# Random question about use by dates



## Amigo (Nov 12, 2016)

Just wondering what you'd do. I've just noticed in the fridge, a pack of 2 very nice gammon steaks in a vacuum pack which should have been used by yesterday. I absolutely hate wasting food but I'm torn about food safety.
Would you risk eating them bearing in mind it's only the next day, would you bin them or would you freeze them to eat shortly?

Just interested.


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## Jonsi (Nov 12, 2016)

The Best Before doesn't mean Crap After. As they're vacuum packed there should be little further degradation for several days yet. They were probably Nitrogen or CO2 flushed before packing anyway. Cooking over 55 degrees will kill any bacteria anyway. Smell is always the give away, if it smells off, it most likely is.
Enjoy.


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## mikeyB (Nov 12, 2016)

If it's a use by date, I really wouldn't risk it. If it's a best before, don't worry. Though fresh me never carries a best before date.

You might get away with freezing them, but the problem with that is you might not recognise them  as out of date at some time in the future. The specific trouble with gammon steaks is the added water (unless you paid premium for dry cured) that makes it easier for bacteria to multiply. So, dry cured you might well get away with freezing, if not, you might. Use by dates, of course, err on the side of absolute safety, with probably a couple of days leeway, but you can't rely on that.

As a footnote, smell is no guide to some very toxic bacteria indeed, most famously the bugs that cause botulism.


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## Amigo (Nov 12, 2016)

Jonsi said:


> The Best Before doesn't mean Crap After. As they're vacuum packed there should be little further degradation for several days yet. They were probably Nitrogen or CO2 flushed before packing anyway. Cooking over 55 degrees will kill any bacteria anyway. Smell is always the give away, if it smells off, it most likely is.
> Enjoy.



Thanks Jonsi, appreciate that. I'll test them on my husband because he's got an acute sense of smell so would know instantly 

I hate wasting food but missed these lurking at the back.


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## Robin (Nov 12, 2016)

I think when they decide on use by dates, they have to assume you've left your shopping for several hours in a hot car, so if you didn't, they'll be fine. As Jonsi says, smell it! Our parents just used their noses.
Edit. just read Mikes post. Both my parents lived to be 94, so assume they developed immunity to the undetectable nasties!


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## Amigo (Nov 12, 2016)

mikeyB said:


> If it's a use by date, I really wouldn't risk it. If it's a best before, don't worry. Though fresh me never carries a best before date.
> 
> You might get away with freezing them, but the problem with that is you might not recognise them  as out of date at some time in the future. The specific trouble with gammon steaks is the added water (unless you paid premium for dry cured) that makes it easier for bacteria to multiply. So, dry cured you might well get away with freezing, if not, you might. Use by dates, of course, err on the side of absolute safety, with probably a couple of days leeway, but you can't rely on that.
> 
> As a footnote, smell is no guide to some very toxic bacteria indeed, most famously the bugs that cause botulism.



Oh bugger, it's a 'use by' date. What to do?


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## Lindarose (Nov 12, 2016)

I'm wouldn't risk it. I have a big fear of sickness and probably waste things that are safe. But once the date is reached won't chance it.


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## Amigo (Nov 12, 2016)

Lindarose said:


> I'm wouldn't risk it. I have a big fear of sickness and probably waste things that are safe. But once the date is reached won't chance it.



I know what you mean Linda


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## mikeyB (Nov 12, 2016)

I've commented on one, but if you would like a more extensive list of food poisoning bacteria that cause no smell, I'd be happy to name a few. There was an outbreak of typhoid in the 1960s from corned beef which smelled fine and dandy.

Dump em, Amigo. I wouldn't risk it, but having had campylobacter I'm biased.


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## Amigo (Nov 12, 2016)

mikeyB said:


> I've commented on one, but if you would like a more extensive list of food poisoning bacteria that cause no smell, I'd be happy to name a few. There was an outbreak of typhoid in the 1960s from corned beef which smelled fine and dandy.
> 
> Dump em, Amigo. I wouldn't risk it, but having had campylobacter I'm biased.



Yep I've had campylobacter too and it wasn't pretty  I thought Environmental Health were going to chalk an X on my front door when I was still registering positive 10 days later! Chicken in Spain caused that.
I'm pretty sure they'll be ok but to err on the side of caution I'll probably dump them and be more careful in future.


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## grovesy (Nov 13, 2016)

Jonsi said:


> The Best Before doesn't mean Crap After. As they're vacuum packed there should be little further degradation for several days yet. They were probably Nitrogen or CO2 flushed before packing anyway. Cooking over 55 degrees will kill any bacteria anyway. Smell is always the give away, if it smells off, it most likely is.
> Enjoy.


Smell is no use to me, as I have little sense of smell due to chronic nasal allergies.


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## Vicsetter (Nov 13, 2016)

They will probably be fine, but I doubt you will not enjoy them because of your doubt.  If they smell then definitely bin them.  DO NOT FREEZE them, they will be even older by the time you defrost them and freezing does not kill toxins.


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## Amigo (Nov 13, 2016)

Vicsetter said:


> They will probably be fine, but I doubt you will not enjoy them because of your doubt.  If they smell then definitely bin them.  DO NOT FREEZE them, they will be even older by the time you defrost them and freezing does not kill toxins.



