# Work discrimination



## John P Waddington (Jan 16, 2020)

Been ‘managed out’ of my job in the guise of  then caring about my wellbeing  due to their ‘concerns’ about my diabetes. They want me to prove I don’t have hypos. They think a type 1 diabetic can provide evidence of not having hypos and hyperglycaemia for 6 months. In the meantime I have been transferred to head office to do data entry. I will lose the opportunity to do overtime and I will lose the benefit of school holidays so won’t be able to see my children very often.


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## MrDaibetes (Jan 16, 2020)

John P Waddington said:


> Been ‘managed out’ of my job in the guise of  then caring about my wellbeing  due to their ‘concerns’ about my diabetes. They want me to prove I don’t have hypos. They think a type 1 diabetic can provide evidence of not having hypos and hyperglycaemia for 6 months. In the meantime I have been transferred to head office to do data entry. I will lose the opportunity to do overtime and I will lose the benefit of school holidays so won’t be able to see my children very often.



Hey, welcome to the forum. What job were you doing before being moved to head office? Are you part of a union that can challenge this decision for you?


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## everydayupsanddowns (Jan 16, 2020)

Sorry to hear of your experiences @John P Waddington 

As I understand it employers have a legal responsibility to make reasonable adjustments to support employees living with a disability. 

How do you currently manage your diabetes, and how do you feel it impacts on your working life. What could your employer do to support you better? Are there any differences in insulin therapy or technology that you could use to improve any challenges you are experiencing with your diabetes management?

Have you considered contacting Citizen’s Advice Bureau or the Diabetes UK helpline? 

https://www.diabetes.org.uk/how_we_help/helpline


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## trophywench (Jan 16, 2020)

Er, for what purpose does an employer need to have proof that you don't go hyper or hypo?

Frankly if that's not discrimination then that thing doesn't exist.  Ring the Helpline  asap.


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## SB2015 (Jan 16, 2020)

I wouldn’t get through a week without any hypo or hyper incidents, and my control is considered by the consultant as ‘gold star’.  That is rediculous.  What job are you doing that would be impacted by these?


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## Bruce Stephens (Jan 16, 2020)

SB2015 said:


> I wouldn’t get through a week without any hypo or hyper incidents, and my control is considered by the consultant as ‘gold star’.



Yes, they'd better have a good reason for such unreasonable requirements. One day that might really be feasible, but that'll most likely require an automated pancreas (and then the question will just be whether you're using it and keeping it fed with power, insulin, glycogen).


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## stephknits (Jan 17, 2020)

Hi John, as you and any Type 1 knows, this is impossible.  Your employer cannot demand the impossible and is therefore discriminating.  The diabetes UK helpline should be able to provide you with support to challenge this.  Do let us know how you get on. 
Managing type 1 is tedious enough without having to go through this sort of rubbish! Good luck


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## Bruce Stephens (Jan 17, 2020)

They might mean no hypos requiring help from another person, and no hypers requiring a hospital stay. I guess. Something like that. I could imagine those being defensible, just.


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## novorapidboi26 (Jan 17, 2020)

An insulin dependent diabetic is always going to have highs and lows, and thats OK, as there is no job that would insist you don't have these events........and if there was, no type one would be doing it....

lets hear some more detail about the predicament...


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## Deleted member 25429 (Jan 17, 2020)

I think sometimes decisions like this are made because people are ignorant. I didn’t know anything about type 1 diabetes before I was diagnosed. I was lucky my manager read all the information he could , and educated the others around me . Maybe your company needs to educate themselves . It is a battle as diabetics we don’t need , we have enough to deal with day to day trying to manage such a complicated condition . Good luck


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## John P Waddington (Jan 17, 2020)

MrDaibetes said:


> Hey, welcome to the forum. What job were you doing before being moved to head office? Are you part of a union that can challenge this decision for you?



I work in a college for young adults with autism. Learning Support Assistant.


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## John P Waddington (Jan 17, 2020)

everydayupsanddowns said:


> Sorry to hear of your experiences @John P Waddington
> 
> As I understand it employers have a legal responsibility to make reasonable adjustments to support employees living with a disability.
> 
> ...


Contacted the union and Diabetes UK this morning. They will get back to me. I’m being treated like I have done something wrong by the management - this is really difficult to understand as I really loved my job. I had one episode involving a hypo that I dealt with, another time I had a morning off because I had a hypo in the middle of the night and an episode after the students had gone home where I went to the toilet to be sick as my blood glucose was really high. Also I’d been doing loads of overtime and I was feeling exhausted.


