# Am I being unreasonable?



## Felinia (Oct 3, 2021)

Being diabetic and with other health issues I know I have to be extra careful.  So my mask is on all the time I am out of the house, not only in enclosed spaces like shops, but in the street.  The only time it is off is in the swimming pool or when I eat and drink.  Until recently that too was outside.  My friend had major heart surgery 2 years ago, and was recently in hospital for tests and checks.  After she had been home for 2 weeks she was cleared to go out and about.  So we decided to go for a meal at her favourite restaurant, tucked away in a corner.

Three days later we both came down with streaming colds so we know we had to have picked it up there.  Our COVID tests were negative, but as usual mine turned to bronchitis, and hers put a strain on her system.  So am I being unreasonable thinking that the person with the cold was being selfish and should not have been in the restaurant spreading germs?  Or should my friend and I avoid eating indoors (ie until next Spring!!).  We both want to return to as normal a life as possible.


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## Lucyr (Oct 3, 2021)

I think you’re being unreasonable. A cold is infectious from a few days before symptoms appear. Should we all then not go out just in case we have a cold that we could be spreading about but that we don’t yet have symptoms of?


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## Kaylz (Oct 3, 2021)

With a cold people can have as little as a tickly throat and that's it while someone else in the house can have full on cough etc, it's very unreasonable to think that anyone with a slight cold should stay away from places, did you think that of them before? Or did you stay away from places if you had a cold before all of this?


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## Pattidevans (Oct 3, 2021)

It may be a bit unreasonable, but I can understand and empathise since we've all been so inculcated with fear over lockdown and made far more wary than we ever were before.   Perhaps the person with the cold had very mild symptoms or even none at all.  Perhaps your friend already had it brewing before she met you.  Who knows?  Unfortunately I think it's something we have to live with from now on and if we can, not let it stop us from getting on with our lives as we did before.


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## Gwynn (Oct 3, 2021)

Its an interesting question, even more so with the pandemic.

I will probably get shot down for this, but I felt that I ought to comment.

My position is that if the person knows they are sick then it is irresponsible and uncaring of them to go anywhere where others may be gathered.

I worked in an office (a lot of the time) for over 30 years and the ethos there was 'you come in unless dead'. Well not quite, but it seemed that way. The management were not happy with you if you were ill and it was reflected in your performance review and any pay rises! People came in sick or not. So, of course, as soon as one person came in with a cold, everyone got it and the sick rate (cos some would get it bad) went up. Pesonally I hated it when people came in with colds (or anything else).

On one occasion someone came in with chicken pox and refused to go home until we all complained. But even then the management were very reluctant to send the person home.

Now, I keep well away from anyone with a cold or anything as I have a compromised immunity.

The difficulty, as has been pointed out here, is if someone shows no symptoms yet and feels well. How would they know? But I doubt that that is the scenario the poster meant.


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## Sally71 (Oct 3, 2021)

The flip side being that I used to have almost constant colds, so if I phoned in sick every time I had a cold I’d hardly ever be in work and would probably get the sack for being unreliable.  It’s a tricky one, what did we used to do before covid came along?  OK if you’ve got an absolutely steaming cold you should be at home, but if you’ve only sneezed a couple of times (often the first sign of an impending cold for me) you might not even have taken any notice, after all you do sneeze for other reasons too, just because you’ve sneezed doesn’t necessarily mean you are going down with a cold!  Nobody would ever go out anywhere if you had to stay at home every time you had one cough or sneeze.


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## Felinia (Oct 3, 2021)

I accept that some people may not know if they are coming down with a cold, so I take that point.  What I was trying to say was, that if the person *knew* they had a cold, then they should not risk spreading it.  And to answer another point, I always isolate the moment I suspect I have a cold, and avoid anyone who has a cold, or whose family member has one.  This is because I have a compromised immune system, and it turns to bronchitis in me.  I now return to my dog imitations!


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## Eddy Edson (Oct 3, 2021)

Felinia said:


> What I was trying to say was, that if the person *knew* they had a cold, then they should not risk spreading it.


