# Type 2 diabetics not on insulin technology discrimination



## HalfpipMarathon (Nov 10, 2022)

This is just my thoughts and opinions on the above: I'm one of the above. I'm not ashamed of it.

By being proactive about managing my condition I decided to try a cgm (Dexcom One) having tried Libre 2 (flash gm).

Some people believe diabetics like myself not on insulin don't benefit from either cgm or flash gm; my question is how do they know? One gets out what one puts in. We're all different.

Whilst I realise that the NHS doesn't have a bottomless purse hence the strict criteria for receiving Libre 2, Dexcom etc on prescription. I understand the argument with regards to that however if someone is self funding it's no one's business whether someone has a cgm or flash gm and how they interpret the data. M

I had someone on a FB group appear to blame people like me because she couldn't get a supply of the Libre for a week . The admin put her right that how someone manages their condition is noone else's business and a pharmacist will sell if it's  available.

I'm grateful that noone on the forum has been judgemental about what I have posted. Everyone has been most supportive and helpful responding to my posts which has helped my mental health for this I thank you.


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## John McDermon (Nov 15, 2022)

Greetings from the USA!  Myrtle Beach, SC.

Halfpip - I agree with you on the value of a CGM for diabetics who are not yet on insulin.  I have been in the A1C range as high as 8.4 (once upon a time) and my insurance carrier at the time (2020) paid 100% for me to use a Libre Freestyle CGM.  As a technical person I used the CGM readings to better understand the impact of various foods, exercise, rest and other factors that impacted my glucose levels - more or less in a real-time sense.  I learned quite a bit about managing my glucose levels and as of recent months my A1C has leveled off in the 6.4-6.8 range.   I attribute that to having gained a working knowledge of the direct effects of various foods and eating habits.  To this day I am grateful for the year I had a CGM to learn these things.  Alas, in 2021 my insurance changed and I lost coverage for the Libre Freestyle CGM and had to give it up.  

I have since then been watching for new non-invasive CGM technology to come available.  Apple Watch teased about this for the past 2 years but hasn't risen to the occassion.  Samsung has likewise fed the rumor mill about their upcoming watch based CGM product.  But as time drags on, I've come to believe that these rumors are pre-mature.  Most likely the regulatory agencies involved have a squashing effect on innovation in the field of diabetes management.  Anything that threatens the financial foundation of insulin manufacturers most probably draws push-back from said manufacturers.  And regulatory agences tend to be quite reluctant to take them on.   Meanwhile those of us who would willingly purchase such non-invasive CGM technology simply go without.  

The sad truth (to me at least) is that having a tool to readily and conveniently monitor and manage one's own glucose levels serves the public good very well indeed.  Having better knowledge of what you're doing to yourself when you down a Snickers bar - or drink a soft drink, can only serve to help each of us do a better job of managing our own pre-diabetes.  And if it helps us manage our lives in ways that avoid more serious levels of diabetes then so much the better.   I'd rather have this tool available than not.  And I'm perplexed that the insurance industry isn't onboard with this as well.


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## Bloden (Nov 15, 2022)

Whatever allows you to manage your diabetes @HalfpipMarathon - I can fully understand why you’d want to use a CGM. A finger prick gives you a very limited amount of info to base food, activity, etc. changes on, while a CGM graph gives you the whole picture. The more tools we have in our self-management kits (whatever our type), the better!


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## Lucyr (Nov 15, 2022)

I meet the criteria, have also been admitted to hospital for diabetes this year, and still can’t get libre on prescription. The nice reccomended criteria aren’t followed for T2 in most places it seems.


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## HalfpipMarathon (Nov 15, 2022)

Hi thank you for reading and replying to my post.

I'm not eligible in the UK for libre 2 or anything else on prescription. I have tried Libre 2 but found my anxiety was not helped by scanning so I am trying out Dexcom One which doesn't require scanning. I have a receiver as my phone is not compatible with the Dexcom One app.

As I said in my post I am scared the anxiety I had when I was scanning is creeping back. How often should one check the app or receiver ? Or should you only check if you get an alarm saying low or high.


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## Lucyr (Nov 15, 2022)

I’d check whenever I expected to need to act on the information (eg a correction), or whenever i wanted to know what my bgs is (eg before giving a presentation or exercising in case i was heading low) plus whenever an alarm goes off. So in reality at least every couple of hours.


