# Who cares ??



## Bill Stewardson (Jul 11, 2017)

All this rubbish on telly regarding Trump visiting or not, does anyone really care ??

It would cost a fortune to accommodate his ninety million strong security detail, you know, the ones who wear shiny suits and glare menacingly at each other, every professional protestor in the country would kick off , the Maybot would be proclaiming it a massive victory and would likely want to hold his hand again (awww).

They should make him queue up at the London eye or fork out a fiver for a warm pint.

After all,, haven't we got enough deranged idiots in important positions in London ?


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## Copepod (Jul 11, 2017)

Being entirely flippant, as long as they don't bring him to the best parts of UK, such as Yorkshire, where I live, or Stirlingshire, where I worked last week, I don't care!


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## zuludog (Jul 11, 2017)

The BBC in particular seem to have an obsession with Trump, I have never known this sort of interest with any other president. And when I say interest, I mean they seem determined to pick up any fault or problem

A straw poll among friends & acquaintances goes along with the title; most people in Britain are not bothered. In fact, in the current climate of trouble throughout the world, and Brexit, we should be trying to befriend USA not alienate them


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## mikeyB (Jul 11, 2017)

I tend to agree with that, zuludog. Trump has a few daft and dangerous ideas, but in the great phrase of President Johnson, it's better to have him inside the tent pissing out, than outside the tent pissing in.


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## Bill Stewardson (Jul 11, 2017)

That's my point, nobody really cares at all.


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## Amigo (Jul 11, 2017)

I'd rather he was as far away from the tent as possible Mike but I know what you mean! 

Poland enthusiastically organised a huge 'Poland for Trump' campaign ahead of his visit. His overly indulged ego needed additional security detail to cover it there. Frankly I'd like our people to make it known that there's no such welcome on the mat here. We have standards and decency which doesn't extend to tolerance of misogyny, xenophobia, discriminatory attitudes towards minorities, the disabled, poor and those not blessed with physical attraction. 

So for the Trump, 'I've never read a book me' doesn't deserve the fortune that will be required to keep him safe and pay for his ridiculous entourage. 

The money needs to be put to better use unless he agrees to come in on EasyJet and stay at the Travelodge with only his hairdressing team in tow!


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## Bill Stewardson (Jul 11, 2017)

Amigo said:


> I'd rather he was as far away from the tent as possible Mike but I know what you mean!
> 
> Poland enthusiastically organised a huge 'Poland for Trump' campaign ahead of his visit. His overly indulged ego needed additional security detail to cover it there. Frankly I'd like our people to make it known that there's no such welcome on the mat here. We have standards and decency which doesn't extend to tolerance of misogyny, xenophobia, discriminatory attitudes towards minorities, the disabled, poor and those not blessed with physical attraction.
> 
> ...



That's not very fair on Travelodge !


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## Bubbsie (Jul 11, 2017)

Bill Stewardson said:


> All this rubbish on telly regarding Trump visiting or not, does anyone really care ??
> 
> It would cost a fortune to accommodate his ninety million strong security detail, you know, the ones who wear shiny suits and glare menacingly at each other, every professional protestor in the country would kick off , the Maybot would be proclaiming it a massive victory and would likely want to hold his hand again (awww).
> 
> ...


I care Bill...not just about Trump...I care about all the leaders of regimes that are oppressive...deny human rights...are racist...invited here on  state visits...lauded...celebrated...honoured by this country which prides itself on being a great democracy... of course...that is when it suits us...already trump has (in my opinion) declared his racist/islamphobic tendencies...his ban on entry to the USA from 'certain'  muslin destinations one example...the proposed wall to ring fence the Mexicans...denying health care to the poor & socially disadvantaged...I care Bill...very much... those professional protestors you refer to...would they be ordinary members of the public that turn out to protest on behalf of others who have no real effective voice themselves...no freedom to express their views...the professionals you refer to (I assume you mean those solely out to cause public disorder) make up a tiny majority of those that do care....who protest legitimately & rightly so.


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## Amigo (Jul 11, 2017)

Bill Stewardson said:


> That's not very fair on Travelodge !



They have special annexe rooms near the bins for 'undesirables!'


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## Bubbsie (Jul 11, 2017)

Amigo said:


> They have special annexe rooms near the bins for 'undesirables!'


Surely they'd be better off locating those bins in the arrivals lounge at Heathrow Amigo...the special one for megalomaniacs...reserved for those far too full of their own self importance...save the expenditure for travel to the nearest Travelodge...which I understand is located in Southall...ooh...just a thought...perhaps we should delay his dispatch...sure Mr Trump would love to spend a few days in Southall.