I think that's entirely reasonable.


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## Kaylz (Oct 3, 2021)

Others can't afford to isolate for a bit of a cold, kids would almost never be at school, bosses wouldn't accept that as an excuse for someone not to come to work unless it's a nursery where it's advised you don't, you singled the person out even though it's been pointed out they maybe didn't know, even the job centre wouldn't have accepted "sorry I can't make it today, I've got a cold" and the person would have been sanctioned so it's unrealistic to expect people with a cold to lock themselves away


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## Lucyr (Oct 3, 2021)

I think you’re still being too black and white. I came down with a heavy cold last week, whilst on holiday. I continued going out on public transport, to the shops/restaurants, as what else could I do. Not like I could just stay inside the hotel room for 2 weeks until the cold had gone, I’d travelled there by public transport, only booked a weeks stay, and you don’t get any fridge or cooking facilities in a hotel room.

Even now, I still have a bit of a sniffle, as in I might blow my nose 3-4 times a day, bit of an itchy throat, feel perfectly fine otherwise and not taking any painkillers or throat lozenges etc. I’m not staying in my flat though, I’m going about my life as normal. Isolating until the symptoms have completely gone would be quite an overreaction for a cold.


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## Sally71 (Oct 3, 2021)

Do you actually know for sure that there was someone at the restaurant who knew they had a cold?  If not then you don’t really have a reason to complain, do you.  People carry germs, always have always will, if you are going to mix with other people at all then you will get ill sometimes, that’s just life.  I work in a school.  Surprise surprise within 3 weeks of going back I’ve had a cold, and have no idea who I caught it from, I haven’t seen anyone else sneezing and snuffling at all.  All colds in me eventually go into my chest, and the last bit of cough can drag on for weeks, am I supposed to isolate myself for all that time?  Colds in most people are not serious, if you are immunocompromised then that is different but I don’t think you can expect the rest of the world to go into hiding just because of a few unlucky people who suffer worse than most.


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## Felinia (Oct 3, 2021)

Guess I'll just keep on doing what's right for me.


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## trophywench (Oct 3, 2021)

Years ago ie throughout my childhood the joke in our house was that Jen had a cold - or were they chest infections? of course nobody knows - literally throughout the whole winter - instead of a ladies hanky I always needed to take one of my dad's to school and later, to work.  Once I went to work for an insurance company when I was 17, the rule for unoccupied houses was that 'The water system must be drained and the supply turned off at the main from October to March inclusive' - so I changed how I described my annual season of colds as Oct-Mar inclusive.

I don't have em that bad now - but some folk do suffer more and always will - let's face it, had I needed to isolate every time my sinuses were completely bunged up with disgusting thick mucus then, I'd have never received a normal school education in the first place. 

I think it's up to the individuals who are eg Auto-immune or have eg COPD so need to try and avoid close encounters with anyone else (in case they pass summat on) indoors, need to arrange their own lives how they see fit - rather than expecting all and sundry else to do it for them.  And frankly - that is exactly the same as it was pre-Covid - the main difference in my mind and I sincerely hope most other folks' mind, is that we respect their need to socially distance and/or wear a mask when not in an otherwise 'medical' scenario.

There has been reports of folk becoming abusive when eg GP surgeries insist they wear a mask when visiting - to me it is they who are being unreasonable - not the eg GP/nurse/receptionist.  Yes, OK maybe it's a PITA remembering to take one with you - but by now for heaven's sake - carry one at all times 'just in case' !  (shame we can't wish T1 on such folk instantly - THEN they'd see how much ' other crap' some normal folk always need to carry 'just in case' !


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## Kaylz (Oct 3, 2021)

trophywench said:


> Yes, OK maybe it's a PITA remembering to take one with you -


Do they not supply them at the door? All NHS buildings up here only allow the use of fluid resistant masks that they supply at the door, even the Town hall's etc that are being used as vaccine clinics xx


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## Gwynn (Oct 3, 2021)

I guess you touched a nerve with some.