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## HalfpipMarathon (Nov 15, 2022)

Bloden said:


> Whatever allows you to manage your diabetes @HalfpipMarathon - I can fully understand why you’d want to use a CGM. A finger prick gives you a very limited amount of info to base food, activity, etc. changes on, while a CGM graph gives you the whole picture. The more tools we have in our self-management kits (whatever our type), the better!


Thank you. That is exactly what I feel yet I haven't posted about being on Dexcom One as I am aware some might think I don't need it if not on insulin or medication that might cause hypos.

I'm in the early stages with Dexcom One and I am trying to stop myself constantly checking my bg levels


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## Lucyr (Nov 15, 2022)

Why are you trying to stop yourself? The whole purpose of dexcom is to be able to check your bg as often as you want to, so that you can act on it. If you aren’t acting on the information, then it may be that cgm isn’t for you and you could get the information you need to act on your blood sugars through finger pricking.


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## HalfpipMarathon (Nov 15, 2022)

Lucyr said:


> I meet the criteria, have also been admitted to hospital for diabetes this year, and still can’t get libre on prescription. The nice reccomended criteria aren’t followed for T2 in most places it seems.


According to some unless you are type 2 on insulin no chance of getting it on prescription. My Dr said that eventually all diabetics regardless of insulin or not will be offered the Libre 2. I won't hold my breath. Some might prefer Dexcom One as it's same price roughly as Libre 2.

I have mixed feelings about getting it on prescription  if I am honest


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## HalfpipMarathon (Nov 15, 2022)

Lucyr said:


> Why are you trying to stop yourself? The whole purpose of dexcom is to be able to check your bg as often as you want to, so that you can act on it. If you aren’t acting on the information, then it may be that cgm isn’t for you and you could get the information you need to act on your blood sugars through finger pricking.


I'm not saying I am not going to check at all just when I was using Libre I had bad anxiety when I scanned and got a higher reading especially when I wasn't in a position to do anything about it . 

When I am at work I am okay as too busy to check too often. I will check 2hrs  after breakfast and lunch. It's the evening when I get a bit obsessed


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## Drummer (Nov 15, 2022)

HalfpipMarathon said:


> Thank you. That is exactly what I feel yet I haven't posted about being on Dexcom One as I am aware some might think I don't need it if not on insulin or medication that might cause hypos.
> 
> I'm in the early stages with Dexcom One and I am trying to stop myself constantly checking my bg levels


If you need the reassurance then check whenever you think you'd like to check - it is not going to wear the thing out or make the slightest difference to the functioning of the device, after all.
I am sure that most people check the speedometer umpteen times during their driving lessons and in the early days of driving - and then they check less and less as they become proficient at judging their speed. You'll probably do the same with your blood glucose levels.


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## Bruce Stephens (Nov 15, 2022)

John McDermon said:


> And I'm perplexed that the insurance industry isn't onboard with this as well.


I've no information about insurance companies, but NICE looked at things like reductions in hospital admissions for DKA and hypos (nice short-term effects) and reductions in HbA1c and decided that CGMs were appropriate for everyone with Type 1 (and some insulin users who have Type 2). I'm sure other criteria played some role but I suspect less of a role.

It feels much harder to justify offering them to people who aren't at risk of hypos and aren't at much risk of DKA, especially given that in the UK they aren't generally recommended to test themselves at all. (Other places are willing to spend more on health, of course.)

I can imagine things would change if there were some much cheaper technology for monitoring (even if it were much less accurate) but so far that just hasn't appeared.


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## HalfpipMarathon (Nov 15, 2022)

Bruce Stephens said:


> I've no information about insurance companies, but NICE looked at things like reductions in hospital admissions for DKA and hypos (nice short-term effects) and reductions in HbA1c and decided that CGMs were appropriate for everyone with Type 1 (and some insulin users who have Type 2). I'm sure other criteria played some role but I suspect less of a role.
> 
> It feels much harder to justify offering them to people who aren't at risk of hypos and aren't at much risk of DKA, especially given that in the UK they aren't generally recommended to test themselves at all. (Other places are willing to spend more on health, of course.)
> 
> I can imagine things would change if there were some much cheaper technology for monitoring (even if it were much less accurate) but so far that just hasn't appeared.