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## Bill Stewardson (Jul 11, 2017)

Bubbsie said:


> I care Bill...not just about Trump...I care about all the leaders of regimes that are oppressive...deny human rights...are racist...invited here on  state visits...lauded...celebrated...honoured by this country which prides itself on being a great democracy... of course...that is when it suits us...already trump has (in my opinion) declared his racist/islamphobic tendencies...his ban on entry to the USA from 'certain'  muslin destinations one example...the proposed wall to ring fence the Mexicans...denying health care to the poor & socially disadvantaged...I care Bill...very much... those professional protestors you refer to...would they be ordinary members of the public that turn out to protest on behalf of others who have no real effective voice themselves...no freedom to express their views...the professionals you refer to (I assume you mean those solely out to cause public disorder) make up a tiny majority of those that do care....who protest legitimately & rightly so.



I said " does anyone really care" most  don't care, some see amusement in it, others see it as inviting the devil into our house. Each can make their own minds up about that.

I see the whole concept of the Govt rolling out the red carpet rather demeaning to all that the UK once stood for.
Its not as if it's about "fostering the special relationship" or forging stronger ties with an old friend. 
It's really about grovelling for the crumbs off the table of the USA.

Every professional protestor in the land will head to London and proceed to turn it upside down, in the name of freedom, democracy, the real voice of the people etc, all a complete waste of time money and effort which actually will be used to deflect attention away from the real problem which is Mr Trump.

I don't think it will happen anyway. Poland bussed people in to chant nice things, not sure your average Brit would go along with that, maybe they could recruit a few coach loads of Milwall fans ??


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## Bubbsie (Jul 11, 2017)

Bill Stewardson said:


> I said " does anyone really care" most  don't care, some see amusement in it, others see it as inviting the devil into our house. Each can make their own minds up about that.
> 
> I see the whole concept of the Govt rolling out the red carpet rather demeaning to all that the UK once stood for.
> Its not as if it's about "fostering the special relationship" or forging stronger ties with an old friend.
> ...


I think you do the 'average Brit' a great injustice Bill...I am an average Brit...I really care...I would take to the streets to protest about something I feel strongly about...the real problem as I see it Bill...is...being expected to tolerate others intolerance...we are a 'presumed' democracy...that includes the right to protest...whether you or others agree with the views expressed...or do we adopt the 'utilitarian' approach...ignore the minorities...never been a particular fan/devotee of John Stuart Mill...just some thoughts for you to consider.


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## mikeyB (Jul 11, 2017)

Bill Stewardson said:


> I said " does anyone really care" most  don't care, some see amusement in it, others see it as inviting the devil into our house. Each can make their own minds up about that.
> 
> I see the whole concept of the Govt rolling out the red carpet rather demeaning to all that the UK once stood for.
> Its not as if it's about "fostering the special relationship" or forging stronger ties with an old friend.
> ...



Though was Churchill demeaning the UK with his efforts in 1940/41 pleading with the isolationist US to join us in defeating the bad guys?


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## Bill Stewardson (Jul 11, 2017)

Bubbsie said:


> I think you do the 'average Brit' a great injustice Bill...I am an average Brit...I really care...I would take to the streets to protest about something I feel strongly about...the real problem as I see it Bill...is...being expected to tolerate others intolerance...we are a 'presumed' democracy...that includes the right to protest...whether you or others agree with the views expressed...or do we adopt the 'utilitarian' approach...ignore the minorities...never been a particular fan/devotee of John Stuart Mill...just some thoughts for you to consider.



 Threads drifting into the right to protest.

I live on an ordinary Yorkshire housing estate and chat with most people, they really are not bothered one way or the other.

Suppose that would be different on a London housing estate, if they haven't all been socially cleansed.

One of the main problems re Trump is his wall idea, seems that barring him from the UK is erecting our own wall.


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## Bill Stewardson (Jul 11, 2017)

mikeyB said:


> Though was Churchill demeaning the UK with his efforts in 1940/41 pleading with the isolationist US to join us in defeating the bad guys?



Maybe your comparing apples with oranges ?


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## Bubbsie (Jul 11, 2017)

Bill Stewardson said:


> Threads drifting into the right to protest.
> 
> I live on an ordinary Yorkshire housing estate and chat with most people, they really are not bothered one way or the other.
> 
> ...