Points on all sides. The world is generally geared up to make profit regardless of the workers health condition. Business is very tough. I would make a hopeless businessman as I am too sympathetic.

I am with Felinia on this but I do recognise that some have to work to be able to eat regardless of how they feel, and some bosses/companies are not sympathetic to anyone becomming ill.

Rock and hard place springs to mind.

Do what you need to do to protect yourself and your family and others.


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## trophywench (Oct 3, 2021)

Kaylz said:


> Do they not supply them at the door? All NHS buildings up here only allow the use of fluid resistant masks that they supply at the door, even the Town hall's etc that are being used as vaccine clinics xx


Not been available at the door at our GP surgery or the (separately owned and run, separate entrance door) pharmacy within the same actual building since the pandemic started.  Think one may have been handed to you when you went there for your first Covid jab if you hadn't got one, but not since.


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## Leadinglights (Oct 3, 2021)

I hold with the theory that our immune systems are not a robust as they used to be with everybody using anti bacterial this and that at every opportunity. Don't get me wrong there is a definite place for hygiene but unless we challenge our immune system it forgets how to work and allows the real nasties to invade our bodies.


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## Hepato-pancreato (Oct 3, 2021)

You say you want to return to as normal a life as possible. Well pre pandemic nobody wore masks . The common cold was as such common. i'm sure you never thought about a cold like you are now. i cant believe you think that is normal what you are suggesting.


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## Deleted member 33972 (Oct 3, 2021)

Felinia said:


> Being diabetic and with other health issues I know I have to be extra careful.  So my mask is on all the time I am out of the house, not only in enclosed spaces like shops, but in the street.  The only time it is off is in the swimming pool or when I eat and drink.  Until recently that too was outside.  My friend had major heart surgery 2 years ago, and was recently in hospital for tests and checks.  After she had been home for 2 weeks she was cleared to go out and about.  So we decided to go for a meal at her favourite restaurant, tucked away in a corner.
> 
> Three days later we both came down with streaming colds so we know we had to have picked it up there.  Our COVID tests were negative, but as usual mine turned to bronchitis, and hers put a strain on her system.  So am I being unreasonable thinking that the person with the cold was being selfish and should not have been in the restaurant spreading germs?  Or should my friend and I avoid eating indoors (ie until next Spring!!).  We both want to return to as normal a life as possible.


It was on television, don’t remember what programme, that it’s because we’ve been in isolation for so long that we’re catching germs now that we’re allowed out. This makes sense and things like colds are airborne so you could have caught it anywhere. it’s also the season for colds.  No point  holding on to  angst for someone you don‘t know!


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## trophywench (Oct 4, 2021)

One of the places Pete latterly always got chest infections from attending, were our regular  Oct - Mar caravan rallies with friends, the venues for which would have indoor facilities, so we'd arrive Friday lunchtime-ish, then eg F&C ordered and collected and we'd all eat together in the indoor bit, spend the evening together socially, own food Sat night, indoor social evening again, convoy to local pub for lunch, bid farewells and come home again.

Two of these places were heated by Calor gas via 'Super Ser' heaters, neither with any cross flow of ventilation - and Oh no, not again by Wednesday.   Very damp if not completely wet, heat.  Opening windows when there was only teeming rain and no breeze outside - no point.  We are trying one of them again this winter because the facility is now heated by electricity which is a far drier heat in the first place so all we have to hope for now  is dry weather and hopefully at least some outside air movement to let us have some ventilation to counteract participants breathing out!


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## eggyg (Oct 4, 2021)

Many years ago I worked in a travel agency and a couple came in to book a holiday. They sat with a young colleague of mine. She had a sniffle, he went mad saying he’d just recovered from cancer and his immune system was compromised. Now why was he sitting in a travel agents with dozens of folks booking  to go on a plane to a resort full of people? It certainly wasn’t my colleague’s fault, you can’t expect people with minor viruses to lock theirselves away incase they bump into someone who is immunosuppressed. BTW I come into that category as I’m spleenless,  my husband has a complex chronic heart condition but it’s our choice to go to restaurants, shops and visit family and friends and I definitely wouldn’t blame a “normal” person for anything I caught. They aren’t doing it on purpose.


