitor.


Yes, I realised that after I looked into it more. The meter reads in mg. I'll try and find a way to change it. If not, I can do the conversion.


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## Utters (Mar 18, 2021)

rebrascora said:


> Hopefully there will be a means of changing the setting to mmols/l but I believe you need to divide the mg/dl by 18 which gives a result of 7.3 which is a lot better than your 18 or whatever it was when you were diagnosed at the Docs and is a good post meal reading.
> 
> Do be careful about cutting your carbs too quickly though and bringing those readings down too quickly. Slow steady reduction is better. You don't want to damage your eyes.


Thanks for your advice Barbara - well noted! Yes, 7.3 is much better than 18. I'll have a bit of bread for lunch, along with whatever other delights that I've got in the fridge.


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## TinaD (Mar 18, 2021)

Utters - steady with the bread! A slice or even 2 whilst adapting, reading, getting generaly sorted but do NOT eat the whole loaf!


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## Utters (Mar 18, 2021)

TinaD said:


> Utters - steady with the bread! A slice or even 2 whilst adapting, reading, getting generaly sorted but do NOT eat the whole loaf!


I just just had the one slice, along with carrots, celery, tomato and cottage cheese. Pre lunch 5.9 and 9.3 two hours later.


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## TinaD (Mar 18, 2021)

Well done. 8gms of carbs in each 100m of carrots; celery only 1gm; tomato 3gm; cottage cheese 3gm usually;bread anything between 9 and 10gms carbs per thin slice (thin slice weighs 22gns) and nice thick slice (44gms) contains 18-20 gms of carbs. Butter which is very calorific (717 calories in 100gms) has no carbs at all...So do not feel restricted in eating your bread buttered on both sides!


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## Leadinglights (Mar 18, 2021)

That sounds to be a greater increase than is comfortable, 2-3mmol/l increase and preferably no more than 8.5mmol/l after the 2 hours. Was it a large slice of bread and tomatoes and carrots are quite high, cottage cheese is low fat so perhaps not as good as a slice of nice cheddar.


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## TinaD (Mar 18, 2021)

Leadinglights said:


> That sounds to be a greater increase than is comfortable, 2-3mmol/l increase and preferably no more than 8.5mmol/l after the 2 hours. Was it a large slice of bread and tomatoes and carrots are quite high, cottage cheese is low fat so perhaps not as good as a slice of nice cheddar.


Agree. Cheddar  is 0 carbs normally (always read the label). So unless Utters you are much fatter than you look in your picture go for the hard cheeses like cheddar as it is very calorific, will keep you full longer as its high fat, and it won't spike you BG as it has 0 carbs.


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## Utters (Mar 18, 2021)

Oh dear, I thought that I was starting to understand it all . . . back to the drawing board then. Ok, so limit carrots and tomatoes and normal sized slices of bread. BUT have a good lump of cheese.

I've lost about a stone since that picture, so there's not much of me at the minute. I might just go and grab that cheddar now!


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## TinaD (Mar 18, 2021)

