# Was pre diabetic , now normal, need advice



## Morning bird (Mar 2, 2016)

First time I've used this forum and not sure if I'm asking silly questions as I am a bit of a worrier.

Since Christmas I've been back and for the doctors for blood tests and the last 3 have shown up as pre diabetic after fasting ie  4.7. I'm 51, weighed 15 stone 2 lbs before getting serious about dieting, menopausal and an MRI scan recently gave me the results of bulging discs in my lower back. I had been referred for an MRI after severe pain in my left calf. A blood clot was ruled out but for a few months prior to this I had numbness and tingling along the sole and outer side of my left foot and random pains on and off in my left leg.

Whilst I've been overweight for a few decades now and tried and failed with diets, the scare of diabetes and not being able to keep up with my grand children has really motivated me to lose weight. I have combined eating healthily in a 10 hour window with two fast days a week (500 calories) and lost 3lb in a week. I have never ever done that before. 

Due to family visiting last weekend I had some days where my diet was not as healthy. I laid out a high carb meal, not a vegetable in sight and whilst at one level I thought " oh great, a treat" there was part of me that wanted to make a salad! I had small portions but was definitely lower on the fruit and veg. When I went to bed that night I had my itchy calves problem which I hadn't had for a few months. Moisturising my legs helped.The numbness in foot also returned. Sometimes it is there, sometimes not. Maybe it is more related to bulging discs than diabetes?

Before getting really serious with this diet I would crave chocolate and cheese. I used to crave crisps but for over a year hubby and I make sure we don't buy crisps and cake unless visitors are coming.

Monday I rang up for latest blood test and was told it was 49. I asked if I had to see dr, was told no. I asked if I should just keep on losing weight and healthy eating and was told yes. I should have asked for more information but my concentration is really poor at the moment and I was all psyched up to be told I was still pre diabetic or diabetic. Now I've had time to think I don't know what 49 means as opposed to the previous 4.7 results.

I wear a personal tracker and whilst I am not a great sleeper a few months back I was hitting 80-100% of my sleep most nights. At the moment if I get 60% of my sleep I'm doing well. I'm worried about my sleep, it's keeping me awake at night lol!

This week I'm taking myself off the fast days and eating what I want during the 10 hours- on the whole it's healthy. I'm doing back exercises, aiming for 8000 steps a day and having a day time nap.

Should I see about getting a free blood glucose test at pharmacy sometime, and if so, after fasting overnight, after a meal, when?

Should I be concerned about the numbness in foot? It is on the side of bulging discs, other hands and foot are fine. 

I also wake 2-3 times a night to go to the loo.

Am I getting over anxious about nothing, something I fall into very easily at the moment.

Thanks in advance for any advice


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## Northerner (Mar 2, 2016)

Hi Morning bird, welcome to the forum  Well done on your efforts to lose weight, that will certainly help with your situation, and any regular exercise you can do will really help as well - not just to lose weight, but exercise actually helps you use the insulin you are producing much more efficiently and therefore helps to keep your blood sugar levels under control 

It sound to me like you are being given two different blood test results, which measure different things. Firstly, the 'fasting' levels of 4.7 are likely to be a 'snapshot' of your levels before eating in the morning. If this is the case, then 4.7 is excellent, and nothing to worry about - 7.0 or over is the level at which diabetes will be diagnosed. The '49' is most likely what is known as an HbA1c test - this measures (approximately) the average level of your blood sugars over the 6-12 weeks prior to the test. For this type of test, 49 strays just above the level at which diabetes might be diagnosed (although this result alone isn't enough for a firm diagnosis, other tests would normally be done to confirm). This would suggest that most of the time your levels are OK, but you do experience some elevated levels at various times, most likely after eating something that proves unsuitable.

The test at the pharmacy probably wouldn't tell you much, as it would be another 'snapshot' and would be dependent largely on when and what you ate last. Ideally, you would get a meter yourself so that you could test the effect of food on your levels, then this would help you identify the main 'culprits' that perhaps you should avoid. Have a read of Test,Review, Adjust by Alan S in order to understand the thinking behind this. It's worth investing in your own meter and strips so you can understand your own personal tolerances for different types of food. The  cheapest option we have come across is the SD Codefree Meter which has test strips at around £8 for 50. 