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## starfish212 (Nov 25, 2021)

I do try to go somewhere that I know uses a dishwasher machine.


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## Drummer (Nov 25, 2021)

After the lockdown I think everyone has a reduced immune response.
Although I am going out now, it is with a very restricted group of people - our own little bubbles, and I just do not go to places where there are strangers. 
It means no pubs, restaurants, cinema etc. - but I never went to them before so I'm not missing them.
I have caught colds, and felt pretty bad. The first Covid jab really hit me hard, but I'm still here, surviving. Having lost one of the band to Covid I think I just have to be philosophical about these strange times.
Because viruses can be infectious before symptoms show up, and some people are far more affected than others they can be passed around so very easily.
Back in the early 1970s I carried a named flu back from London to the office where I worked, after a training week. I knew what it was but was told to come into work or else. It wasn't long before I was the only person on the floor. Some people collapsed at their desks. Some never came back to work. I was young and fit, there were many people far older but it was the policy that if you could stand up, you came to work.


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## travellor (Nov 25, 2021)

I think I caught a cold every year before lockdown. 
Either at the office, from customers in their houses, or from my kids at school.
It was simply something that happened every winter.
I have a vague one now.

I know lockdown has reduced my immune system, and now we are going out to concerts, dinners, pubs, theatre and back on holidays, I am definitely catching a lot more niggly little things than I did before. But it'll build my immune system back up.


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## rustee2011 (Nov 26, 2021)

I can understand your dilemma. COVID had made us all a little more anxious than before. More so, as these variants keep popping up. It's a balancing act. I know that unless a person has the flu, they are normally encouraged to go out or go to work. Tough it out as they would say. It's a tricky one.


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## AnnSebastian (Feb 1, 2022)

Felinia said:


> Being diabetic and with other health issues I know I have to be extra careful.  So my mask is on all the time I am out of the house, not only in enclosed spaces like shops, but in the street.  The only time it is off is in the swimming pool or when I eat and drink.  Until recently that too was outside.  My friend had major heart surgery 2 years ago, and was recently in hospital for tests and checks.  After she had been home for 2 weeks she was cleared to go out and about.  So we decided to go for a meal at her favourite restaurant, tucked away in a corner.
> 
> Three days later we both came down with streaming colds so we know we had to have picked it up there.  Our COVID tests were negative, but as usual mine turned to bronchitis, and hers put a strain on her system.  So am I being unreasonable thinking that the person with the cold was being selfish and should not have been in the restaurant spreading germs?  Or should my friend and I avoid eating indoors (ie until next Spring!!).  We both want to return to as normal a life as possible.


Nope. You’re not being at all unreasonable.


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## AnnSebastian (Feb 8, 2022)

Felinia said:


> Guess I'll just keep on doing what's right for me.



Couldn’t agree more!

‘Don’t let the b******s grind you down’


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## Felinia (Feb 8, 2022)

This is a catch up to my original post of 3 October.  Today I met up with the same friend for lunch - the first time since last October.  We are both triple jabbed now, and getting on with life.  I still wear my mask all the time indoors and out, but otherwise am back to doing everything I used to do.  My friend is fully recovered, and wears her mask in indoor settings but not outside.


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## starfish212 (Feb 8, 2022)

That’s great, I had a day shopping in Worcs .  The very next day the restrictions were lifted, a lot of people were still wearing face coverings, i did too.


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## Mrs Mimoo (Feb 8, 2022)

I got covid for Christmas. Somewhat ironically a healthcare professional gave it to me!  It was mild and much less severe than many colds I had last year. I'm triple vaxed so it was probably omicron. I work full time and commute in and out of London so it's just a risk I have to take.


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