FYI Bill....I come from an ordinary housing estate...an ordinary council housing estate in a very disadvantaged socially deprived area of south London...as for  the thread drifting Bill...if you pose the question...likely it will be answered...no drift here Bill...only differing opinions...the cut & thrust of discussion...relevant & necessary...apples...oranges...what does it matter...it's all fruit.


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## MikeW59 (Jul 11, 2017)

and fruit is good for us!
and threads are supposed to drift!
its how it works.

Why does this always end up focusing on the negatives.
We, the average Brit, either from the frozen North or sophisticated South need as many friends as we can make.
Maybe less time pontificating on things that don't really matter and more on things that do would be a way forward.

The world is constantly changing as is our society and our expectations as a result we have to amend our position and become more inclusive to race and creed and more tolerant to each other.
Previous generations have continuously screwed things up, war, human rights, health, global warming, health care etc.

Hopefully the next generations will do better as long as we don't screw things up further in the meantime.
I'm totally fed up with this 'you cant do that' and 'we've always done it that way' attitude.

Get real and get a life!


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## Bill Stewardson (Jul 11, 2017)

mikeyB said:


> Though was Churchill demeaning the UK with his efforts in 1940/41 pleading with the isolationist US to join us in defeating the bad guys?



Maybe he was, completely different set of rather pressing circumstances, 

Maybe the general public thought differently then, either way the people around here really aren't too bothered by the imminent/ or not visit of the President.


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## Bill Stewardson (Jul 11, 2017)

MikeW59 said:


> and fruit is good for us!
> and threads are supposed to drift!
> its how it works.
> 
> ...



Not sure I fully understand your message.

Is the general public not being too bothered a negative ?? Is it something that really doesn't matter ? 

Perhaps if Mr Trump was coming to Sheffield the opinion may be different, I don't know, as it is London will be at the brunt of it all again. So maybe the general feeling there is different.


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## Bubbsie (Jul 11, 2017)

Bill Stewardson said:


> Maybe he was, completely different set of rather pressing circumstances,
> 
> Maybe the general public thought differently then, either way the people around here really aren't too bothered by the imminent/ or not visit of the President.





Bill Stewardson said:


> Not sure I fully understand your message.
> 
> Is the general public not being too bothered a negative ?? Is it something that really doesn't matter ?
> 
> Perhaps if Mr Trump was coming to Sheffield the opinion may be different, I don't know, as it is London will be at the brunt of it all again. So maybe the general feeling there is different.


I can't say if there are regional differences Bill...that's a possibility...who knows?...London is used to the pressure...has had to get used to it...it & Londoners will cope.


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## Amigo (Jul 11, 2017)

MikeW59 said:


> and fruit is good for us!
> and threads are supposed to drift!
> its how it works.
> 
> ...



Not totally getting who or what your message is directed at Mike. The rant is too generalised for me. However, admittedly I'm not from the 'sophisticated South' and I'm used to drift seeing as we get lots of snow in the 'frozen north' (allegedly!) 

I just wish Trump's own people would see how utterly ridiculous he is and potentially dangerous. As a country the Government have a duty to accommodate visiting dignitaries no matter how loathsome we find them. And the people have the right to protest. His actions have the potential to destroy us.
Most people will grumble from their chairs and I'm one of them but it doesn't mean there isn't a groundswell of strong opinion and opposition to the visit. Take a look at the online petition. But, democracy prevails and the Americans were taken in by him which means we have to feed, protect and accommodate him and the downtrodden missus. I suspect the favourite daughter will be close to his side too!


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## Bill Stewardson (Jul 11, 2017)

Bubbsie said:


> I can't say if there are regional differences Bill...that's a possibility...who knows?...London is used to the pressure...has had to get used to it...it & Londoners will cope.



Yes, that's my point.

I don't mean political differences, just the actual nature of being geographically closer to it all.

The population of The Steel City would very quickly get fed up with all the upheaval that goes with such things. Plus the cost ofcourse.

I would have thought the MET had enough to do at the moment.

Either way, it's a sign of the (deteriorating) times when world leaders can't visit various locations due to security concerns.

Does puzzle me sometimes when you look at what does or doesn't concern the public,  round here at the moment it's all about NHS pay and Uni fees, but then again those places are far and away the largest employers, people talk about that all the time.

I live in Orgreave, a place that saw some of the worst public disorder on record, those old differences still run deep. To people round here Mr Trump is way down the list of things to be bothered about.

Having said that the students aren't here at the moment, maybe their opinion would be entirely different.


