# Does lightning strike twice?



## Pumper_Sue (Apr 7, 2022)

Charlie my new puppy hasn't been all that well since I've had him (runny bum)not gaining weight and far to quiet for a puppy. After an elimination process it works out my little man has an allergy to chicken 
Devastated is an understatement as it's so difficult and very expensive as well to find puppy food for him that does not have chicken in any shape or form in it.

So little chap is now on adult food at 17 weeks of age, tum and bum better and weight is now going on him as well. He is also so much happier in himself and acting like a very cheeky puppy which most of the time is lovely  to see 

Milly also had a chicken allergy  so seems almost unbelievable that two dogs one after the other have a chicken allergy.


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## Leadinglights (Apr 7, 2022)

Pumper_Sue said:


> Charlie my new puppy hasn't been all that well since I've had him (runny bum)not gaining weight and far to quiet for a puppy. After an elimination process it works out my little man has an allergy to chicken
> Devastated is an understatement as it's so difficult and very expensive as well to find puppy food for him that does not have chicken in any shape or form in it.
> 
> So little chap is now on adult food at 17 weeks of age, tum and bum better and weight is now going on him as well. He is also so much happier in himself and acting like a very cheeky puppy which most of the time is lovely  to see
> ...


Our retriever was allergic to chicken, I think we used a James Wellbeloved food or one from the vet. A friend used to feed her dog a vegetarian dog food.


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## nonethewiser (Apr 8, 2022)

Pumper_Sue said:


> Charlie my new puppy hasn't been all that well since I've had him (runny bum)not gaining weight and far to quiet for a puppy. After an elimination process it works out my little man has an allergy to chicken
> Devastated is an understatement as it's so difficult and very expensive as well to find puppy food for him that does not have chicken in any shape or form in it.
> 
> So little chap is now on adult food at 17 weeks of age, tum and bum better and weight is now going on him as well. He is also so much happier in himself and acting like a very cheeky puppy which most of the time is lovely  to see
> ...



That's strange to have 2 dogs with same allergy, poor little lad.

Reason why puppy food mainly contains chicken is its easily digested so easy on puppy's stomach, think own pup got sick  of chicken taste  but did manage to find brand containing Angus beef to mix things up.

Pleased your dog is gaining weight & feeling much better & doing what puppies do.


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## Thebearcametoo (Apr 8, 2022)

It’s not common but it does happen often enough for it to just be an unlucky coincidence. As he gets older he may be able to tolerate it again but it’s good you’ve found something he can eat safely now. Hope the new found puppy exuberance isn’t too much to cope with


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## eggyg (Apr 8, 2022)

Oh no. Poor Charlie. Glad he’s much better now. My son in law is allergic to chicken and eggs and it’s hard enough being an adult with that allergy never mind a carnivore dog.


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## Pumper_Sue (Apr 8, 2022)

Thebearcametoo said:


> It’s not common but it does happen often enough for it to just be an unlucky coincidence. As he gets older he may be able to tolerate it again but it’s good you’ve found something he can eat safely now. Hope the new found puppy exuberance isn’t too much to cope with


As puppies go he is first class in the home he tends to let go once out and about in the forestry and or when playing with other dogs.
Charlie is now learning the hard way that no does mean no when his doggy friends tell him enough is enough  

I have a neurology apt., tomorrow so will be away for about 4 hours so Charlie is going to have his 1st taste of staying with my friends and their two lovely bitches. Two very kind staid girls who will very politely explain where the bus stop is 

Devious plan is he will be so worn out he will sleep most of the day


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## everydayupsanddowns (Apr 8, 2022)

Glad you were able to work out what it was.

Mine has a sensitivity to grains (too much loosens him right up )

Fortunately grain-free foods are getting more and more common these says. 

Glad to hear that Charlie is back to his cheeky best


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## Pumper_Sue (Apr 8, 2022)

everydayupsanddowns said:


> Mine has a sensitivity to grains (too much loosens him right up )


Milly was the same and this little chap came with a grain free diet, so for obvious reasons have stuck to that.

