# Why some countries have suspended the AstraZeneca vaccine and what it means for Australia – explainer



## Northerner (Mar 15, 2021)

Several European countries, including Norway, Denmark, the Netherlands and Ireland, have temporarily suspended the rollout of the AstraZeneca vaccine following concerns about deep vein thrombosis, pulmonary embolism and blood clotting. Meanwhile, Italy, Austria, Estonia, Latvia, Luxembourg and Lithuania have stopped inoculations from one particular batch of 1m doses that was sent to 17 countries.

Vaccination programs with the AstraZeneca vaccine are continuing in other countries, including the United Kingdom and France. The UK is encouraging people to continue to be vaccinated.

According to AstraZeneca, there have been 15 instances of deep vein thrombosis and 22 events of pulmonary embolism reported among more than 17m people vaccinated in the European Union and UK.

In Australia, the prime minister and health minister have said there are no plans to halt the rollout. So should Australians be worried?









						Why some countries have suspended the AstraZeneca vaccine and what it means for Australia – explainer
					

Despite inoculation suspensions across Europe, authorities and experts say there is no link between the Covid-19 vaccine and blood clots




					www.theguardian.com
				




Also this:









						There's no proof the Oxford vaccine causes blood clots. So why are people worried? | David Spiegelhalter
					

It’s human nature to spot patterns in data. But we should be careful about finding causal links where none may exist, says statistician David Spiegelhalter




					www.theguardian.com


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## Eddy Edson (Mar 15, 2021)

Grist for the anti-vaxxer mill, unfortunately.


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## Spozkins (Mar 15, 2021)

It would be good not to use the term anti-vaxxer here. 

I'm one of those people deeply cynical about medicine and that's because I've had a lot of issues with medications I've been on AND one of them was a very bad reaction to a vaccine when I was younger. 


Yes most medications set out to do what they're supposed to but they're not cures and theres a reason things come with huge lists of side effects on the packaging. I'm somebody who is living with a pretty rubbish health condition I acquired through a medication so I like to now be a bit more informed about what I put in my body - whether its medical, synthetic or food. 

I feel like the term anti-vaxxer is directed at people like me but I feel justified in living my life based on my own experiences. Would you say that's fair? 

It's good to have an open conversation about it but please dont stereotype.


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## Amity Island (Mar 15, 2021)

Spozkins said:


> It would be good not to use the term anti-vaxxer here.
> 
> I'm one of those people deeply cynical about medicine and that's because I've had a lot of issues with medications I've been on AND one of them was a very bad reaction to a vaccine when I was younger.
> 
> ...


Hi Spozkins,

I agree with your feeling on things. Unfortunately, it's become the standard response to anyone questioning the way in which covid19 deaths are being recorded or anyone who as you say wants be make there own decisions about vaccines. It reminds me of the Iraq war when Bush said you are either "with us or against us". No room for anyone to remain neutral or just wanting to keep away from either side of a war.
I have reservations about the new vaccine, but I'm not anti-vaxxer, it's just the fact that when they were released there were more unknowns than knowns. I like to know before I committ to anything , be that taking any medication, food, carbs, buying a house etc. And, there is absolutely NOTHING wrong with wanting to make an informed decision without being coerced or brow beaten into anything or made out to be an anti-vaxxer or covid denier.


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## Eddy Edson (Mar 15, 2021)

Spozkins said:


> It would be good not to use the term anti-vaxxer here.
> 
> I'm one of those people deeply cynical about medicine and that's because I've had a lot of issues with medications I've been on AND one of them was a very bad reaction to a vaccine when I was younger.
> 
> ...


I wouldn't call having concerns etc "anti-vaxx". I'd reserve that for spreading misinformation, conspiracy theories etc.


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## Amity Island (Mar 15, 2021)

Eddy Edson said:


> I wouldn't call having concerns etc "anti-vaxx". I'd reserve that for spreading misinformation, conspiracy theories etc.


Hi Eddy,

I would love to see some of these conspiracy theories. I've heard a lot about them being pushed around but not actually seen any of them in any detail. Would you be able to point me to a good source as I would like to have a look at them, just to see how far they are from reality.


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## mikeydt1 (Mar 15, 2021)

after it was mentioned on R2 last night seems it has gone around the internet community esp for those who have had the astra jab and not on this forum but i am seeing people coming on saying they are frightened as to what is going to happen to them.  i for one am just going to see how this all pans out before making any decision to have the jab.

well i didn't open the can seems R2 last night did.


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## mikeyB (Mar 15, 2021)

I’ve had the AZ jab. No problems.

In any event, today it’s been announced that the AZ jab was not the cause of the blood clotting problems that caused all this fuss, after full medical investigation of each case. So it has panned out.

 Hope you don’t catch Covid before you make a decision.


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## Ljc (Mar 15, 2021)

I use the term anti Vaxxer not for people like yourself @Spozkins , who have very real reasons to be , putting mildly very worried because they have had bad reactions, health problems because of vaccines   I use it for the same reasons as  @Eddy Edson in post 5 as I believe most of us on here do. 
So please don’t feel upset etc when you see that term on here as we sure do not mean it for those like yourself who have very real concerns.


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## RirisR (Mar 15, 2021)

I have had my 1st injection of the AZ jab no problems except a couple of ropey days
I know this probably doesnt make sense but I am now scared about having the 2nd dose
really don't know what to do about it


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## LancashireLass (Mar 15, 2021)

I have to be honest and say I am also a little concerned about my second dose of AZ.