All good advice...they're already Bin-side now. Thanks folks


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## Ljc (Nov 13, 2016)

I'm rather elastic about best before and use by dates , TBH it depends what it is , I'm very careful with  pork .
I think one of these helped toughen me up lol


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## Robin (Nov 13, 2016)

Ljc said:


> I'm rather elastic about best before and use by dates , TBH it depends what it is , I'm very careful with  pork .
> I think one of these helped toughen me up lol
> 
> View attachment 2265


A meat safe? My mother had one of those. I always reckon I've got a cast iron stomach.


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## Ljc (Nov 13, 2016)

Yes a meat safe   Bet that brought back some memories, good ones I hope. Our one didn't look as nice as the one in the pic


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## grovesy (Nov 13, 2016)

No I don't remember them, though was in late teens before we had a fridge!


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## mikeyB (Nov 13, 2016)

And I bet your mum shopped nearly every day at the local butcher and baker.
That's almost what I do now, never plan a meal, just see what's arrived in the chill cabinet in the shop  from Mull Slaughterhouse or Ardmore Fish.


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## zuludog (Nov 13, 2016)

I used to work on the technical side of a large food company
Part of my job was to set expiry dates, and I can tell you that there was a considerable leeway or margin for error

A couple of days extra for bacon is nothing, if they've been kept cool; especially as they are in a vac pack
just take them out of the bin, give them a rinse in plain water, and cook them


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## Amigo (Nov 13, 2016)

mikeyB said:


> And I bet your mum shopped nearly every day at the local butcher and baker.
> That's almost what I do now, never plan a meal, just see what's arrived in the chill cabinet in the shop  from Mull Slaughterhouse or Ardmore Fish.



Maybe it's just childhood nostalgia but food always tasted better without fridges and freezers. People did buy daily and the pantry always seemed cold. Cheese is so much better kept out of a fridge.
However, I did draw the line at a fresh cream cake a lovely and now departed aunt kept me for a week and insisted it was ok


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## Amigo (Nov 13, 2016)

zuludog said:


> I used to work on the technical side of a large food company
> Part of my job was to set expiry dates, and I can tell you that there was a considerable leeway or margin for error
> 
> A couple of days extra for bacon is nothing, if they've been kept cool; especially as they are in a vac pack
> just take them out of the bin, give them a rinse in plain water, and cook them



The 'technical' side of me tells me you're absolutely right Zulu but the over protective side towards my knackered immune system makes me ultra cautious.  
Husband on the other hand has no such qualms...he'd just eat them!


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## zuludog (Nov 13, 2016)

Then give him double ham & eggs for tea!


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## Ljc (Nov 13, 2016)

If I recall correctly as It's a long time ago now,  mum shopped around every three days in the cool weather and every other day in warm weather.
In the winter she also used to make huge pots of stew , kept outside but they were reheated a few times


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## David H (Nov 13, 2016)

Growing up there was never a date stamp and I'm still alive - Mind you I could tell from an early age if milk was more than 3 days old.

I've eaten stuff weeks or months past sell by date (vacuum packed) and not ill.


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## Rosiecarmel (Nov 13, 2016)

I generally see use by dates as a rough guide. For example if I saw milk in my fridge that had a use by date of two weeks ago, I wouldn't even try it. But if I saw milk that had a use by date of one or two days previous, I would smell it first to double check. I know MikeyB has commented about bacteria that doesn't have a smell which worries me but I've been fine so far ha ha!

I tend to be more cautious around pork and chicken though. If I'm ever undecided if I should eat it, I usually don't.

I've been staying with my good friend the past week in Wales. She's Muslim, so only eats halal meat. Where she gets it from, they weigh it and bag it with no use by date and she just uses her common sense to see if its off..


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## grovesy (Nov 13, 2016)

My mum used make broth with a ham shank and it got reheated till it had all gone! It always tasted better when reheated!


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## Ljc (Nov 13, 2016)

grovesy said:


> My mum used make broth with a ham shank and it got reheated till it had all gone! It always tasted better when reheated!


It sure does.


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## Robin (Nov 13, 2016)

grovesy said:


> My mum used make broth with a ham shank and it got reheated till it had all gone! It always tasted better when reheated!


My mother used to make stew with the stock left over from the previous one. We used to tease her that there must be a few molecules in there that were at least twenty years old.


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## mikeyB (Nov 13, 2016)

There are molecules in all of us that were inside supernovae billions of years ago, so twenty year old molecules in stew are almost new in the great scheme of things


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## Northerner (Nov 13, 2016)

mikeyB said:


> There are molecules in all of us that were inside supernovae billions of years ago, so twenty year old molecules in stew are almost new in the great scheme of things


I've got some mince in the freezer that originally grew up on Kepler's Star...


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## Jonsi (Nov 13, 2016)

Apparently we all have some of Julius Caesar's last breath in our lungs. 
Also...we all drink water and we know what fish do in water


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## AlisonM (Nov 13, 2016)

I have some very interesting digestive issues and am absolutely paranoid about food past it's sell by, never mind its use by date. My particular paranoia is for milk, if I even suspect it might be a little off, out it goes. I'd have chucked the stuff too.


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## KateR (Nov 14, 2016)

Gammon steaks are usually cured anyway. I would have eaten them, having cooked them thoroughly. I've always taken most use by dates with a pinch of salt and I'm still here after 69 years!


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## Amigo (Nov 14, 2016)

KateR said:


> Gammon steaks are usually cured anyway. I would have eaten them, having cooked them thoroughly. I've always taken most use by dates with a pinch of salt and I'm still here after 69 years!



I must confess it grieved me to throw them away Kate because I have a pathological hatred of waste but having cancer of the immune system, I can't guarantee my response to anything dodgy so I've had to be ultra careful. Didn't like throwing good money away though!


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