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## Jodee (Jan 17, 2020)

John P Waddington said:


> I work in a college for young adults with autism. Learning Support Assistant.


I would think therein is the reason John.  If for instance you did have uncontrolled hypo's when on your own on a one to one or even with another support worker employee with a group of special needs autistic young adults it could cause both problems for you and the young adults who may not know what to do and any person with you would then not only have to address what is happening with you but also be responsible for the special needs autistic young adults single handedly.  Its just safe guarding everyone is probably what they are trying to achieve.  I can understand this having worked with special needs and a autistic young adult.


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## John P Waddington (Jan 17, 2020)

Jodee said:


> I would think therein is the reason John.  If for instance you did have uncontrolled hypo's when on your own on a one to one or even with another support worker employee with a group of special needs autistic young adults it could cause both problems for you and the young adults who may not know what to do and any person with you would then not only have to address what is happening with you but also be responsible for the special needs autistic young adults single handedly.  Its just safe guarding everyone is probably what they are trying to achieve.  I can understand this having worked with special needs and a autistic young adult.


I don’t have nor did I have uncontrollable hypos. I dealt with the hypo with Glucose tablets.


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## Jodee (Jan 17, 2020)

John P Waddington said:


> I don’t have nor did I have uncontrollable hypos. I dealt with the hypo with Glucose tablets.


I would say they would need proof of that for the safety of all concerned.  As an employee they would be held responsible which is why they need to show that all concerned were safe, they wouldn't be able to leave it to chance not having monitored the situation.  I know its not what you want to hear, but honestly I don't think you are being discriminated against, the employer just wants to be responsible in making sure your charges in the work situation are safe, they are required to do so by law.


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## John P Waddington (Jan 17, 2020)

How do you prove that? Apart from the fact I was ok and able to continue working for the rest of the day.


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## Robin (Jan 17, 2020)

John P Waddington said:


> How do you prove that?


An 'uncontrollable hypo' normally requires the intervention of a third party, if you treated it yourself, I’d say that proved it wasn’t uncontrollable!
Whilst I take Jodee's point about the safety of the young adults in question, it seems to me that by immediately sidelining you into a job that has totally  different hours and work patterns, your employers have not taken steps to make 'reasonable adjustments' in order for you to carry out your job, and as Diabetes is treated as a disability, they should do. I hope you get some good advice and support from Diabetes Uk and your union.


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## Jodee (Jan 17, 2020)

John P Waddington said:


> How do you prove that? Apart from the fact I was ok and able to continue working for the rest of the day.


Probably by recording details each time it occurs date time, what you ate, last time you ate, what action you took and time you took to recover and able to continue doing every day tasks, works etc.  Perhaps speak with your diabetes nurse clinic too to back up information for your employer.

Best wishes John


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## stephknits (Jan 17, 2020)

As part of my job, I work with special needs groups and have never had to prove anything of the sort.


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## everydayupsanddowns (Jan 17, 2020)

John P Waddington said:


> Contacted the union and Diabetes UK this morning. They will get back to me. I’m being treated like I have done something wrong by the management - this is really difficult to understand as I really loved my job. I had one episode involving a hypo that I dealt with, another time I had a morning off because I had a hypo in the middle of the night and an episode after the students had gone home where I went to the toilet to be sick as my blood glucose was really high. Also I’d been doing loads of overtime and I was feeling exhausted.



From your description, it certainly doesn't sound like your diabetes has adversely impacted your ability to do your job any more than a person occasionally having a sickness bug or whatever.

Really hope the union and DUK can offer practical and effective support through this difficult time, and that you speedily get a successful resolution.


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## John P Waddington (Jan 17, 2020)

Right now I feel like I'm having a hypo but my blood is 8. Just searched the forum and found that lowering blood glucose too quickly can give false hypos that aren't dangerous but just as unpleasant, I feel sluggish and like I'm in free fall. eyes twitching. better not eat too many biscuits I suppose. Although they do look good.


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## everydayupsanddowns (Jan 17, 2020)

John P Waddington said:


> Right now I feel like I'm having a hypo but my blood is 8. Just searched the forum and found that lowering blood glucose too quickly can give false hypos that aren't dangerous but just as unpleasant, I feel sluggish and like I'm in free fall. eyes twitching. better not eat too many biscuits I suppose. Although they do look good.



Hehe! Yes. Sometimes if average BG has been elevated for some time the body's glucose 'thermostat' sort of resets at a higher level, and warning symptoms of impending low blood glucose can be triggered at perfectly fine BG levels.