Enjoy it! Some more carbs for you - all by the 100gm portion: Asparagus is 2; so is celariac, courgette,fennel,lambs lettuce, radishes, spinach. Celery, cucumber,kale, ordinary lettuce, are only 1 gm per 100gm. Mushrooms are zero carbs - so is steak, roast sirloin, belly pork and pork chops (but not sausages),chicken, goose, duck, turkey - basically any meat you buy from the butcher and cook at home so you know there are no additives are zero carb.. Nuts are hugely fattening (alas) but have fairly low carbs: walnuts 1 carb per 30gms,almonds 3 carbs for 30 gms. You can eat eggs until they are coming out of your ears.
Avoid all breakfast cereal as a product from Hell (lots of sugar hidden away in it). Some people manage porridge (but  sadly I can't) made with real oats not that instant muck - think about adding cream instead of milk as it is lower in carbs - indeed it is close to zero - but no sugar/syrup/honey (sorry about that).. A very small bowlful containing 9gms of oats has 9 carbs- a decent sized one (45gs of uncooked oats) 44 carbs.
Milk contains sugar (lactose) but Fage  Greek Yoghurt is only 3 carbs per 100gms. There is no need to be hungry just because you are cutting down on carbs. 
Fruit is a bit difficult - blueberries are 9 carbs to the 100gm but blackberries only 5 as are raspberries, strawberries are 6 carbs, apples are 10, kiwi fruit,9, peach 8 as is plum - most of the tropical stuff is out of sight - mango 14/pomegranite seeds 16 etc. The book says rhubarb is only 1 carb per 100gm but nobody with normal tastbuds can eat the horrible stuff without 100 gms of sugar to improve the taste....
Do not attempt to go too quickly in reducing carbs. To get down to my level you have to reduce slowly or face keto flu and constipation which would daunt a cement mixer. Until you experiment a bit you will not know how many carbs you can tolerate so let your meter be your guide. Take it steadily, do not panic, and do not let yourself get hungry or you will make silly diet choices like "Oh blow this for a game of soldiers - 2 pints of your best landlord and I'll have a pork pie and chips...." When deciding on veggies look at those with high fibre as well as lowish calories (i.e under 5carbs per 100gms) because fibre slows the absorbtion of the carbs which helps stop your BG spiking (it also avoids the cement mixer syndrome). Good luck and buy the book or download the app.


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## Utters (Mar 18, 2021)

TinaD said:


> Enjoy it! Some more carbs for you - all by the 100gm portion: Asparagus is 2; so is celariac, courgette,fennel,lambs lettuce, radishes, spinach. Celery, cucumber,kale, ordinary lettuce, are only 1 gm per 100gm. Mushrooms are zero carbs - so is steak, roast sirloin, belly pork and pork chops (but not sausages),chicken, goose, duck, turkey - basically any meat you buy from the butcher and cook at home so you know there are no additives are zero carb.. Nuts are hugely fattening (alas) but have fairly low carbs: walnuts 1 carb per 30gms,almonds 3 carbs for 30 gms. You can eat eggs until they are coming out of your ears.
> Avoid all breakfast cereal as a product from Hell (lots of sugar hidden away in it). Some people manage porridge (but  sadly I can't) made with real oats not that instant muck - think about adding cream instead of milk as it is lower in carbs - indeed it is close to zero - but no sugar/syrup/honey (sorry about that).. A very small bowlful containing 9gms of oats has 9 carbs- a decent sized one (45gs of uncooked oats) 44 carbs.
> Milk contains sugar (lactose) but Fage  Greek Yoghurt is only 3 carbs per 100gms. There is no need to be hungry just because you are cutting down on carbs.
> Fruit is a bit difficult - blueberries are 9 carbs to the 100gm but blackberries only 5 as are raspberries, strawberries are 6 carbs, apples are 10, kiwi fruit,9, peach 8 as is plum - most of the tropical stuff is out of sight - mango 14/pomegranite seeds 16 etc. The book says rhubarb is only 1 carb per 100gm but nobody with normal tastbuds can eat the horrible stuff without 100 gms of sugar to improve the taste....
> Do not attempt to go too quickly in reducing carbs. To get down to my level you have to reduce slowly or face keto flu and constipation which would daunt a cement mixer. Until you experiment a bit you will not know how many carbs you can tolerate so let your meter be your guide. Take it steadily, do not panic, and do not let yourself get hungry or you will make silly diet choices like "Oh blow this for a game of soldiers - 2 pints of your best landlord and I'll have a pork pie and chips...." When deciding on veggies look at those with high fibre as well as lowish calories (i.e under 5carbs per 100gms) because fibre slows the absorbtion of the carbs which helps stop your BG spiking (it also avoids the cement mixer syndrome). Good luck and buy the book or download the app.


Thanks for taking the time to give me all of this info Tina, very much appreciated! You've also made me laugh this afternoon too - thank you


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