# juicing to help type 2?



## glezga (Jan 3, 2013)

hi all, pretty newly diagnosed with type 2 and had a great idea over xmas to buy a juicer and for a few days here and there replace breakfast or lunch with a healthy juice drink, thing is im new to understanding food and been juicing fruit only! doh! didnt know about fruit being high in sugar, i know i know im a dummy.

so ive been surfing looking at some recipies but we all know the web is full of contradictory advice, one page says carrotss, oranges apples and beets are great for juicing and another says not etc.

ive never been a great veg eater (hence type 2) so i thought id ask here, i have little knowledge in green things lol and adding a lot of money to the weekly shop is out of the question so any advice on cheap veg recipies?

im not looking to replace every meal just a couple of days here and there unless its actually healthy to?

thanks in advance

steve


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## HOBIE (Jan 4, 2013)

Well done steve, You sound like you giving it your best.  I dont eat a lot of fruit because of how sweet it is. I love a bag of fresh pea pods when in season. Carrots are also good like most veg. Have a look on Diabetes uk web for some resipies etc. There are lots about


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## Robster65 (Jan 4, 2013)

Hi Glezga.

I would imagine juicing would release the sugars in veg and send them through your system in a rapid spike, rather than releasing them nice and slowly when they're in larger chunks.

This could send your blood glucose levels high, then potentially low as the insulin spike that follows will have little to work with.

This is all just my guesswork, but I would imagine the best thing is to keep veg as chunky and raw/undercooked as you can stand.

Rob


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## Abi (Jan 4, 2013)

Never personally fancied juiced green veg, athough love them raw/ steamed/ roast/ stirfried whatever

Would the juiced double up as a soup blender to get nice smooth soups out of cooked veg/ lentils etc
Personally other than carrots and one or two other culprits I would not expect most veg to cause much of a spike

It's great that you're making inroads and finding out so much about the condition on your own. No reason to feel silly. If the powers that be spout so much rubbish about what constitutes a healthy diet without taking into account that some of these healthy foods may not be at all healthy for those with blood sugar or weight problems, then thank goodness you are bothering to find out the truth for yourself and more power to you!


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## Dory (Jan 4, 2013)

juicing veg won't change the sugar content drastically - it's the type of veg you juice (as picked up on already, peas, sweetcorn and sweet potatoes are just a few examples of high sugar veg in themselves).  

I would never juice fruit as that's basically the same as chomping on a handful of glucose tablets (hence fruit is used to combat hypos for many people - myself included; I have persimmons and grapes on hand for any lows).  For example, Slimming World (who have an army of dietcians, scientists and other clever bods) class foods according to whether they're free/superfree or 'syns' (wich you can only have a limited amount of each day).  Nearly all raw fruit is superfree, whereas cooked fruit isn't - ie cooking it changes the molecular value of the sugar content as well as breaking down the fibre content.

However, from a general point, juicing fruit and veg is not good anyway as you lose a lot of the vitamins and other heathly properties due to changing the molecular construction of the item in question.

If you're trying to build up more fruit and veg in your diet, I would really stongly go for eating it rather than juicing.  For example, try throwing sliced red peppers, butternut squash, red onion and aubergine into a tray, drizzling some grapeseed oil, then roasting for 45 minutes  - glugging some balsamic vinegar over it for the last 10 minutes.  Gorgeous, simple and one of my staple meals.


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## DeusXM (Jan 4, 2013)

> However, from a general point, juicing fruit and veg is not good anyway as you lose a lot of the vitamins and other heathly properties due to changing the molecular construction of the item in question.





Unless she's using the Large Hadron Collider to juice her items, that simply isn't true. 

You can't annihilate vitamins by blending them!

Although you can substantially change the GI by blending, yes...


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## Dory (Jan 4, 2013)

the vitamins don't disappear but eg when juicing oranges, a lot of the pulp is lost and there are nutrients in the pulp that help vitamin C to work better in the body.

so not losing vitamins as in they vanish, but losing vitamins as in losing the uptake, if that makes sense....


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## bev (Jan 4, 2013)

DeusXM said:


> Unless she's using the Large Hadron Collider to juice her items, that simply isn't true.
> 
> You can't annihilate vitamins by blending them!
> 
> Although you can substantially change the GI by blending, yes...




I have to say I completely agree with you. I use a 'vitamix' which basically means you drink raw fruit and veg - full of enzymes that can sometimes be reduced by cooking! Have a look at a vitamix link - they arent cheap - but worth every penny as I blend lots of green veg and add just a tiny bit of fruit or honey for sweetness so get the 5 a day in one drink - lovely!Bev


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## bev (Jan 4, 2013)

(hence fruit is used to combat hypos for many people - myself included; I have persimmons and grapes on hand for any lows).