Hard to say whether the numbness is related to your blood sugar levels, given the other problems you have, but it seems unlikely at your levels, or if it is, then continued improvements in your control should solve the problem 

If you do this, and continue with your weight-loss efforts and get some regular daily exercise I am sure you will be able to move further away from the possibility of a diabetes diagnosis  Let us know if you have any questions and we will be happy to help!


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## Morning bird (Mar 2, 2016)

Thank you so much for your prompt reply. I tend to panic and think of worst case scenario. The confusing test result of 49 rather than 4.7 is making me worried about the competency of my treatment, especially as my first blood test should have been for thyroid function, b12 and diabetes and they failed to test for diabetes. Thyroid and b12 are fine.

I need to not get obsessive about all of this, but maybe getting my own meter could be empowering  and ease my anxiety ?

I think I will definitely read round the forum to educate myself better. If nothing else it will keep me out of the fridge . . .


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## Robin (Mar 2, 2016)

Morning bird said:


> Thank you so much for your prompt reply. I tend to panic and think of worst case scenario. The confusing test result of 49 rather than 4.7 is making me worried about the competency of my treatment, especially as my first blood test should have been for thyroid function, b12 and diabetes and they failed to test for diabetes. Thyroid and b12 are fine.
> 
> I need to not get obsessive about all of this, but maybe getting my own meter could be empowering  and ease my anxiety ?
> 
> I think I will definitely read round the forum to educate myself better. If nothing else it will keep me out of the fridge . . .


Hi Morningbird. I'm not surprised you're confused by the test results, if your GP didn't explain the difference. Both tests have their place in diagnosis. The fasting glucose test, the 4.7, gives a snapshot of what your morning waking levels are. Quite often, (but not always) in Type 2, these are the most elevated ones of the day, as your liver pumps out glucose ready for the day ahead. The HbA1c, the 49, shows what your average glucose has been over the past few weeks, and if this is raised, it suggests that sometimes during the day, probably after eating a carby meal, your body isn't coping very well with using or storing the glucose produced. This is where having your own meter comes in. Unfortunately many health care practitioners are reluctant to recommend testing, as they think it will make people more anxious. I'd say, this depends on the person! If, like me, you worry more about the unknown, then having the means to test, and then doing something about the result if it's high,( like adjusting your diet and seeing what happens) is likely to reduce anxiety, not increase it.


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## Amigo (Mar 2, 2016)

Hi morning bird, reading your story, it could so easily have been my own. I have bulging discs and degenerative spinal problems but it's taken losing weight and getting my blood glucose in line to ease the symptoms. You will find it makes a difference. I noticed a massive improvement so please keep in with the great efforts! I also had numbness and yes it can be related to spinal nerve impingement but diabetes does aggravate the extent (and my levels weren't that much worse than yours at diagnosis - 52). Trouble is we don't know how long we've been storing up problems.

And yes by all means self test...49 is a good Hba1c but as northerner says, 48 is usually the point at which diabetes is diagnosed. Finger prick tests are calculated differently so they don't compare like for like which is confusing. 

No need to be anxious. You're doing all the right things and all will be well!


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## Morning bird (Mar 2, 2016)

I could hug you guys !


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## AndBreathe (Mar 2, 2016)

Morning bird said:


> First time I've used this forum and not sure if I'm asking silly questions as I am a bit of a worrier.
> 
> Since Christmas I've been back and for the doctors for blood tests and the last 3 have shown up as pre diabetic after fasting ie  4.7. I'm 51, weighed 15 stone 2 lbs before getting serious about dieting, menopausal and an MRI scan recently gave me the results of bulging discs in my lower back. I had been referred for an MRI after severe pain in my left calf. A blood clot was ruled out but for a few months prior to this I had numbness and tingling along the sole and outer side of my left foot and random pains on and off in my left leg.
> 
> ...



Morning bird, without wanting to rain on your BBQ, I think you need to stick with your recent regime, of low carbing, for some time yet before you can confidently feel you have turned your back on a potential for a diabetes diagnosis any time soon.