Took Charlie on an educational tour today.. garden centre plus the vets for a weigh in. I'm sure those scales tell lies as he came in at 15kg 
Vet nurses say he is just right though so I'm ok with that and he had fun playing with the nurses  A call went out over the speakers .............. puppy alert I never knew there were so many vet nurses in the practice


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## IrvineHimself (Apr 21, 2022)

In the early 90's I  inherited a freshly trained team of high security search-guard dogs from a ex-legionnaire friend who had been diagnosed with prostrate cancer.  A 10 year veteran who, after serving at  Dien Bien Phu and Algeria, subsequently worked as a private security contractor for the French government, he was a really old time, military dog handler with very traditional views on canine nutrition and health care.

For convenience. portability and good dental health, he strongly recommend the crunchy, very hard dog biscuit. I am not sure of the UK brands, but I know Pedigree make them. Super-market own brands are perfectly acceptable, so shop around, Remember, they *should be really hard and crunchy*. Once the dog is used to them. you can just leave some in a bowl and the dog will just eat when hungry.

*Note:* you must give the dog a ready supply of fresh water. Don't just look at it's water bowl to see if it's empty, but consciously make the effort to rinse a large bowl and refill it with fresh water three or four times a day.

As a treat, smoked pigs ears are always popular and also great for the teeth, but to really get that old tail whirling like a helicopter. how about a traditional dog food recipe, (I had two very active Belgian Sheppards, so adjust quantities to suit)

Ingredients:

About 500+ grams of either low quality whole grain rice or, even better, dog rice
A dozen +, croissants old and dry are perfect. (I used to get leftovers  from my boulanger.)
Between about 400 and 600 grams of beef scrap, (*no bones*,) from your butcher, (explain what its for)
Any old vegetables you have lying around
Boil the vegetables, rice and beef scrap for about an hour or more, adding water as necessary to ensure there is an adequate supply of gravy.  Once the rice is fully cooked, crumple in the croissants to soak up some of the juices and leave to cool. (Remember, by human standards  it's classed  low quality rice so it takes quite a while for it to fully cook)

Any wet food is not great for a dogs teeth, but as a treat, birthday parties, Christmas...  etc it is perfect.

Alternatively:  Apparently veganism is very good for dogs

Irvine

Edit:
Make sure there are no bone fragments by chopping the beef scrap into small bite sized chunks. It goes withou saying that any vegetables should also be chopped up

Edit 2:
As I point out below, I was never much for measuring with scales and the like, and. thinking about it, I've probably got the quantities wrong for the amount of rice in the above recipe.

You want about an inch of rice in the bottom of a soup pot, just enough to just cover your fingers, so that, when fully cooked with whatever vegetables, beef scraps and croissants are available, the pot is roughly 2/3 to 3/4 full.

Remember, this serves two very active guard dogs, so adjust quantities as needed


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## Pumper_Sue (Apr 21, 2022)

IrvineHimself said:


> For convenience. portability and good dental health, he strongly recommend the crunchy, very hard dog biscuit. I am not sure of the UK brands, but I know Pedigree make them. Super-market own brands are perfectly acceptable, so shop around, Remember, they *should be really hard and crunchy*. Once the dog is used to them. you can just leave some in a bowl and the dog will just eat when hungry.


Hello and thanks for your input 
Young Charlie is on a adult very crunchie salmon and potato dry food diet. 
Leaving food down for him to pick at is not practical as he goes to my friends when I have a hospital appointment and she has two dogs so best to polish off in one go  Mind you Charlie just demolishes all in his bowl now he has a food he likes and can tolerate.


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## IrvineHimself (Apr 22, 2022)

Your welcome

I was never one much for measuring with scales and the like, and thinking about it, I've probably got the quantities wrong for the amount of rice in the above recipe.

You want about an inch of rice in the bottom of a soup pot, enough to just cover your fingers, so that, when fully cooked with whatever vegetables, beef scraps and croissants are available, the pot is roughly 2/3 to 3/4 full.