Hi Dory,

The problem with using fruit as a hypo treatment is that it is not as quick acting as glucose so you may experience a low for longer than is necessary. We always use a mini can of coke as its much quicker than anything else.Bev


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## Dory (Jan 4, 2013)

i'm on slimming world so coke is out (as is glucose tablets - unless absolutely necessary).  sweet fruit does the trick for me and is syn free.


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## Mark T (Jan 4, 2013)

Welcome to the forum steve 

To be honest, what you eat has to work for you.  There is no point hitting a diet that you are only going to drop a month of so later (I've been told that some diet shakes are pretty awful).

It's not always a matter of what you eat but how much you eat.  What is your ultimate aim?  If it is to loose weight then juicing some veg isn't too bad an idea but if your weight is ok there is no great issue from eating a protein/fat based breakfast.  From a diabetic point of view it's the "healthy" breakfast cereals that are more often a bad idea.

Personally I like my veg raw, so I'd be going to attack it in large chunks


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## bev (Jan 4, 2013)

Dory said:


> i'm on slimming world so coke is out (as is glucose tablets - unless absolutely necessary).  sweet fruit does the trick for me and is syn free.



Hi Dory,

I dont know much about Slimming World so no idea what a 'syn' food is but just wondering what that means in terms of calories? I would have thought there are the same amount of calories in 15 carbs of coke as there is in 15 carbs of fruit. Sorry if I am missing the point!Bev


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## Dory (Jan 4, 2013)

ah slimming world is slightly different and very confusing ! 

on slimming world, for some reason nearly all fruit is allowed (so you can scoff as much as you like in a day) whereas glucose tablets and sugary drinks (fruit juice included) all have a 'syn' allowance (and you can only have a certain amount of syns per day) - which is indeed odd as there's probably as much sugar in 15g of sweet red grapes as in the equivalent of coke!! but their army of dieticians and other science bods have worked it out and said it's ok, so i'm happily not questioning it 

i'm waiting for the day SW says 'sorry, red grapes and persimmons are now syns' - that's when i'll be totally screwed


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## LeeLee (Jan 5, 2013)

The way I understand it, syns (short for synergies) are calculated based on the nutritional and hunger satisfying properties of the food.  A handful of grapes will feel more satisfying than a glucose tablet, and it will therefore take longer for you to feel hungry again.  Foods that are pure junk have 1 syn per 20 calories.


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## bev (Jan 5, 2013)

LeeLee said:


> The way I understand it, syns (short for synergies) are calculated based on the nutritional and hunger satisfying properties of the food.  A handful of grapes will feel more satisfying than a glucose tablet, and it will therefore take longer for you to feel hungry again.  Foods that are pure junk have 1 syn per 20 calories.




Hi Leelee,

Thankyou for the explanation.I wonder if SW realise what a hypo is - it seems odd that they would advise not to have the best method of glucose when the brain is starved of it doesnt it! I wouldnt worry about feeling full if your brain is suffering!Bev


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## MaryPlain (Jan 5, 2013)

bev said:


> Hi Leelee,
> 
> Thankyou for the explanation.I wonder if SW realise what a hypo is - it seems odd that they would advise not to have the best method of glucose when the brain is starved of it doesnt it! I wouldnt worry about feeling full if your brain is suffering!Bev




I agree. I don't think the SW rules are designed for people with diabetes on insulin. 

While using fruit to treat a mild hypo often works I definitely wouldn't recommend this for a serious or sudden drop, as by the time the fruit gets into your system the sugar levels could continue to drop to dangerous levels.

Less dramatically but just as seriously long term, if you're running low for longer than necessary this can contribute to a loss of hypo warning signs.

For me it makes no difference if I'm dieting or not, if I'm hypo the goal is simple: get sugars back to normal as quickly as possible!


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## haz (Jan 7, 2013)

Hi Steve - I also have a juicer and and blender now sitting on a shelf. A well meaning friend told me to juice fruit and blend fruit etc etc - and then another friend said the opposite - don't eat all this sugar laden fruit etc etc. I am new to diet control in my T2 regime change but I have found the best and quickest for me is to microwave my veggies in a little water and, with a lid on, it comes out like a steamer with all the goodness still in there, season to taste and I tuck in. The retained bulk and fibre also helps to fill me. 
Good luck.


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## LeeLee (Jan 7, 2013)

MaryPlain said:


> I agree. I don't think the SW rules are designed for people with diabetes on insulin.
> 
> You're right - the main focus with SW is losing weight.  I'm T2 and never get hypos, so hunger satisfaction without empty calories is the most important for me.  Eating the fruit and veg whole provides fibre to slow the digestive process, so no good for a hypo.  My aim is to go as long as I can without needing insulin, and losing weight has helped a lot.