Of course, it's completely unhelpful that your two tests were testing different things, but if I were in your shoes, with a couple of years of learning under my belt, I would be inclined to treat the score of 49 as a bit of a wake-up, warning shot across the bows.  As others have said it is teetering on the diabetes diagnostic threshold, so ideally you'd like that to come down, moving forward.

I am pleased you have already found a way to trim back your weight as that can be very important for long term management of diabetes and prediabetes, but it will also help with your back issues, whatever the cause.

In your shoes, I would be inclined to buy myself a blood testing meter, so that I can see what impact the various food and drinks I consume have on me.  Those of us who do that sometimes have surprises - of both the pleasant and unpleasant nature, but at least we know.  We're not shooting in the dark.  By beginning testing, it doesn't mean you will be testing forever.  You could look upon it as part of a self-education course.  I doubt you could make a better investment in staving off the big D.

When/If you begin testing, your meter will record your results for a time.  Most have quite a decent memory of about 500 tests I think, but alongside that data, a food diary really helps, so that you can look back and see what you've eaten on a given occasion, and not be completely reliant on memory.

There are some great low carb dishes and recipes out there, some of which are more delicious without the carbs in them.  For example, today's Tesco Twitter feed has a link to their website with 10 delicious looking courgette recipes.  I don't know if you have dabbled with courgettes yet, but they're extremely low carb and pick up flavours when cooked, so they are extremely versatile.  The link is here:
https://realfood.tesco.com/galleryview/10-tasty-courgette-recipes.html

Good luck with it all.  It's a steep learning curve, but worth undertaking.


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## Morning bird (Mar 2, 2016)

Thanks AndBreathe. I am definitely seeing this as a wake up call and do see the lifestyle changes I'm making as being for the rest of my life, not just till I lose weight .

Considering the helpful comments here I'm a bit surprised that the doctor hasn't suggested that I go in for a follow up appointment in the future. I got my results over the phone, I assume from the receptionist.

I make my own whole meal bread, eat brown rice and pasta, lots of veg. starting to use more cinnamon and turmeric and am very keen to learn more. 

I will get myself a meter, but some of the negative reviews on Amazon are now worrying me that I will end up buying one that isn't very accurate.


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## Robin (Mar 2, 2016)

.

I will get myself a meter, but some of the negative reviews on Amazon are now worrying me that I will end up buying one that isn't very accurate.[/QUOTE]
All meter's have to conform to the same standards of accuracy. BUT, having said that, simplified, the standard is that they need to be within around 10%. This means that if you were to test the same drop of blood on two different meters, you might get one measuring 10% over, and the other 10% under. Quite a big discrepancy. The best thing is to get a meter, and stick to it, and not worry too much, I don't think there are really any brands that are more accurate than others.


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## AndBreathe (Mar 2, 2016)

Morning bird said:


> Thanks AndBreathe. I am definitely seeing this as a wake up call and do see the lifestyle changes I'm making as being for the rest of my life, not just till I lose weight .
> 
> Considering the helpful comments here I'm a bit surprised that the doctor hasn't suggested that I go in for a follow up appointment in the future. I got my results over the phone, I assume from the receptionist.
> 
> ...



To be honest, as an un-medicated person (i.e. not taking heavy diabetes medication or insulin), we need to be looking at averages and trends, rather than absolute numbers.  We all get the odd reading that makes us just go, "Eh?!??", but in the scheme of things that's OK.

Lots of us use the SD Codefree meter from Homehealth, as it conforms to the usual legal standards and is, in my experience, the cheapest to run.  Forget about looking at the costs if the meter; that's a one-off costs and concentrate on the cost of the strips, which are consumables and therefore need replenishment from time to time.  50 strips in a pot can sound like oodles, but in the early days you may be surprised by how often you end up testing.

I'd usually post links, but my internet here today is incredibly brittle, so hopefully someone will post links.  If you buy direct from the UK distributer ( as opposed to via eBay or Amazon), you can have a discount on "bulk" purchases of strips for 5 or 10 pots.  

@AlisonM  - do you have the Homehealth links handy at all?


