# Struggling with type 2 diabetes



## Edie (Jul 30, 2020)

I have had type 2 for about 6 years but am still struggling with blood sugar levels. All advice is directed at losing weight. I am 77 years old, 5 feet 6 inches and weigh 9st 2lb. I take metformin morning and evening. I have a very strict low carb diet but my sugar levels are often in double figures. I am very active, walking,gardening etc and during normal times I play badminton twice a week. I am at a loss as to what else to do, I don't want to lose any more weight. Anyone else out there with similar problems.


----------



## Edie (Jul 30, 2020)

Hi Martin, thanks for the reply. Last night my reading at least 2 hours after eating was 11.2. I only had a salad for my meal which didn't include anything high in carbs. It's usually above 10 and sometimes as high as 15.


----------



## Edie (Jul 30, 2020)

I don't usually test before my meal but maybe that's a good idea. I haven't tested in the morning either as I have been feeling really ill in the mornings with headaches but will try that as well.


----------



## everydayupsanddowns (Jul 30, 2020)

Welcome to the forum @Edie

Your situation certainly does sound a-typical.

Have you ever had a c-Peptide test to see what your level of insulin production is? And does your GP know you are eating next to no carbs and still seeing quite elevated BG?

It makes me wonder if you may have been losing beta cells over the past 6 years to a gradual autoimmune attack called LADA, Latent Autoimmune Diabetes in Adulthood - a slow onset form of T1 that does get mixed up with T2, and where T2 meds can initially appear to help, but which will ultimately need insulin.

Unintended weight loss is not often a good sign, and it sounds like you need a bit more support.


----------



## trophywench (Jul 30, 2020)

Hear Hear to what @everydayupsanddowns has just said.


----------



## Edie (Jul 31, 2020)

Thank you so much for your help. I will certainly talk to my GP, am having a blood test in two weeks so will see him shortly. It's very depressing to try so hard and not seem to get anywhere.


----------



## ianf0ster (Jul 31, 2020)

Hi,
 Most people going Low Carb lose weight even if they were at a 'normal' BMI before.
It's extremely rare that anyone would not reduce their Blood Glucose by going Low Carb unless they replace all of those carbs with Protein instead of a mix of protein and the natural fats it comes with: i.e. Fatty Fish, fatty cuts of meat, Nuts, Avocados, Eggs, cream, full fat dairy, Cheese etc.

So unless you are mistaken about both your carb intake and your fat intake then there is a strong possibility that you may indeed be T1.


----------



## pinkjude (Apr 4, 2021)

Edie said:


> I have had type 2 for about 6 years but am still struggling with blood sugar levels. All advice is directed at losing weight. I am 77 years old, 5 feet 6 inches and weigh 9st 2lb. I take metformin morning and evening. I have a very strict low carb diet but my sugar levels are often in double figures. I am very active, walking,gardening etc and during normal times I play badminton twice a week. I am at a loss as to what else to do, I don't want to lose any more weight. Anyone else out there with similar problems.


I was diagnosed in 2018. started at 55 then was 48, 43 then 55 last October and 84 this March. GP wants me to take Metformin but my nurse said I can have 3 months to try and get it down. I have cut out potatoes, bread, rice and pasta, eat salads, avocadoes, tofu, oily fish, chicken, unsalted nuts, berries.  I have lost 91bs and have been told to lose more. I am 57, 5 ft 3 and currently 11 st 6.  I dont test currently as was told not to but think I should. Any advice as to a good meter and best times to test.  Your figures look good compared to mine


----------



## pinkjude (Apr 4, 2021)

Anitram said:


> OK, I can see why you would be concerned. Do you test just before you sit down to eat, so that you can see where you were beforehand, and also on waking?
> 
> Martin


Hi I need advice on a good reliable meter that is easy to use as I currently don't test but need to.  When is the best time to test and what are good readings


----------



## pinkjude (Apr 4, 2021)

Anitram said:


> OK, I can see why you would be concerned. Do you test just before you sit down to eat, so that you can see where you were beforehand, and also on waking?
> 
> Martin


wow amazing results.