Whilst I understand why it's not recommended for type 2 not on insulin or medication that might cause hypos I still don't understand why the aforementioned are told not to test. It could be financially motivated re cost of meters , strips and lancets orbit could be due to mental health risks.

My Dr said that if you don't test how do you know what your blood glucose is doing for example if one had a reading of 15 one wouldn't go and get a cake.

Using Libre 2 I managed to reduce my HbA1c and hope to have improved it further next time.


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## Bruce Stephens (Nov 15, 2022)

HalfpipMarathon said:


> Whilst I understand why it's not recommended for type 2 not on insulin or medication that might cause hypos I still don't understand why the aforementioned are told not to test. It could be financially motivated re cost of meters , strips and lancets orbit could be due to mental health risks.


Not sure that mental health risks are a bit factor. There are costs in asking people to test when there's not that much they can do about it. There are the financial costs and I'm sure that's the major reason in the UK. But there's also (I suspect) a limited value in testing, so it's worth trying to maximise the value compared to the cost. (And I'd agree that CGMs would be ideal if only they were vastly cheaper since they're nice and low effort.)

I think we ought to be offering testing for the first (say) six months together with advice on how to use it (to judge how particular foods are digested and that kind of thing). That seems fairly uncontroversial (based on the Cochrane survey).



			https://www.cochranelibrary.com/cdsr/doi/10.1002/14651858.CD005060.pub3/full


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## travellor (Nov 15, 2022)

I was prescribed strips initially, that was before CGM's were around. 

The issue with constant testing can be a mental health issue though.

There are many unrealistic expectations that do upset people.
Be it from spikes, food issues, setting unattainable targets, trying to crash hba1c down in weeks, it goes on, and there are posts daily on this.

The "speedometer" analogy is good, it's like trying to drive on the motorway as if you are in a schoolzone, panicking and trying to keep the speed at 20mph when everyone else is comfortable at 70mph.

Then the amount of testing can be an issue.
Again, it's like driving continuously watching the speedometer, and not looking at anything else, eventually you will crash and burn.

So yes, testing can be useful, but not universally, I think it needs discussion with the HCP first, to ensure its not just swapping one issue for another.


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## BadaBing (Nov 15, 2022)

Bruce Stephens said:


> Not sure that mental health risks are a bit factor. There are costs in asking people to test when there's not that much they can do about it. There are the financial costs and I'm sure that's the major reason in the UK. But there's also (I suspect) a limited value in testing, so it's worth trying to maximise the value compared to the cost. (And I'd agree that CGMs would be ideal if only they were vastly cheaper since they're nice and low effort.)
> 
> I think we ought to be offering testing for the first (say) six months together with advice on how to use it (to judge how particular foods are digested and that kind of thing). That seems fairly uncontroversial (based on the Cochrane survey).
> 
> ...


Healthcare has always been about the money and how much money ought to be spent on any one individual to maintain optimum health.

And healthcare in the UK has always been rationed both pre and post 5 July 1948.

I saw a publication recently, published by Diabetes UK, which says that roughly 10% of the entire NHS budget is spent on diabetics (T1 and T2), but of that 10% 80% is spent on treating [preventable?] complications.

If that is correct - and I have no reason to disbelieve it - it does suggest that a "penny wise, pound foolish" approach goes on within the NHS concerning tech that would help diabetics better manage this condition.

It has never made sense to me - as a taxpayer - why diabetics who would benefit from it shouldn't be given the tools to better manage this disease, now that better tools exist.

Can anyone think of any other chronic medical condition where - for 95% of the time - one is left completely on one's own and to one's own devices to manage the condition?


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## Bruce Stephens (Nov 15, 2022)

travellor said:


> So yes, testing can be useful, but not universally, I think it needs discussion with the HCP first, to ensure its not just swapping one issue for another.


Yes, I think it's important to make sure that what you'll learn will be worth the effort.


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## HalfpipMarathon (Nov 15, 2022)

travellor said:


> I was prescribed strips initially, that was before CGM's were around.
> 
> The issue with constant testing can be a mental health issue though.
> 
> ...


Is this reply for me? If so thank you for your reply and recognition that constantly testing can be a mental health issue.

I'm beginning to wonder in my case whether it's more to do with my posting about testing. I know people are trying to help and I appreciate that but maybe it's not the best thing for me to do and I should just get on with it.