The reverse can also happen where levels have run too low or too the person has experienced frequent hypos resulting in impaired awareness of hypoglycaemia. Eventually the body stops alarming until BG is lower what the level at which the brain can function.


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## John P Waddington (Jan 17, 2020)

Wow! so if the body can function at higher or lower levels, is it safe to have blood glucose at a range between 15 - 8 (for example) or is it dangerous? I'm not really aware of the information as I was diagnosed in May in Leicester (because I am registered with a G.P in Wales I couldn't get free prescriptions in England) I moved to Cardiff and 'fell through the cracks' of NHS support. I have an appointment for a freestyle libre pump in February so hopefully things will improve. I suffer with depression and have neglected my medication previously. Might be why I suffered a bit at work.


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## everydayupsanddowns (Jan 17, 2020)

John P Waddington said:


> Wow! so if the body can function at higher or lower levels, is it safe to have blood glucose at a range between 15 - 8 (for example) or is it dangerous?



Sadly not! The body usually runs between 3.8 and 8ish, but tome spend at the upper levels is short lived.

When you are playing at being your own pancreas the current thinking is to aim for as much time as possible between 4 and 10, ideally 70% or more of the time, with no more than 4% below 4.0 and as little as you can manage above 10.

Excess glucose in the bloodstream puts strain on both the large and small blood vessels, and also the nervous system. So prolonged exposure to elevated BG increases the risk of developing long term diabetes complications including eye problems, nerve problems, kidney problems and heart/circulation problems


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## Pumper_Sue (Jan 17, 2020)

John P Waddington said:


> I have an appointment for a freestyle libre pump in February so hopefully things will improve.


Hello John,
just to clarify things for you the freestyle Libre is a glucose monitoring system not a pump.


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## John P Waddington (Jan 17, 2020)

what's a pump then? Does that not come with the monitor?


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## Pumper_Sue (Jan 17, 2020)

John P Waddington said:


> what's a pump then? Does that not come with the monitor?


A pump delivers insulin at the rate you set it to deliver. You need to be able to carb count know how to adjust your insulin etc., before you can have one oh and be very fit for the hoop jumping involved in getting one.

The libre is a patch that sticks on your arm with a very small needle/sensor under the skin. This monitors your  blood sugar 24/7 for 14 days  you can see the reading by swiping the reader/meter over the sensor any time you want.


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## everydayupsanddowns (Jan 17, 2020)

John P Waddington said:


> what's a pump then? Does that not come with the monitor?



An insulin pump is a different way of delivering insulin rather than injections. Your insulin is delivered thorugh a cannula placed under the skin and controlled by a smallish electronic device worn or attached on the body. https://www.diabetes.org.uk/guide-t...diabetes/treating-your-diabetes/insulin-pumps

A Libre is a form of contiunuous glucose monitor, which measures glucose in interstitiual fluid and can give a reading at any time simpley by waving the reader over the sensor. The sensor also stores 8 hours of data, so a scan first thing in the morning will show a glucose profile of the complete period overnight. https://www.diabetes.org.uk/guide-t...our-diabetes/testing/flash-glucose-monitoring


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## MrDaibetes (Jan 17, 2020)

John P Waddington said:


> I work in a college for young adults with autism. Learning Support Assistant.


They should not discriminate against your hypos. I would seek furth advice from DUK & the union.


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## Bexlee (Jan 17, 2020)

Hi all and @John P Waddington. I work in a school. We have a system in place for the odd time I have a hypo or a hyper when in charge of classes of children (ie all day!!). I’ve used it 3 times in 18 months. 

I see no reason personally whether it be special needs students or students in general that you need to pulled out of what you do. 

It seems as if those making decisions have a lack of understanding / ill educated on diabetes. 

They do need to make reasonable adjustments (just like they do for children) - that could be, as in my case, something simple like a walkie talkie that I use to notify the set person I need 5 minutes out - admittedly we did play like lit kids when we first got wallow talkies! It works well 

best of luck


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## Bruce Stephens (Jan 17, 2020)

everydayupsanddowns said:


> A Libre is a form of contiunuous glucose monitor, which measures glucose in interstitiual fluid and can give a reading at any time simpley by waving the reader over the sensor. The sensor also stores 8 hours of data, so a scan first thing in the morning will show a glucose profile of the complete period overnight.



Which would potentially provide a way to provide direct evidence of lack of significant hypos, if that's what the employer is looking for.


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