----------



## pinkjude (Apr 4, 2021)

Anitram said:


> For T2s the target range is to be between 4 and 7 on waking and just before a meal, and below 8.5 (some sources say below 9) two hours later. The difference between your pre- and post-meal readings will tell you how that meal affected your BG. A rise of 3 or less is considered OK.
> 
> I have a GlucoRXq meter but that was given to me by my DN, although I self-fund lancets and test strips these days. Other self-funders are better placed to advise on meter choices.
> 
> Martin


Thankyou. I need to get my reading of 84 down. Can I ask what your diet is generally?


----------



## trophywench (Apr 4, 2021)

@pinkjude - other Type 2s recommend either the Gluco Navii or the Spirit Tee 2 as being pretty reliable, and the strips are also cheapest to self fund.  Both are only available to purchase on line, not from a pharmacy.  

(mine's always prescribed, being permanently on insulin as I'm Type 1)


----------



## pinkjude (Apr 4, 2021)

ianf0ster said:


> Hi,
> Most people going Low Carb lose weight even if they were at a 'normal' BMI before.
> It's extremely rare that anyone would not reduce their Blood Glucose by going Low Carb unless they replace all of those carbs with Protein instead of a mix of protein and the natural fats it comes with: i.e. Fatty Fish, fatty cuts of meat, Nuts, Avocados, Eggs, cream, full fat dairy, Cheese etc.
> 
> So unless you are mistaken about both your carb intake and your fat intake then there is a strong possibility that you may indeed be T1.


Great results. I need a meter as currently don't test. Any advice?


----------



## pinkjude (Apr 4, 2021)

trophywench said:


> @pinkjude - other Type 2s recommend either the Gluco Navii or the Spirit Tee 2 as being pretty reliable, and the strips are also cheapest to self fund.  Both are only available to purchase on line, not from a pharmacy.
> 
> (mine's always prescribed, being permanently on insulin as I'm Type 1)


Thankyou


----------



## pinkjude (Apr 4, 2021)

trophywench said:


> @pinkjude - other Type 2s recommend either the Gluco Navii or the Spirit Tee 2 as being pretty reliable, and the strips are also cheapest to self fund.  Both are only available to purchase on line, not from a pharmacy.
> 
> (mine's always prescribed, being permanently on insulin as I'm Type 1)


The Gluco Navii looks easy to use and is a great price as are the strips as you say. I have been on the website and as I am not exactly sure what extras I need I will ring them Tuesday morning.  Do you need or get a sharps box?


----------



## trophywench (Apr 4, 2021)

No sharps box necessary - the lancets only go into the finger such a tiny way, and rarely get any amount of blood actually on the pointy bit and if you do get a bit of blood on it by the time you've moved the bodging device away from your finger it's dried in the air anyway, so  not considered clinically hazardous waste.  Dunno if these lancets come with a softer plastic safety cover over the tip - if so, stick that back on before chucking it in the bin.  Job done.


----------



## pinkjude (Apr 4, 2021)

trophywench said:


> No sharps box necessary - the lancets only go into the finger such a tiny way, and rarely get any amount of blood actually on the pointy bit and if you do get a bit of blood on it by the time you've moved the bodging device away from your finger it's dried in the air anyway, so  not considered clinically hazardous waste.  Dunno if these lancets come with a softer plastic safety cover over the tip - if so, stick that back on before chucking it in the bin.  Job done.


Thankyou thats great.


----------



## trophywench (Apr 5, 2021)

So all go to your GP and request a sharps bin then. 

I'm gobsmacked at the huge sharps bins some of you get - I'm only allowed a rectangular 1 litre one so I have to cut the ends (with the needles in them) off my pump tubing to get  them in there and chuck the tubing itself in the ordinary bin, same as I have to with all the plastic off the Libre inserter.  I spose I should put the hard round bit in the middle of a Libre sensor in the sharps, but as the hospital diabetes clinic told me to just throw everything in the ordinary bin after use, I do.

Been over 10 years since I've had to use single use lancets which are sharps - the Roche cassettes of 6 lancets, are not sharps unless you deliberately dismantle them.


