# Diet drinks linked to 'increased risk of vascular event'



## MeanMom (Apr 15, 2012)

I sometimes buy a magazine called 'healthy food guide' and in the April Edition there was a small article about a study in America which found that

"over 10 years, adults who drank at least one diet drink every day were 43% more likely to suffer from a vascular event such as a heart attack or stroke than those who had fewer than six a week...the researchers took into account fat and salt intakes, as well as activity levels and the weight of the people they studied - so it doesn't seem to be due to other unhealthy habits..."

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2012/01/120131092746.htm

I don't know about others but before K was diagnosed I tried to steer clear of Artificial sweetener - we have also always had very little 'added sugar' but her drinks of choice were fruit juice (often diluted), the occasional full sugar squash, and water. She drinks mainly low sugar squash now - but she doesn't really like it much. In fact since she had chicken pox a couple a months ago she has started drinking juice again (often having to have a separate injection for it between meals) Her team have told us to try and cut back again as they don't recommend juice more than once a day (with a meal) but it's hard to do this - especially when presented with this sort of 'research'

It's very hard to strike a 'balance' between healthy blood sugar levels and looking after things like cholesterol levels, blood pressure etc.

(and before anyone says 'just drink water' - yes, K quite often does, but really, how many teenagers do that - or adults come to that?)


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## Northerner (Apr 15, 2012)

Must admit I think that these sorts of studies appear to overstate the risks. Although it says a 43% greater risk, how many out of the 2560 people would have had a 'vascular event' anyway? If it was one person out of the ones who didn't drink them, and there are two people it affects who have been drinking diet drinks then this could be described as a 100% greater risk, but it's still only 2 people out of 2560 (not saying those are the numbers, just illustrating how it can be made to seem worse than it is).

Anyway, I very much doubt that you could pin the blame on anything so precisely over a 10 year period.


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## HelenM (Apr 15, 2012)

?The message for diet soft drink drinkers is not to be alarmed,? said the lead author, Hannah Gardener, an epidemiologist at the University of Miami. ?What we?ve found is an association, and it might be due to chance or other unmeasured variables
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/02/28/h...t-drinks-linked-to-risk-of-heart-disease.html
ie.correlation doesn't mean causation!
The average age of the subjects was 69.
They were only asked once about the amount of soft drinks they drank, so that measure doesn't necessarily apply for the whole ten years of the study.
They did try to control for all sorts of factors but you never know what might have affected the results .

Official conclusion says'Further research is needed before any conclusions can be made regarding the potential health consequences of diet soft drink consumption.'
http://www.springerlink.com/content/b042807u865853t7/

As to the number of cardiovascular events, that's one thing that struck me
out of  2564 subjects there were 591 combined cardiovascular events (I assume some people had more than one,) It seems a pretty unhealthy bunch of people . Following that up I found that the study is of people in Northern Manhattan; an area where 34% live below the poverty line .

I don't think that diet drinks are out of the firing line . There have been other studies that may show problems see wiki  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diet_soda
At the moment I just think it points to moderation.


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## Northerner (Apr 15, 2012)

Thank you Helen


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## MeanMom (Apr 15, 2012)

Yes, Helen Thank you

That was my point really (as usual waffled so much it was hidden)

I am very much a 'everything in moderation' person - but I meant that it is hard to drink 'diet drinks' in moderation when you have been advised to avoid the alternative (fruit juice) because you are diabetic. 

Rock/Hard Place


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## ukjohn (Apr 15, 2012)

Mean mom

Something you might like to try for K is a drink  which is just fruit and water, no added sugar or sweetners, it is just the natural sugar from the fruit, its called, "Feel good, orange and mango" its in a 400ml plastic bottle. stocked by Tesco. I drink it on a regular basis.

John.


PS. They also do a fizzy version in 750 ml glass bottles.