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## Bubbsie (Jul 11, 2017)

Amigo said:


> Not totally getting who or what your message is directed at Mike. The rant is too generalised for me. However, admittedly I'm not from the 'sophisticated South' and I'm used to drift seeing as we get lots of snow in the 'frozen north' (allegedly!)
> 
> I just wish Trump's own people would see how utterly ridiculous he is and potentially dangerous. As a country the Government have a duty to accommodate visiting dignitaries no matter how loathsome we find them. And the people have the right to protest. His actions have the potential to destroy us.
> Most people will grumble from their chairs and I'm one of them but it doesn't mean there isn't a groundswell of strong opinion and opposition to the visit. Take a look at the online petition. But, democracy prevails and the Americans were taken in by him which means we have to feed, protect and accommodate him and the downtrodden missus. I suspect the favourite daughter will be close to his side too!


Don't agree with your point of view Amigo...no duty involved...it's by invitation...that can be withdrawn at any time...should it be...I'm undecided on that...as for the favoured daughter (is that a euphemism)...TM...or the Iron Maiden Ivanka...if TM...who would think we'll get any trade benefit...or reciprocal advantage from Mr Trump...she's not as smart as I thought she was...oh wait...she's isn't...called a snap election...thought it would be a landslide...then propped up her tenuous  position with a 1.5 billion investment...or was it a bung...as for the sophisticated south...the only sophisticated thing in our neighbourhood...was 'The Hole In The Wall' chip shop...just off the Old Kent Road...George the proprietor used to serve three different brands of brown sauce/chutney (or as we called it Rocking Horse)...with his consumables...a possible venue for lunch...TM...trump & the Iron Maiden


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## Bill Stewardson (Jul 11, 2017)

Bubbsie said:


> Don't agree with your point of view Amigo...no duty involved...it's by invitation...that can be withdrawn at any time...should it be...I'm undecided on that...as for the favoured daughter...if she thinks we'll get any trade benefit...or reciprocal advantage from Mr Trump...she's not as smart as I thought she was...oh wait...she's isn't...called a snap election...thought it would be a landslide...then propped up her tenuous  position with a 1.5 billion investment...or was it a bung...as for the sophisticated south...the only sophisticated thing in our neighbourhood...was 'The Hole In The Wall' chip shop...just off the Old Kent Road...George the proprietor used to serve three different brands of brown sauce/chutney (or as we called it Rocking Horse)...with his consumables.



That raises an interesting point.

What would the reaction be if the USA told our Govt they are not welcome ?


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## Amigo (Jul 11, 2017)

Bubbsie said:


> Don't agree with your point of view Amigo...no duty involved...it's by invitation...that can be withdrawn at any time...should it be...I'm undecided on that...as for the favoured daughter (is that a euphemism)...TM...or the Iron Maiden Ivanka...if TM...who would think we'll get any trade benefit...or reciprocal advantage from Mr Trump...she's not as smart as I thought she was...oh wait...she's isn't...called a snap election...thought it would be a landslide...then propped up her tenuous  position with a 1.5 billion investment...or was it a bung...as for the sophisticated south...the only sophisticated thing in our neighbourhood...was 'The Hole In The Wall' chip shop...just off the Old Kent Road...George the proprietor used to serve three different brands of brown sauce/chutney (or as we called it Rocking Horse)...with his consumables...a possible venue for lunch...TM...trump & the Iron Maiden



There's a duty now seeing Theresa May has already invited him! 'Special relationship' and all that. Duty of reciprocal courtesy perhaps?


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## Bubbsie (Jul 11, 2017)

Bill Stewardson said:


> That raises an interesting point.
> 
> What would the reaction be if the USA told our Govt they are not welcome ?


Be a feather in our cap Bill...and a welcome excuse not to engage with them...ps...edited my post...had left out a huge chunk...thanks to my propensity to hit the wrong button...your thoughts on a possible venue for the State dinner...The Hole In The Wall chip shop...as mentioned...a massive saving on cost...and a truly novel cultural experience!


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## Bubbsie (Jul 11, 2017)

Amigo said:


> There's a duty now seeing Theresa May has already invited him! 'Special relationship' and all that. Duty of reciprocal courtesy perhaps?



Hmmn...hadn't thought of reciprocal courtesy Amigo...was TM invited over...or simply just turn up...either way...he didn't look exactly pleased to see her...about the only time I have applauded his judgement.


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## C3P0 (Jul 11, 2017)

Those that say the Trump visit shouldn't happen due to his intolerance of others, are themselves being intolerant. It would be better to welcome the visit and ask those attending to fly Mexican flags while wearing climate T-Shirts.


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## mikeyB (Jul 11, 2017)

They're not being intolerant, they are showing reasonable judgement and taste. It would be better if we could get a crowd with every skin colour and every religion just point fingers.