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## AlisonM (Mar 2, 2016)

@Morning bird, @AndBreathe, Here's the link to Homehealth. And a bulk buy code that will get you money off the price when you buy 5 or 10 pots:

5 pots - 264086
10 pots - 975833


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## AndBreathe (Mar 3, 2016)

AlisonM said:


> @Morning bird, @AndBreathe, Here's the link to Homehealth. And a bulk buy code that will get you money off the price when you buy 5 or 10 pots:
> 
> 5 pots - 264086
> 10 pots - 975833



Thanks Alison.  The internet here has been particularly challenging (read slllllooooooooowwwwwwwwwww).


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## trophywench (Mar 3, 2016)

Hiya - I'd just like to add that disc probs can definitely lead to calf probs cos if it's the sciatic nerve that is impinged, that one  (well there are 2 - one for each leg!) definitely has an effect on the legs.  My first husband landed up having a laminectomy as his left leg was actually dying due to the trapped nerve.  Most of the pain however started off in his left thigh and bum cheek - so we both thought he must have pulled a hamstring, for a couple of months. 

Do whatever you possibly can to ease it - but do yourself a favour and measure your calves and thighs.  If you start to lose MUSCLE - you need an operation PDQ (a laminectomy despite the dangers thereof) because your leg is literally dying.


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## Morning bird (Mar 10, 2016)

Here's an update with a question. I tested my blood glucose this morning for the first time and got a 6.1 reading. That was at 7.30am and I had finished eating at 8pm last night. Yesterday I had a bowl of muesli and Greek yoghurt and cinnamon for breakfast, scampi and chips for lunch, slice of whole meal bread and peanut butter as a snack. Then at 7.30pm I had a sweet potato and cauliflower curry ( low fat feast) with a naan bread.

Overnight I probably drank a glass of water, so this test was not like the fasting test I did for the doctor. I'm still losing weight. My plan at the moment is to test before breakfast in the mornings. Should I make that the same time lapse since food the night before?

So my question is is 6.1 ok? Do  I really need to test at other times too? I don't want to get paranoid but I don't want to be lax either. 

Also how do I dispose of the lancets without a sharps bin ?I'm not diagnosed as diabetic .

Thanks in advance for your advice.


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## Northerner (Mar 10, 2016)

Hi Morning bird  A 6.1 is very good. You should test as soon as you wake, no worries about what and when you ate the night before, that will have all digested, so the reading will be reflective of your 'base' level. It can be useful to test before bed in order to see the differential overnight  Note that your liver will trickle out glucose 24/7 in order to keep you supplied with a source of energy to keep your heart, lungs, brain etc. functioning when you are not providing energy from food. The rate at which this happens will vary, according to the 'Circadian Rhythm' - your body's internal clock - and it can give you an extra 'boost' in the mornings, so it's possible that your levels can rise after waking even if you don't eat. This is called 'Dawn Phenomenon' 

You could dispose of your lancets in an old bleach bottle, with a childproof lid - tape the lid up before disposing of in the normal waste (I know this is what some members do).


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## Morning bird (Mar 10, 2016)

Thanks Northener. Just did my test at 10pm and it was 6.6. I had eaten a bowl of cereal about an hour before.


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## Morning bird (Mar 11, 2016)

This morning as soon as I woke up and before breakfast it was 6.2


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## Northerner (Mar 11, 2016)

Morning bird said:


> This morning as soon as I woke up and before breakfast it was 6.2


That's pretty steady overnight and consistent with your previous morning reading


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## Morning bird (Mar 11, 2016)

I'm going to eat breakfast then test in two hours. It was like getting blood out of a stone this morning !Wasted a few tests. Got hubby to test himself. It was before breakfast and after a 5 km run and he was 2.5 . He claims he can't be diabetic because he's slim. I'm not convinced, but hopefully he's not. Ordered more strips and lancets and beginning to think I might get a handle on this. 

Very pleased to have found this place for education and support. 

Thanks Northener for you quick replies.