I'm still waiting for a response to my email from Dexcom asking if it is okay to pay for the extra transmitter and sensor save the hassle of sending it back. I bought a special deal of 1 transmitter and 1 sensor but for some reason they doubled my order. I thought I would check as I could have misheard what the guy said when I ordered (I hadn't) as I didn't want them to think I was dishonest and they could have asked for it back when they did an audit.






I


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## Bruce Stephens (Nov 15, 2022)

BadaBing said:


> If that is correct - and I have no reason to disbelieve it - it does suggest that a "penny wise, pound foolish" approach goes on within the NHS concerning tech that would help diabetics better manage this condition.


I'm all in favour of NICE considering longer term reductions in complications and that was one of the considerations in recommending CGMs for everyone with T1.

I'm just not at all sure that that would support CGMs for everyone with T2. Maybe it would but I think it's unlikely. I can imagine it would support offering test strips (so SMBG) for everyone who wanted to use them, and maybe CGMs to at least some (perhaps those who wanted them and had some genetic or other factors increasing their chances of complications).


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## Bruce Stephens (Nov 15, 2022)

HalfpipMarathon said:


> I'm still waiting for a response to my email from Dexcom asking if it is okay to pay for the extra transmitter and sensor save the hassle of sending it back.


I'd be quite surprised if they wanted them back. I'd guess they'll just say to keep them.


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## HalfpipMarathon (Nov 15, 2022)

Bruce Stephens said:


> I'd be quite surprised if they wanted them back. I'd guess they'll just say to keep them.


So am I, after all it was their mistake but I wasn't sure if I hadn't misheard when I ordered so thought I had better check. Obviously as each transmitter lasts 90 days and each sensor lasts 10 days I am assuming that I would need another 7 sensors for the current transmitter if I am able to keep the second sensor and transmitter.


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## Bruce Stephens (Nov 15, 2022)

HalfpipMarathon said:


> So am I, after all it was their mistake but I wasn't sure if I hadn't misheard when I ordered so thought I had better check. Obviously as each transmitter lasts 90 days and each sensor lasts 10 days I am assuming that I would need another 7 sensors for the current transmitter if I am able to keep the second sensor and transmitter.


Nothing wrong with asking. I would, too. I'd just be very surprised if they wanted them back (handling that is probably very unusual for them and so costly).


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## travellor (Nov 15, 2022)

HalfpipMarathon said:


> Is this reply for me? If so thank you for your reply and recognition that constantly testing can be a mental health issue.
> 
> I'm beginning to wonder in my case whether it's more to do with my posting about testing. I know people are trying to help and I appreciate that but maybe it's not the best thing for me to do and I should just get on with it.
> 
> ...



Not specifically, but I do believe it's quite common.
And there is certainly an argument to take time off on occasions as well.


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## HalfpipMarathon (Nov 15, 2022)

travellor said:


> Not specifically, but I do believe it's quite common.
> And there is certainly an argument to take time off on occasions as well.


Okay wasn't sure. I did have breaks with Libre 2 due to the cost I also like the fact that I can wear the Dexcom One on my abdomen as well as the back of my arm. I may have to do the same if I continue with Dexcom One.


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## Proud to be erratic (Nov 15, 2022)

HalfpipMarathon said:


> Okay wasn't sure. I did have breaks with Libre 2 due to the cost I also like the fact that I can wear the Dexcom One on my abdomen as well as the back of my arm. I may have to do the same if I continue with Dexcom One.


I've been a little slow on recognising this: you can wear your Libre 2 sensor anywhere you wish @HalfpipMarathon, not just your arm. But it is only licenced for the arm and thus does not meet the DVLA remit, for those of us subject to hypos (but not applicable to you). You might also fall short of Abbott's warranty requirements, should you have a failed sensor.
I wore sensors on my chest, which started when I wasn't driving and continued - so I just reverted to finger pricking for driving. The sensors worked well. I've seen postings here and on FB, where others wear them on their abdomen and thighs with satisfactory outcomes.