Anyway, C3P0, the message ringtone on my phone is an R2D2 chirp. Welcome to the madhouse


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## Bubbsie (Jul 11, 2017)

C3P0 said:


> Those that say the Trump visit shouldn't happen due to his intolerance of others, are themselves being intolerant. It would be better to welcome the visit and ask those attending to fly Mexican flags while wearing climate T-Shirts.



We may not have to consider any of those options soon C3PO...the way things are looking for the Trump Camp after  the latest astounding revelations.


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## Bill Stewardson (Jul 11, 2017)

C3P0 said:


> Those that say the Trump visit shouldn't happen due to his intolerance of others, are themselves being intolerant. It would be better to welcome the visit and ask those attending to fly Mexican flags while wearing climate T-Shirts.



I'll deffo have a T-shirt.


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## Bill Stewardson (Jul 11, 2017)

Bubbsie said:


> Be a feather in our cap Bill...and a welcome excuse not to engage with them...ps...edited my post...had left out a huge chunk...thanks to my propensity to hit the wrong button...your thoughts on a possible venue for the State dinner...The Hole In The Wall chip shop...as mentioned...a massive saving on cost...and a truly novel cultural experience!



Venue for the dinner,,,,,, The Dark Side of The Moon.


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## Bubbsie (Jul 11, 2017)

Bill Stewardson said:


> Venue for the dinner,,,,,, The Dark Side of The Moon.


Possibly Bill...but if we have more revelations of that kind...could be dinner courtesy of the Grand Jury...or the Kremlin...how could they be so stupid...to think that kind of nonsense would remain private?


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## Bill Stewardson (Jul 11, 2017)

mikeyB said:


> They're not being intolerant, they are showing reasonable judgement and taste. It would be better if we could get a crowd with every skin colour and every religion just point fingers.
> 
> Anyway, C3P0, the message ringtone on my phone is an R2D2 chirp. Welcome to the madhouse



Careful,,,,, Madhouse could attract derision.

All I said was " that piece of Halibut was fit for Jehovah".


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## Bill Stewardson (Jul 11, 2017)

Bubbsie said:


> Possibly Bill...but if we have more revelations of that kind...could be dinner courtesy of the Grand Jury...or the Kremlin...how could they be so stupid...to think that kind of nonsense would remain private?



There is no dark side of the moon really,
As a matter of fact it's all ????


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## Abi (Jul 11, 2017)

we have standards and decency which doesn't extend to tolerance of misogyny, xenophobia, discriminatory attitudes towards minorities, the disabled, poor and those not blessed with physical attraction...

Agree, but fear these are becoming eroded

I cannot stand Trump ( or American Republicans in general) but was looking forward to him being snubbed by the Queen or Prince Philip


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## Amigo (Jul 11, 2017)

I understand Theresa is asking the DUP to entertain him. They have similar views and they need to earn the dosh she's bunged them!


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## Steff (Jul 11, 2017)

Bill Stewardson said:


> Careful,,,,, Madhouse could attract derision.


Certainly could but more then likely will!!


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## Lucy Honeychurch (Jul 11, 2017)

My twin daughters are autistic (8) and even they abhor Trump! They found his demonising of all Mexicans offensive, after watching on the news how many students and workers needed that passage to carry on working and studying.


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## Mal (Jul 11, 2017)

I don't think we need to worry about Trump coming here on a state visit , there is 
only so many times Trump and co can tell the Americans they didn't know there were breaking the law ,
not that the law matters , its the cover up that will get him!


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## Martin Canty (Jul 11, 2017)

The trouble is that many people over here are just enamored with Trump for some reason, they believe whatever he says, they claim that he is "Making America Great" let's just gloss over the fact that he hasn't accomplished any of his campaign promises. Tell a Republican that & they will come back with "He's making America great again"; where? how? what?
I think that the UK state visit may happen but Trump wants adoring crowds to greet him so is likely to put it off until there is that guarantee.... Of course there is a hope that he will be impeached before then & found guilty of whatever offences are brought up on the charges yet there is a dark cloud over that one as Pence is next in line & he's a hard-line Conservative "Christian"


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## mikeyB (Jul 11, 2017)

Thanks for cheering us all up, Martin. Can't they just have another election, now they know Russia has been poking around in the previous election campaign?


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## Martin Canty (Jul 11, 2017)

I wish we could...... Not sure how the Constitution handles that one My most sincere hope is that the country comes to it's senses in the mid-terms in 2018.


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