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## Northerner (Mar 11, 2016)

Morning bird said:


> I'm going to eat breakfast then test in two hours. It was like getting blood out of a stone this morning !Wasted a few tests. Got hubby to test himself. It was before breakfast and after a 5 km run and he was 2.5 . He claims he can't be diabetic because he's slim. I'm not convinced, but hopefully he's not. Ordered more strips and lancets and beginning to think I might get a handle on this.
> 
> Very pleased to have found this place for education and support.
> 
> Thanks Northener for you quick replies.


Warming your fingers up under the hot (not too hot!) tap can help when getting blood, also give it a couple of seconds after pricking before giving it a little squeeze to get the blood - the finger initially reacts by trying to close the wound, but then relaxes making the blood drop easier to get 

Hubby was 2.5?  That's pretty low. Did he eat anything before his run? Non-diabetics are very rarely at risk of dangerous hypos and it's only normally in extreme circumstances - if he felt OK then it's not a problem and it may be that the meter was giving a lower reading than true (they can vary a bit in accuracy). As a general rule, someone without any problems will normally show between 3.3-6.0 mmol/l, and possibly a bit lower after exercise.

Slim people can be diabetic - anyone can! In Type 1 unexpected weight loss is usually a symptom of the failure of the pancreas - I had a BMI of around 17 when diagnosed  Prior to that I had a BMI of around 22, so always been slim. For Type 2, again you don't have to be overweight - 20% of Type 2s are not overweight at diagnosis. The problem in Type 2 is that you can have 'hidden fat' around your internal organs which can cause insulin resistance, so you might look slim but still be carrying unwanted fat (known as 'visceral fat').


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## Morning bird (Mar 11, 2016)

He hadn't had breakfast before his run, just a mug of tea. Last night he ate 2 slices of cheese on toast  and salad at about 9pm


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## Morning bird (Mar 11, 2016)

Years back they said his blood pressure was on the low side


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## Northerner (Mar 11, 2016)

Morning bird said:


> He hadn't had breakfast before his run, just a mug of tea. Last night he ate 2 slices of cheese on toast  and salad at about 9pm


Sounds like I used to be - up, mug of tea, then out for a run!  Now, after my diagnosis, I need to have a slice of toast and some insulin about an hour or so before the run, so can't be quite as spontaneous, plus sometimes if the weather is rotten it gives me far too long to think about whether I _really _want to go for a run!


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## Morning bird (Mar 11, 2016)

He staggers out in a state of coma, looks like he is about to die when he gets back ! I don't know what he's running from . . .


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## Morning bird (Mar 11, 2016)

5.3  two hours after cereal


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## Northerner (Mar 11, 2016)

Morning bird said:


> 5.3  two hours after cereal


Pretty much spot on, I'd say! Your body is handling things very well


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## Morning bird (Mar 11, 2016)

Brilliant! Will keep on with the diet and exercise and maybe just test from time to time ? What do you think ?


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## Northerner (Mar 11, 2016)

Morning bird said:


> Brilliant! Will keep on with the diet and exercise and maybe just test from time to time ? What do you think ?


That sounds like an excellent plan


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## Janice Beal (Mar 29, 2016)

Hi Morning Bird. 
Well whoever gave you the blood test result of 49 didn't realise we have to deal in % or mmol the American readings. As shown here. This is for the hba1c blood test that shows how you've lived/eaten in the last 12 weeks. 
*(%)* *(mmol/mol)*
6.0      42
6.5      48
7.0      53
7.5      58
8.0      64
9.0      75
Our older version was % but hospitals and medics give it out as the larger numbers now. I'm a Type 1 and have been for 45 years on insulin, had two small babies and my family are all the same. Except my sons. My husband was tested recently as he's had his MOT ages 40 - 70. He read 42 for the blood test, which the nurse told him was high. I said when he had to have a re-test and drink a bottle of Lucozade and sit for 2 hours, to go in and show the nurse this list of numbers. Having had another test and going back he's been told he isn't Type 2, but it was a warning and he will be going back in 6 months. He found he'd lost 7lbs since the nurse first saw him in January. He works on a ship and is concentrating on eating a lot healthier, not drinking and exercising more. Your Doctors place are telling you that you need to watch what you are eating. I work in a greengrocers so we have always eaten lots of fruit and veg. Keep on with your diet and don't worry about doing finger blood test. Unless you feel you really want to know any results.


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