# WW2 Photo's belonging to my dad



## Catwoman76 (Mar 5, 2012)

Hello 

My daughter is studying WW2 at school and her grandad, my dad, was a solider from 1941.  I have been asking him questions today and looking through old photographs  well, I found a black and white photograph measuring about 3 1/2 inches by 2 1/2inches, very unasumming, until I looked at the back ( unfortuntely alot of the photos have no dates or names on the back) my dad has written, in red ink, The japanese signing Peace terms in Singapour September 1945.  When I read this it sent a shiver up my spin. Wow, I never knew he had this , the photo has been taken from above looking down onto 2 sides , milatary personnel sitting on the left, with a large white 'book' and other paperwork and about 12 milatary people standing up on the right. The front row, on the right, have their backs shown and are dressed in dark clothes, these could be the Japanese, I can see only one large book on the right side.  Is this a great find or something many, many soldiers took photo's of? My dad's memory is not great, but he was definately in Singapour, as I have found photo's confirming this.  I'm fascinated by it and I want to learn a lot more about it.


I spent so much time hunting through things, I didn't do as much as I normally do but I'll catch up later on during the week.  Best wishes Sheena


----------



## ukjohn (Mar 5, 2012)

Catwoman76 said:


> Hello
> 
> My daughter is studying WW2 at school and her grandad, my dad, was a solider from 1941.  I have been asking him questions today and looking through old photographs  well, I found a black and white photograph measuring about 3 1/2 inches by 2 1/2inches, very unasumming, until I looked at the back ( unfortuntely alot of the photos have no dates or names on the back) my dad has written, in red ink, The japanese signing Peace terms in Singapour September 1945.  When I read this it sent a shiver up my spin. Wow, I never knew he had this , the photo has been taken from above looking down onto 2 sides , milatary personnel sitting on the left, with a large white 'book' and other paperwork and about 12 milatary people standing up on the right. The front row, on the right, have their backs shown and are dressed in dark clothes, these could be the Japanese, I can see only one large book on the bright side.  Is this a great find or something many, many soldiers took photo's of? My dad's memory is not great, but he was definately in Singapour, as I have found photo's confirming this.  I'm fascinated by it and I want to learn a lot more about it.
> 
> ...




Thats very interesting Sheena, its something I could bury my head in for hours, of course only very young at the time, but I have memories of World War 11. I remember the air raid warning siren and the all clear one, I remember having to pull the blackout blinds down on the windows, watching the searchlights picking out the enemy bombers as they came in to bomb Swansea docks, and our spitfires come screaming in firing on them, and also taking cover in our air raid shelter built under the back garden.

John.


----------



## Ellie Jones (Mar 5, 2012)

Sheena

That's a real wow find, if I was you I would contact the War museum, they will be quite interested in the photo, and will be also be able to give you lots of information concerning the signing of the treaty.  All service records are kept, so they will also be able to advise you how to track down your dad's or even do it for you...

My husband is ex-RAF, and he's just said that the main Japanese surrender was taken by the RAF, but can't remember what squadron it was..  Was your dad in the RAF?

So you could also contact the RAF association as well.


----------



## cherrypie (Mar 5, 2012)

Hi Sheena,
Like John, I remember some of the war.  There was a lot of bombing that went on where I lived at the time but kids don't see things like grown ups do.  It was just something that was happening.  The air raid shelter was in the back garden and we also had an iron topped table indoors that we dived under for protection. 

I have done a family tree and my maternal grandfather  died on active service during WW1.  I never knew him but managed to find his grave in Belgium and we all visited it as a family.  He died aged 31, leaving a wife and  three children behind.  The youngest was a few months old.

If you delve into your family tree you may find during the research that you wii come up with more clues as to the photograph.  Knowing his regiment will help as they all have websites and records.


----------



## Copepod (Mar 5, 2012)

Even though your Dad's memory is poor, Sheena, I bet he can remember his regiment and batallion / corps / unit, his rank, and quite likely, his service number. You should note these down when he tells you, to keep all aspects of his life story together. 

I'm not sure which units were present in Singapore when the Japanese surrendered after the USA dropped 2 atom bombs on Japan. One place to seek further information is ARRSE (ARmy Rumour ServicE) eg http://www.arrse.co.uk/old-bold-127 - you will get far more help if you can give details about your Dad's regiment / corps / unit etc. Or ask the regimental / corps museum / archive - even if his regt / corps has been amalgamated, it will still be represented by a current museum / archive. 