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## HalfpipMarathon (Nov 15, 2022)

Proud to be erratic said:


> I've been a little slow on recognising this: you can wear your Libre 2 sensor anywhere you wish @HalfpipMarathon, not just your arm. But it is only licenced for the arm and thus does not meet the DVLA remit, for those of us subject to hypos (but not applicable to you). You might also fall short of Abbott's warranty requirements, should you have a failed sensor.
> I wore sensors on my chest, which started when I wasn't driving and continued - so I just reverted to finger pricking for driving. The sensors worked well. I've seen postings here and on FB, where others wear them on their abdomen and thighs with satisfactory outcomes.


I  suppose one wouldn't say they were wearing it anywhere else but back of arm if reporting an issue to Abbotts although they must be aware that people do this.

I'm currently trying out Dexcom One atm. If I decide to return to Libre 2 I might try my abdomen. I have never had any fall off or  fail ;suppose I have been lucky. I have a receiver and a transmitter which lasts 90 days with the current sensor.


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## Proud to be erratic (Nov 15, 2022)

Yes, I am watching (lurking?) to see how that works out for you with Dexcom One. I have a recommendation from my Endo for this, but my ICB haven't approved Dexcom One. So I might give in and self-fund. But, like you I'll need a Receiver as well, so a 3 month package has a start-up £60 cost and if Dexcom One isn't any better for me that could be a wasted expense. 

But for you, Libre allows very intermittent use on a simple pay-as-you-go basis. So you could fund one sensor per month or per 2 months or per quarter; ie at whatever frequency you like. And worn on whatever part of your anatomy you wanted. Whereas each Dexcom transmitter should last 90 days, so I'd have a feeling of waste if there was a transmitter working, but no sensor!! That said my earlier post was just something that struck me - not even sure why it occurred to me.

What app did you finally decide to record your data on, if you are recording carbs from meals? Or perhaps you just keep a pen and paper record. I'm not clear if Dexcom One does actually link to Clarity; we do have a PC.


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## HalfpipMarathon (Nov 15, 2022)

Proud to be erratic said:


> Yes, I am watching (lurking?) to see how that works out for you with Dexcom One. I have a recommendation from my Endo for this, but my ICB haven't approved Dexcom One. So I might give in and self-fund. But, like you I'll need a Receiver as well, so a 3 month package has a start-up £60 cost and if Dexcom One isn't any better for me that could be a wasted expense.
> 
> But for you, Libre allows very intermittent use on a simple pay-as-you-go basis. So you could fund one sensor per month or per 2 months or per quarter; ie at whatever frequency you like. And worn on whatever part of your anatomy you wanted. Whereas each Dexcom transmitter should last 90 days, so I'd have a feeling of waste if there was a transmitter working, but no sensor!! That said my earlier post was just something that struck me - not even sure why it occurred to me.
> 
> What app did you finally decide to record your data on, if you are recording carbs from meals? Or perhaps you just keep a pen and paper record. I'm not clear if Dexcom One does actually link to Clarity; we do have a PC.


I use Nutracheck the free version but I use the barcode scanner the app has to check out carb content.

Dexcom said you need a computer so I haven't bothered with Clarity. I have a Dexcom One account set up so if I get a phone that is compatible I will be able to see my data on phone but I haven't decided regarding my phone atm hence the receiver.

The thing I do miss with Libre 2 is that I have a logbook of scans whereas the only way I would have the same thing with Dexcom One would be If I wrote down the time and reading from my sensor in a book.

I'm not sure if it's because the sensor is on my abdomen that I am having high readings compared to what I had with Libre. I may try back of my arm (if I am able to keep the second sensor they sent me in error) next time.

As the receiver I believe has a warranty of one year not sure if that's how long it lasts I have it if I wanted to swap between Libre and Dexcom One


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## Bruce Stephens (Nov 15, 2022)

Proud to be erratic said:


> I'm not clear if Dexcom One does actually link to Clarity; we do have a PC.


I think it does. https://www.dexcom.com/en-GB/faqs/using-clarity-reporting-software?c=d1


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## Lucyr (Nov 16, 2022)

HalfpipMarathon said:


> I use Nutracheck the free version but I use the barcode scanner the app has to check out carb content.
> 
> Dexcom said you need a computer so I haven't bothered with Clarity. I have a Dexcom One account set up so if I get a phone that is compatible I will be able to see my data on phone but I haven't decided regarding my phone atm hence the receiver.
> 
> ...