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## MeanMom (Apr 15, 2012)

Thank you John - I appreciate that but unless I'm reading it wrong that's also around 9 carbs per 100ml (all sugar) - the 400ml bottle would be 36g carbs (ish). OJ is around 10 g carbs per 100ml (again all sugar). 

Her team say that sort of thing better limited to once a day with meals. 

I think she would like it tho' so will get some in for a 'change'. 

Thanks for letting me know


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## ukjohn (Apr 15, 2012)

Mean Mum.

Sorry perhaps I should have given you that information off the bottle which I have in front of me now. Protein 0.2g....Carbs 9g (of which sugars 8.8g) with a side note that contains only 100% naturally occuring fruit sugar..So your numbers are spot on.
fat 0g... fibre 0.2g....sodium 0g...This drink has never affected my BG..


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## Robster65 (Apr 15, 2012)

Unfortunately John, it's a fault of marketing that can make soem natural sugary products seem ok for type 1s. ANy drink such as OJ or similar will have a dramatic effect on a T1's BGs in any sort of quantity.

It's why OJ is sometimes recommended as a hypo treatment (although I wouldn't go there personally). High GI and high (enough) suar content, albeit natural.

You may find that a bottle of it would send you high within about half an hour but it'll come down again after an hour, as a T2.

Rob


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## ukjohn (Apr 15, 2012)

Robster65 said:


> Unfortunately John, it's a fault of marketing that can make soem natural sugary products seem ok for type 1s. ANy drink such as OJ or similar will have a dramatic effect on a T1's BGs in any sort of quantity.
> 
> It's why OJ is sometimes recommended as a hypo treatment (although I wouldn't go there personally). High GI and high (enough) suar content, albeit natural.
> 
> ...



Why do you think a Type2 on mdi, is any different Rob..


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## Robster65 (Apr 15, 2012)

I don't know John. I suspect you're not but you said the fruit jiuce had no effect on your BGs, which I think it may do but you may have missed the rise.

It is very high GI and would normally make your BGs rise quite quickly so you may have missed the spike when testing.

I wasn't suggesting any demarcation. Merely warnign that fruit jiuce at approx 10% sucrose is still a potent BG raiser! 

Rob


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## Robster65 (Apr 15, 2012)

PS. It may be that some T2s on MDI still have residual pancreas function (I really don't know) and may be able to cope better with fruit jiuce.


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## ukjohn (Apr 15, 2012)

That why I couldn't understand why you made trhe point in your message which suggested that type 2 are different, if you not sure why make the remark as a statement and confuse people. another point for Rob., you just mentioned that type2 may have residual pancreas function, as I understand it this also applies to type 1s  also known as honeymoon phase. nothing is straight forward and all people are different, theres no one size fits all be it type1 or type2.


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## MeanMom (Apr 15, 2012)

John  - I'm a bit confused - where you recommending the drink because it doesn't effect your levels whereas straight OJ does? If that is what you meant then I will get some for K tomorrow and hope the same is true for her 

Edit : K certainly has no pancreas function BTW


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## ukjohn (Apr 15, 2012)

Meanmom

I haven't tried drinking the whole 400 ml in one go, I drink it throught the night and day. I would thing the maximum I have drunk in one go is about 100ml, and that has never effected my BG, but as I said elsewhere everyone is different, so check and test 100ml then increase if things are ok with K..


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## Austin Mini (Apr 15, 2012)

I was told not to eat more than two eggs a week in 1988. This year It seems I can have two eggs a day. I dont believe everything I read take much with a pinch of salt (is that ok to say that?).


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## MeanMom (Apr 15, 2012)

O I see John - I think if you drink it like that you might get away with it - not sure K would but will do some experiments and let you know

Thanks - K loves Mango


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## ukjohn (Apr 15, 2012)

Its OK to say that Austin, you have the freedom to express your own feelings and opinions in here. I might diagree or even have a few cross words with people by expressing things as I see them which are MY opinions, but I will be the first with anyone I've crossed swords with, to sit with them and buy them a pint.And thats as it should be, all forgotten and in the past. There are many many good people in this group.