Remember, this serves two very active guard dogs, so adjust quantities as needed
Irvine


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## Pumper_Sue (Apr 22, 2022)

IrvineHimself said:


> Your welcome
> 
> I was never one much for measuring with scales and the like, and thinking about it, I've probably got the quantities wrong for the amount of rice in the above recipe.
> 
> ...


Charlie is fine on his dry food. Come to think of it he has no choice as I don't cook any more he is also grain free so croissants would be off the menu anyway 
He is on an adult dog food as nothing pup wise available, but then when I had my last puppy 40 or more years ago there were no special puppy foods available, pups were just weaned on to adult food from day one.
He will be 5 mths old tomorrow and is now gaining the weight he is meant to. When I introduced him to my 86 year old Mother, she asked if I would like a loan to extend my bungalow to accommodate him


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## IrvineHimself (Apr 22, 2022)

Pumper_Sue said:


> Charlie is fine on his dry food....



I am sure he is, it is also a lot better for him. 

As far as being grain free, unless you are buying a product specifically guaranteed to be grain free, I doubt it.

Grains are a major ingredient of prepared dog food, and it's not just because of costs. Dogs are not wolves, they have completely different dietary requirements. For good health, the proportion of meat product in a dogs diet should be between 10 and 15% or less, with the 'bulk' being provided by a variety of grains and other vegetable products. For example, in my traditional recipe the proportion of meat product to total volume is about a small double handful to 6 or 7 litres.

As an example of a good quality commercial product, the previously linked Pedigree dog food has the following:

GROUND WHOLE GRAIN CORN
CORN GLUTEN MEAL
SOYBEAN MEAL
DRIED PLAIN BEET PULP
BREWERS RICE
GROUND WHOLE GRAIN WHEAT
DRIED CARROTS
The precise proportions are a commercial secret, but the bulk will be either rice, corn or wheat depending on the fluctuations in the agricultural market. 

Like I say, dogs are not wolves. Their dietary requirements have evolved to reflect their symbiotic relationship with humans. 

Anyway, I am sure Charlie is perfectly happy, (and very healthy,) with his lunch.
Irvine


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## Pumper_Sue (Apr 22, 2022)

IrvineHimself said:


> GROUND WHOLE GRAIN CORN
> CORN GLUTEN MEAL
> SOYBEAN MEAL
> DRIED PLAIN BEET PULP
> ...


In simple terms Charlie has the equivalent of Coeliac disease which humans have. So yes his food is grain free 


> IrvineHimself said:
> 
> 
> > As far as being grain free, unless you are buying a product specifically guaranteed to be grain free, I doubt it.


That is precisely what is bought for his lordship


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## IrvineHimself (Apr 22, 2022)

Sorry to hear that, give him a belly rub from me


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## nonethewiser (Apr 22, 2022)

Pumper_Sue said:


> Charlie is fine on his dry food. Come to think of it he has no choice as I don't cook any more he is also grain free so croissants would be off the menu anyway
> He is on an adult dog food as nothing pup wise available, but then when I had my last puppy 40 or more years ago there were no special puppy foods available, pups were just weaned on to adult food from day one.
> He will be 5 mths old tomorrow and is now gaining the weight he is meant to. When I introduced him to my 86 year old Mother, she asked if I would like a loan to extend my bungalow to accommodate him



Sounds like dog is doing great, so pleased for him & you both.


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## Pumper_Sue (Apr 22, 2022)

nonethewiser said:


> Sounds like dog is doing great, so pleased for him & you both.


Thank you 
Charlie is off to a puppy party tomorrow   which should be fun as he does like to play with other dogs. I suspect he could be the biggest pup at the party though.


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## Drummer (Apr 22, 2022)

My black Labrador was fed on mostly animal products, curtesy of the local butcher, with a handful or two of oatmeal.
People used to try to buy him off me - he was solid muscle and bone and had so much energy.
I used to coarse chop any recognisable meat and feed it raw, then boil up the rest and put it through the mincer or let him chew on chunks which looked safe - things like the windpipe. He used to keep me fit.


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