The receiver would likely last more than a year, just like a phone might come with a warranty of one year but work for 5. The transmitter will only work for 90 days once activated, regardless of whether you use another sensor or not.


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## BadaBing (Nov 19, 2022)

Bruce Stephens said:


> I'm all in favour of NICE considering longer term reductions in complications and that was one of the considerations in recommending CGMs for everyone with T1.
> 
> I'm just not at all sure that that would support CGMs for everyone with T2. Maybe it would but I think it's unlikely. I can imagine it would support offering test strips (so SMBG) for everyone who wanted to use them, and maybe CGMs to at least some (perhaps those who wanted them and had some genetic or other factors increasing their chances of complications).


I just don’t buy the proposition that any diabetic - left to their own devices 95% of the time - can make proper decisions about their glycaemic control by pricking randomly their finger and doing a fingerstick test X times a day.

Sure, one might be able to test to see if one is genetically predisposed to get certain complications. But I understand such tests are expensive, and a perpetually cash-strapped NHS (or rather HM Treasury) isn't going to spend the money doing those kind of tests as a matter of routine.

80% of the entire NHS budget spent on diabetes is used treating preventable complications.

The recent data coming out of NICE suggests that keeping one's blood glucose within a defined range for 70% or more of the time lessens the risk of future complications/hospitalisations, etc. 

And if those consequences happen the NHS has no choice but to spend money dealing with the aftermath. In many cases on an ongoing basis.

If the technology exists to help every diabetic achieve greater time in range, why not proactively give it to them and save money in the medium/long term?

The NHS is penny wise, pound foolish. A terrible accountant.


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## Martin62 (Nov 19, 2022)

HalfpipMarathon said:


> This is just my thoughts and opinions on the above: I'm one of the above. I'm not ashamed of it.
> 
> By being proactive about managing my condition I decided to try a cgm (Dexcom One) having tried Libre 2 (flash gm).
> 
> ...





HalfpipMarathon said:


> This is just my thoughts and opinions on the above: I'm one of the above. I'm not ashamed of it.
> 
> By being proactive about managing my condition I decided to try a cgm (Dexcom One) having tried Libre 2 (flash gm).
> 
> ...


Hi there, I'm type1 and before I managed to get libre on prescription,  I was self funding , using the glucorx aidex sensors , they go on your abdomen. I had very good results with them, but I know a lot of people didn't,  maybe worth a look ?
Kind regards
Martin


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## HalfpipMarathon (Nov 19, 2022)

Martin62 said:


> Hi there, I'm type1 and before I managed to get libre on prescription,  I was self funding , using the glucorx aidex sensors , they go on your abdomen. I had very good results with them, but I know a lot of people didn't,  maybe worth a look ?
> Kind regards
> Martin


Hi Martin

Unfortunately my phone is not compatible with GlucoRX app and although the sensors are cheaper it's not an option unless I either fork out for a second phone just for the app or downgrade my phone as doubt any new phones will be compatible.


Apparently if you can download the app and set up an email account the GlucoRX Aidex app should work but it's a risk ordering the starter pack not knowing for sure if this will work.


Dexcom provide a receiver for phones that don't support the app. The sensors which,if you want to buy individually, are £41.25 but only via phone as not on the website. Not sure how much the transmitter costs individually. Need to look as can't afford the three month bundle.

Yes the transmitter doesn't last as long as Aidex just 90 days.


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## travellor (Nov 19, 2022)

BadaBing said:


> I just don’t buy the proposition that any diabetic - left to their own devices 95% of the time - can make proper decisions about their glycaemic control by pricking randomly their finger and doing a fingerstick test X times a day.
> 
> Sure, one might be able to test to see if one is genetically predisposed to get certain complications. But I understand such tests are expensive, and a perpetually cash-strapped NHS (or rather HM Treasury) isn't going to spend the money doing those kind of tests as a matter of routine.
> 
> ...



Many diabetics wouldn't make any decisions.
All you need to do is look on eBay to find prescribed test strips being sold, CGM's would go the same way.

When I used to work I mentioned I was type 2 to one of my customers, he said
"Do you need any strips, we're both prescribed them every month but don't test much", and showed me a draw full of them.