I had my first a couple of weeks ago now and am still having some aching/numbness/weakness in the arm along with redness and bruising that appears to come and go.  Of course I googled the signs of blood clots because of these stories in the news and guess what they are!!  (shouldn't have done that, it's never a good idea) I was quite poorly the day after, but that soon went away however the arm is still not right.

I've contacted my GP today and am awaiting a call back.


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## Robin (Mar 15, 2021)

I’m much more concerned about being run over on my way to the vaccine centre, I think there’s more chance of that than having a blood clot afterwards.


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## LancashireLass (Mar 15, 2021)

Different strokes for different folks, as they say


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## silentsquirrel (Mar 15, 2021)

Why has the word "explanation" been replaced by "explainer"??


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## mikeyB (Mar 15, 2021)

@Just.Brew.It , that sore arm is likely to be due to the injection needle, not the vaccine. It’s an intramuscular injection, so there’s always a slim chance it nicked a small blood vessel, causing a small intramuscular bleed. Such small bleeds have nowhere to go, so it takes a while for the body to get rid of it. It has nothing to do with the vaccine, or dissemination of blood clots.

Years ago, I had a patient who was in  a female to male transition. He needed monthly testosterone injections intramuscular - testosterone  is a thick oily injection, so went into the gluteal muscle. Even with a wider needle, I think only once in 5 years was a blood vessel nicked, causing similar problems to yours.


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## LancashireLass (Mar 15, 2021)

@mikeyB that's interesting, I've learned something new there, had no idea that could happen!


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## Dinky64 (Mar 15, 2021)

I suffer with spontaneous blood clots and I'm on anti coagulants for life, which won't stop clots but should make me less susceptible.
I am a survivor of 2 bouts of PE and I'm lucky to be alive...it is a nasty condition and I wouldn't wish it on my worse enemy.
I've had the first injection, I was a little "fluey" for 48 hours and it wasn't until after then that my arm became sore and heavy but tbh I expected these type of reactions.
At the moment I'm unsure how I feel about the second injection, part of me is saying "well you were ok after the first one" and part is saying "tempting fete there might not be third time lucky"!??
I think I'll keep on the news etc..and decide later.


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## everydayupsanddowns (Mar 15, 2021)

Amity Island said:


> Hi Eddy,
> 
> I would love to see some of these conspiracy theories. I've heard a lot about them being pushed around but not actually seen any of them in any detail. Would you be able to point me to a good source as I would like to have a look at them, just to see how far they are from reality.



The conspiracy theories I've heard being countered (rather than come across directly) were that the vaccine

Can give you covid (it can't)
Contains eggs or meat (it doesn't and the vaccines are halal and kosher)
Can make you infertile (there is no evidence for this)
Contain tiny microchips so that Bill Gates can track you (I mean... )
So they are all quite attention grabby and emotive. Designed to create fear and a strong reaction.

Sad really.


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## trophywench (Mar 15, 2021)

It is said by doctors (at least one a immunologist involved with those who advise the MHRA tonight on the BBC 6pm main news) that the side effects from the 1st dose of the OAZ are usually worse than the second and vice versa for the Pfizer.   I look forward to telling you if that is true for Pfizer #2 in April !  I still fully intend to have my #2, whatever.


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## Eddy Edson (Mar 15, 2021)

everydayupsanddowns said:


> The conspiracy theories I've heard being countered (rather than come across directly) were that the vaccine
> 
> Can give you covid (it can't)
> Contains eggs or meat (it doesn't and the vaccines are halal and kosher)
> ...


https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/ is great for tracking & refuting anti-vaxx nonsense.

This piece is good for a view ranging from the general to a high-profile particular piece of anti-vaxx woo. 









						A “not antivaccine” antivax pediatrician asks how we will know a COVID-19 vaccine is safe and effective
					

Dr. Liz Mumper is associated with Robert F. Kennedy, Jr.'s antivax organization Children's Health Defense. She recently gave a presentation asking: How will we know that a COVID vaccine is safe? It's



					sciencebasedmedicine.org


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## Amity Island (Mar 16, 2021)

everydayupsanddowns said:


> The conspiracy theories I've heard being countered (rather than come across directly) were that the vaccine
> 
> Can give you covid (it can't)
> Contains eggs or meat (it doesn't and the vaccines are halal and kosher)
> ...


Mike, thanks for your reply. I don't think I'll bother looking into any of them! lol


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## Amity Island (Mar 16, 2021)

Eddy Edson said:


> https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/ is great for tracking & refuting anti-vaxx nonsense.
> 
> This piece is good for a view ranging from the general to a high-profile particular piece of anti-vaxx woo.
> 
> ...


Thanks Eddy, I'll have a look and get back.


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## mikeydt1 (Mar 19, 2021)

countries have now been given the all clear to use the astra vaccine but on Sky news UK regulator is warning if anyone gets a headache for 4 days or more then they must seek medical attention.

is it me or is there all ways a spanner in the works?

https://news.sky.com/story/covid-19...-medical-attention-says-uk-regulator-12249755


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## Amity Island (Mar 20, 2021)

mikeydt1 said:


> countries have now been given the all clear to use the astra vaccine but on Sky news UK regulator is warning if anyone gets a headache for 4 days or more then they must seek medical attention.
> 
> is it me or is there all ways a spanner in the works?
> 
> https://news.sky.com/story/covid-19...-medical-attention-says-uk-regulator-12249755


I wonder if it's related to this news story today?









						German researchers find thrombosis after Astra-Zeneca Vaccine
					

Researchers found out that an immune response to the vaccine could involve formation of antibodies that are normally formed only when an organism needs to heal a wound through blood coagulation, the German broadcaster NDR reported.    These antibodies then “activate” the platelets and could...




					forum.diabetes.org.uk


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