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## Barbie1 (Jan 8, 2013)

We have a juicer and loads of recipe books, and some taste fantastic - and of course others leave a little to be desired. So it's very much a case of trial and error. And some benefit from using a blender as well, so you get some of the fibre left in at the last stage

However one recommendation  I would gladly pass on is that when juicing vegetables, they need to be combined, juicy and non juicy or the juicer will struggle. 

Also, spinach is best juiced by pushing a tight ball into the feeder followed by something else a bit firmer to help feed it through. You only need a little spinach juice to get the benefits of it. 

There is some guy (Jason something?) known as the Juice Master, who swears that using the juicer gives the body access to live nutients (!!!) and recommends a two week diet eating loads of smoothies and natural foods.


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## Vicsetter (Jan 8, 2013)

Barbie1 said:


> We have a juicer and loads of recipe books, and some taste fantastic - and of course others leave a little to be desired. So it's very much a case of trial and error. And some benefit from using a blender as well, so you get some of the fibre left in at the last stage
> 
> However one recommendation  I would gladly pass on is that when juicing vegetables, they need to be combined, juicy and non juicy or the juicer will struggle.
> 
> ...



Jason Vale  the face of the Juice Master. http://www.juicemaster.com/
His aim is to sell the Juice Master and his book, this is just sales hype.  Whilst eating a small amount of fruit is good, there is no such thing as eating fruit to 'detox' (whatever that means).  Please read Dr Ben Goldacre's page on the subject:http://www.badscience.net/index.php?s=detox
I will refer you to this site promoting juicing:http://www.juicing.info/juicetherapy/
which does provide a paragraph on the pitfalls and what to avoid (mentioning diabetes).


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## Barbie1 (Jan 9, 2013)

Juiced drinks or smoothies can taste rather luxurious, they are easy to digest if you have stomach troubles and they can be filling if you are trying to lose weight. 
And if your kids normally refuse to eat vegetables, making them into smoothies is an excellent way of getting the nutrients into them


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## Cairie (Jan 10, 2013)

*Fruit...*

14 years after being diagnosed as Type 2 I am still struggling, no one has ever explained fully the kind of foods I should be eating. Only recently did I discover that I shouldn't be eating so much fruit, I thought the sugar in fruit being natural and not refined was ok....I do try to eat well, but now wonder about my love for carrots and beetroot! It's a positive minefield for me. I'm still finding it hard being unable to self test as well, some days I get so depressed wondering if sugar levels are high that I start over eating - comfort foods and yes, that does include chocolate. I don't keep chocolate in the house and there is no shop in the village so on d-days I stay home. 

Wandering through this forum has helped me more than all the visits to the surgery however.

Cairie


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## Northerner (Jan 10, 2013)

Cairie said:


> 14 years after being diagnosed as Type 2 I am still struggling, no one has ever explained fully the kind of foods I should be eating. Only recently did I discover that I shouldn't be eating so much fruit, I thought the sugar in fruit being natural and not refined was ok....I do try to eat well, but now wonder about my love for carrots and beetroot! It's a positive minefield for me. I'm still finding it hard being unable to self test as well, some days I get so depressed wondering if sugar levels are high that I start over eating - comfort foods and yes, that does include chocolate. I don't keep chocolate in the house and there is no shop in the village so on d-days I stay home.
> 
> Wandering through this forum has helped me more than all the visits to the surgery however.
> 
> Cairie



Hi Cairie, I'd really recommend reading The GL Diet for Dummies. There's a chapter on Low-GL shopping for fruit and vegetables that will be kinder to your blood sugar levels  Plus, of course, if you are ever unsure please ask here for recommendations


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## Dory (Jan 11, 2013)

also Cairie,  most chemists these days sell the BG testing kits over the counter for around ?15-?20 (obviously the test strips cost extra).  I would say, if you're worrying about your sugar levels and this is causing you to stress, this will likely be negatively affecting your sugar levels too, so buying one yourself will be well worth the spend.


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## DeusXM (Jan 11, 2013)

Just ring up one of the meter manufacturers and tell them you test 8-10 times a day. They'll send you one for free.


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## Dory (Jan 11, 2013)

DeusXM said:


> Just ring up one of the meter manufacturers and tell them you test 8-10 times a day. They'll send you one for free.



or do that! even better!


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## timbla (Jan 18, 2013)

late to the thread, as usual - but i juice veggies all the time. i go for the green ones - u can see some good combos on youtube - just search for green smoothies - i tend to stick to what i know to have low GI and/or what i've read as having bg-lowering properties. bitter gourd is one such veggie. but really - if its green i chuck it down the chute - broccoli, lettuce, green beans. doesnt always taste too good, but i chug it down anyway and it fills me up long enough to avoid any foolish snacking. u can always throw half an apple or something in to take the edge of any bitterness. i used to juice up fruit all the time - apples, pears, grapes, u name it. wouldnt dream of doing that now though.


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