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## 42istheanswer (Nov 19, 2022)

It's really frustrating the number of people who just order everything on their prescription list whether they need it or not. My practice nurse said to me that people do that with lancets - there are 200 on one prescription as opposed to usually 50 test strips, but they still order the lancets every month too.... (I'm not sure why they don't just put the lancets on non-repeat so they have to be specifically requested but maybe they think that extra staff time would cost more?)


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## BadaBing (Nov 19, 2022)

travellor said:


> Many diabetics wouldn't make any decisions.
> All you need to do is look on eBay to find prescribed test strips being sold, CGM's would go the same way.
> 
> When I used to work I mentioned I was type 2 to one of my customers, he said
> "Do you need any strips, we're both prescribed them every month but don't test much", and showed me a draw full of them.


That is very naughty, as well as most likely being fraudulent.

And presumably these people will regret if they find later in life on their eyesight deteriorates or appendages have to be removed.

I also assume such laissez faire is a result of clinicians not making it crystal clear to their patients what the consequences are of not maintaining good glycaemic control.


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## Drummer (Nov 19, 2022)

BadaBing said:


> I just don’t buy the proposition that any diabetic - left to their own devices 95% of the time - can make proper decisions about their glycaemic control by pricking randomly their finger and doing a fingerstick test X times a day.


I managed it - but I have always been a logical and scientific thinker. In fact I found it very easy to discover that almost all foods over 10% carbs were difficult to deal with if I ate a normal portion, that I needed to restrict legumes as I seem to extract more carbs than the value given, and then I was no longer diabetic. Job done.


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## travellor (Nov 19, 2022)

BadaBing said:


> That is very naughty, as well as most likely being fraudulent.
> 
> And presumably these people will regret if they find later in life on their eyesight deteriorates or appendages have to be removed.
> 
> I also assume such laissez faire is a result of clinicians not making it crystal clear to their patients what the consequences are of not maintaining good glycaemic control.



Poor assumptions there.


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## NotWorriedAtAll (Nov 19, 2022)

42istheanswer said:


> It's really frustrating the number of people who just order everything on their prescription list whether they need it or not. My practice nurse said to me that people do that with lancets - there are 200 on one prescription as opposed to usually 50 test strips, but they still order the lancets every month too.... (I'm not sure why they don't just put the lancets on non-repeat so they have to be specifically requested but maybe they think that extra staff time would cost more?)


I changed my lancet today when I realised I was getting sore fingers. I have had one 200 pack since I was given my monitor - the date on the pack is 19/04/19 - it is still 2/3 full.


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## rebrascora (Nov 20, 2022)

I was considering asking for the lancets on my repeat list to be removed next time I have a review because I don't plan to live 200+years and I am a member of the St Swithin's Day club!


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## everydayupsanddowns (Nov 21, 2022)

42istheanswer said:


> It's really frustrating the number of people who just order everything on their prescription list whether they need it or not. My practice nurse said to me that people do that with lancets - there are 200 on one prescription as opposed to usually 50 test strips, but they still order the lancets every month too.... (I'm not sure why they don't just put the lancets on non-repeat so they have to be specifically requested but maybe they think that extra staff time would cost more?)



I’ve been playing this silly game for over 30 years, and I don’t think I’ve *ever* needed to have lancets on prescription. The ones that come with the fingerpricker are usually enough to outlast the device at my changing frequency  . I think I still have a box of manual stabbers from back in the day somewhere, and I bought myself a box of fastclix drums a year or two back that will most likely see me out!


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## Sally71 (Nov 21, 2022)

You don’t have to order everything on the repeat anyway.  I put a prescription in when it’s time to top up the insulin stock and just have a quick check to see if we need anything else too, which we often don’t.  I’ve just put one in for insulin, and it’s at least 6 weeks since I last ordered any, and also Accu Chek test strips as the last couple of boxes we have of those are going out of date. I noticed they have removed those from the list without any consultation!  Granted we don’t need 4 boxes at a time any more as we mostly use Dexcom now and only need a small number of strips in stock as back up.  We have one Accu Chek meter and one different one which does ketones too, daughter likes to keep one in her school bag and one elsewhere so i don’t think it’s unreasonable to have a box of each in reserve.  Have put in a special request to see if we can get them back, I do try hard not to overstock and don’t just order everything!
I notice we’ve had lancets removed as well, but we still have enough Multiclix ones to last for years and ordered a box of Fastclix when we got sent one of those finger bodgers to replace it, so that will probably last forever!


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