----------



## Ljc (Apr 5, 2021)

As self funding meter user It’s unlikely you will be provided a sharps bin if you ask your Gp/nurse fir one . You can buy them but if you do,  you’ll probably have to pay a company to take and destroy them when full, as your council, chemist or gp practice is unlikely to take them.

You could do this , Stick the used needle of the lancet into the side of its small cover then drop it into an empty drinks can , when nearly full you could stuff the can with something  block the hole then dispose of it in your rubbish bin 
You see years ago T2s who were prescribed a meter and test strips were not usually provided with a sharps bin, so we did things like this or just put them in the bin. I was actually told by my DSN (a real  one ) to put them in the rubbish bin , this was back in the 90s


----------



## goodybags (Apr 5, 2021)

pinkjude said:


> The Gluco Navii looks easy to use and is a great price as are the strips as you say. I have been on the website and as I am not exactly sure what extras I need I will ring them Tuesday morning.  Do you need or get a sharps box?


Hi @pinkjude welcome to the world of testing
as you can see there’s mixed opinions on disposal of your used lancets from the finger pricing device, 

I have a sharps bin, as I also need to dispose of my used insulin pen needles 
a small sharps bin can be purchased from your local pharmacy (I get mine from Tescos pharmacy for a £1) the local authorities collect them for free (it will take you an age to fill one) or in some areas the pharmacy take them back I believe,
regular testing can be an eye opener what foods spike blood sugars (I think we are all respond different to various foods)


----------



## pinkjude (Apr 8, 2021)

Thankyou all.  I started testing yesterday but today my bs was 9.9 on waking and 8.5 2 hours after breakfast which seems wrong to me.  I am testing before deciding whether to start the one a day Metformin.


----------



## pinkjude (Apr 8, 2021)

Anitram said:


> Fresh meat and fish, eggs, salads, veg, berry fruits, nuts. I don't eat sweets, cakes, biscuits, chocolate, potatoes (except a couple of small roasties if we have a roast dinner, otherwise I have mashed cauliflower) or rice (I have riced cauliflower instead). If we have a pasta dish I have a 30g portion of wholegrain spelt pasta. I use low carb bread but restrict myself to 2 slices per day.


Thankyou. Can I ask why my BS level dropped after eating my breakfast today?  I am puzzled as to what is going on.


----------



## EllsBells (Apr 8, 2021)

pinkjude said:


> Thankyou. Can I ask why my BS level dropped after eating my breakfast today?  I am puzzled as to what is going on.


There's a thing called Dawn Phenomenon (DP) and another known as foot on the floor (FOTF). The DP occurs when your liver helpfully dumps glucose into your system in readiness for you to go out and hunt for your breakfast - this usually happens in the early hours - 4am ish. With FOTF, the same thing happens but later - when you get out of bed. A lot of people on here can have a sensible reading whilst still horizontal and then it shoots up as soon as they stand up.

I've noticed that my levels usually drop across the morning unless I've had a comparatively carby breakfast, so I think this is pretty normal.

As your sugar levels start coming down, you'll find that the fasting readings are also the last ones to tumble. Hope that helps!


----------



## pinkjude (Apr 8, 2021)

EllsBells said:


> There's a thing called Dawn Phenomenon (DP) and another known as foot on the floor (FOTF). The DP occurs when your liver helpfully dumps glucose into your system in readiness for you to go out and hunt for your breakfast - this usually happens in the early hours - 4am ish. With FOTF, the same thing happens but later - when you get out of bed. A lot of people on here can have a sensible reading whilst still horizontal and then it shoots up as soon as they stand up.
> 
> I've noticed that my levels usually drop across the morning unless I've had a comparatively carby breakfast, so I think this is pretty normal.
> 
> As your sugar levels start coming down, you'll find that the fasting readings are also the last ones to tumble. Hope that helps!