John.


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## ukjohn (Apr 15, 2012)

MeanMom said:


> O I see John - I think if you drink it like that you might get away with it - not sure K would but will do some experiments and let you know
> 
> Thanks - K loves Mango




Hope it works out for her meanmom, it is a nice drink.

John.


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## trophywench (Apr 15, 2012)

Have to say fructose raises my BG just as much as any other thing.  I know the breakdown in the body is sposed to be different for fructose but it seems my body hasn't read that article.

A carb is a carb is a carb. Almost invariably with me wherever the label says it comes from ....  I have no idea whether I have any residual insulin/C-peptide at all.

If you'll forgive me John, whilst T2's are still producing any insulin, one feature they may also have is Insulin Resistance (which although some T1's may get or have that, it isn't a regular feature like it is for T2) so they could still be producing 'quite a lot' of insulin.  Could it be because it's fruit sugar instead of any other kind - your residual is sufficient to handle it?

I certainly haven't a clue.

Meself I stick to Tesco's own fizzy flavoured water.  They were selling it on Thurs for '4 bottles for ? whatever' - which they often are and we stock up - so I have an open one and 4 new ones.  Every one a different flavour.  1 Litre bottles.  Just checked all 4 and max carbs in any of them, per 100ml - 0.3g.  delish!  - peach & apricot currently my fave.  That's 0.2g Carb per 100ml .....

No artificial anything ......


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## MeanMom (Apr 15, 2012)

Trophy that drink sounds interesting too -  do you know if they do a non fizzy version? (not that I have a fussy child AT ALL)


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## trophywench (Apr 15, 2012)

Don't think they do - however I think H2O do a still one, not so many flavours though.  Haven't tried it so dunno if it's any good.  It's (all) only about 60p or something so well worth trying and not so expensive you'd blench if you had to pour it down the sink.

It's more 'slightly aerated' than dead fizzy.  But in any case, there's a very quick way of curing it being fizzy.  Even in the fridge, but don't open the seal on the bottle till you're ready to start drinking it.  Just pour it into an open jug and leave it.  Then when the fizz has died, pour it back in the bottle! - I do it all the time with orange Lucozade for hypos - far too fizzy when I'm hypo, hurts my throat.


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## everydayupsanddowns (Apr 17, 2012)

trophywench said:


> ...I know the breakdown in the body is sposed to be different for fructose but it seems my body hasn't read that article.



Thanks for that brilliant turn of phrase TW. Genuinely made me LOL and I will now have to adopt it for future use.

Pass the sugar free squash!


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## Monica (Apr 20, 2012)

trophywench said:


> Meself I stick to Tesco's own fizzy flavoured water.  They were selling it on Thurs for '4 bottles for ? whatever' - which they often are and we stock up - so I have an open one and 4 new ones.  Every one a different flavour.  1 Litre bottles.  Just checked all 4 and max carbs in any of them, per 100ml - 0.3g.  delish!  - peach & apricot currently my fave.  That's 0.2g Carb per 100ml .....
> 
> No artificial anything ......



Carol drinks those too!!!
I usually buy "apple & raspberry" and "lemon&lime" for her. Unfortunately they stopped selling the orange one. I like most flavours, not sure about the peach one though.


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## robert@fm (Apr 21, 2012)

I like Tescos flavoured mineral waters as well.

LiDL recently introduced six-packs (500ml bottles) of their own-brand flavoured mineral water (Carrick Glen, the flavours I saw were lemon & lime, apple & blackcurrant and strawberry & kiwi -- I don't know if there are any others).  After checking the labels (ridiculously microscopic print, I swear it was only about 2pt type) to make sure they were no-added-sugar, I decided to treat myself to one pack of each.  Big mistake; despite ranging from 0.2 to 0.5 grams carbohydrate per 100ml, they turned out to be far, far too sweet to my taste.  I've given the remaining 15 bottles to William; he's been smoking for years, so it's a wonder he can still taste anything at all.


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