Thankyou. Its back to 9.9 again now. I did wonder if I need some carbs with my egg breakfast? Would it be better to have some extras with my eggs? I have tingling in my arms which concerns me but I am hoping it will go as levels drop. My DN would like me to start 1 tablet of metformin to help me to get the glucose under control whilst losing weight and changing my diet. I am reluctant to do so. You dropped down quickly. What does your general breakfast, lunch and dinners look like please?  I am low carb but poss too low.  2 eggs for breakfast, salad with prawns, a bit of mayo, salad leaves, cucumber, celery, olives and tomato for lunch. Dinner tonight stirfry with garlic, spring onion, pakchoi, broccoli and tofu . dessert raspberries. Also will have a few unsalted almonds, brazils and walnuts.  I do have a 5% greek yoghurt in but havnt eaten it as dont know the best time to do so.  I had gin and soda last night so wonder if no alcohol tonight would make a difference?  Sorry to ask so many qns


----------



## rebrascora (Apr 8, 2021)

As @EllsBells so well put it, your liver outputs glucose when you are not eating to keep your vital organs going and to give you energy to start the day. In prehistoric times before cupboards and fridges we would need to hunt or forage for food before we could eat. The act of eating actually stops the liver from doing that and triggers the pancreas to start producing insulin to deal with the blood glucose which will be produced from the food we eat and digest, so the combination of the liver switching off and the pancreas ramping up insulin production drops your levels a bit. 
It is all a very fine balancing act and with diabetes, the balance is off a bit and your pancreas may just be a bit slow to get the message to start producing insulin to cover the FOTF/DP but then when breakfast comes along into the stomach it gets a kick up the backside to get some work done pronto!


----------



## rebrascora (Apr 8, 2021)

I also meant to say, a big WELL DONE for starting to test your levels again. Don't worry too much about individual readings but look for longer term trends and keep a food diary along with a record of your before and 2hrs after readings so that you can see which foods are OK and which are best avoided or portion size reduced.


----------



## EllsBells (Apr 8, 2021)

EllsBells said:


> There's a thing called Dawn Phenomenon (DP) and another known as foot on the floor (FOTF). The DP occurs when your liver helpfully dumps glucose into your system in readiness for you to go out and hunt for your breakfast - this usually happens in the early hours - 4am ish. With FOTF, the same thing happens but later - when you get out of bed. A lot of people on here can have a sensible reading whilst still horizontal and then it shoots up as soon as they stand up.
> 
> I've noticed that my levels usually drop across the morning unless I've had a comparatively carby breakfast, so I think this is pretty normal.
> 
> As your sugar levels start coming down, you'll find that the fasting readings are also the last ones to tumble. Hope that helps!


I think what you are eating makes perfect sense - there are carbs (albeit minimal) in lots of things so don't worry you're too low. A lot of people (I think I am one) are more insulin resistant in the morning so low carb breakfasts make a lot of sense.

For breakfast I mostly have some berries with full fat greek style yoghurt drizzled with a little flaxseed/chia mix or two scrambled eggs with bacon, sausages or smoked salmon and sometimes mushrooms - they keep my BG level all morning but the protein gives me a rise mid-afternoon so it stacks with lunch carbs. I'm trying to cut down on the amount of protein I eat now as well as a result. By comparatively carby, I mean by adding say 150ml orange juice or too many berries - and the rise may be around the 0.5mmol mark! I got all of this from reading around people's comments on this forum by the way.


----------



## pinkjude (Apr 10, 2021)

Great thanks


----------



## pinkjude (Apr 10, 2021)

EllsBells said:


> I think what you are eating makes perfect sense - there are carbs (albeit minimal) in lots of things so don't worry you're too low. A lot of people (I think I am one) are more insulin resistant in the morning so low carb breakfasts make a lot of sense.
> 
> For breakfast I mostly have some berries with full fat greek style yoghurt drizzled with a little flaxseed/chia mix or two scrambled eggs with bacon, sausages or smoked salmon and sometimes mushrooms - they keep my BG level all morning but the protein gives me a rise mid-afternoon so it stacks with lunch carbs. I'm trying to cut down on the amount of protein I eat now as well as a result. By comparatively carby, I mean by adding say 150ml orange juice or too many berries - and the rise may be around the 0.5mmol mark! I got all of this from reading around people's comments on this forum by the way.


Thankyou .


----------