In answer to your question about how many people took photos?  I reckon everyone who had a camera and film and a view of the scene would have wanted to record the event. Those without their own camera could have got copies later from mates' negatives. More of a performance than posting digital photos on Facebook! But photographers made each shot count - more so than today.


----------



## trophywench (Mar 5, 2012)

It may have been Army issue? ie here's a souvenir lads, with His Majesty's compliments?

Worth asking, anyway.


----------



## Catwoman76 (Mar 5, 2012)

Ellie Jones said:


> Sheena
> 
> That's a real wow find, if I was you I would contact the War museum, they will be quite interested in the photo, and will be also be able to give you lots of information concerning the signing of the treaty.  All service records are kept, so they will also be able to advise you how to track down your dad's or even do it for you...
> 
> ...



Hi, No my dad wasn't in the RAF.  He was a Paratrooper and a Sergeant in the Army and I know he went to Burma and Singapour.  He has shrapnel embedded in his left arm,( his injury was too near the muscle for the doctors to operate on, he could of lost the use of his arm) and he told me, a few years ago, how the sword that he had, was taken off the enemy and he used it in self defence, sadly, the sword has been taken by one of my brothers a few years ago and his medals also were 'taken' by another family member ( I didn't know any of this at the time)  The War museum sounds a good option, I have been doing a lot of googling on the photo, as I find it so exciting. Maybe it is a one off, maybe not, but it's in our familly and I AM keeping a tight grip on it.  Thanks for all the replies, memories of the conflict, whether on the battle fields or being scared as a youngster and growing up with the awful reality of a war, still affects so many people.  I will keep on with my search, who knows what else I might find and it's giving me something enjoyable and postive to do.  Thanks guys   Sheena


----------



## Copepod (Mar 5, 2012)

In that case, try here http://www.army.mod.uk/infantry/regiments/noindex/24290.aspx and http://www.armymuseums.org.uk/museu...he-Parachute-Regiment-and-Airborne-Forces.htm (it's inside IWM Duxford, near Cambridge)

As Parachute Regt was formed in 1942, it's quite possible that your Dad served in other unit(s), which became paratroopers / airborne forces, prior to 1942.

Or http://www.arrse.co.uk/military-history-militaria-52


----------



## trophywench (Mar 5, 2012)

We live just a few miles from Coventry.  Pete's Dad was in reserved occupation, but did his Civic Duty firewatching on Courtauld's roof.  Not very safe at all in fact ... and then when every other bugger came came home - he had to go away and do his National Service ..... 

My own Dad was RAPC and he was in Mehrut in India - pretty safe posting really, which he deliberately volunteered for instead of waiting to be called up so that they might be a bit more sensible with where they sent him - but then he was blind in one eye and he had the physical capabilities of a stick insect.

I could count up to three in Urdu as soon as I could speak - Eck, Doh, Char phonetically, can't remember after that!  And I 'always' knew that there were 16 annas in a rupee.  Talk about a mine of utterly useless information!


----------



## Catwoman76 (Mar 5, 2012)

trophywench said:


> We live just a few miles from Coventry.  Pete's Dad was in reserved occupation, but did his Civic Duty firewatching on Courtauld's roof.  Not very safe at all in fact ... and then when every other bugger came came home - he had to go away and do his National Service .....
> 
> My own Dad was RAPC and he was in Mehrut in India - pretty safe posting really, which he deliberately volunteered for instead of waiting to be called up so that they might be a bit more sensible with where they sent him - but then he was blind in one eye and he had the physical capabilities of a stick insect.
> 
> I could count up to three in Urdu as soon as I could speak - Eck, Doh, Char phonetically, can't remember after that!  And I 'always' knew that there were 16 annas in a rupee.  Talk about a mine of utterly useless information!



Aaaahhh, but what enjoyable reading it is  Thanks   Sheena


----------



## Ellie Jones (Mar 5, 2012)

Sheena can't you borrow dad's photo, scan it and give us a look?

Contact the Paratrooper association as well.

It doesn't sound like an official photograph, and it wasn't common practice for those soldiers that had access to an camera (very few about) to real off reprints from the negatives..  So it likely that if your dad had his own camera he was the one who took the photograph.

My dad served throughout the war, joining in Sept '39 and being demobbed in '46, he started out as a corporal in the Somerset light infantry, then becoming a MP Sargent succumbed to an Canadian infantry unit, and went in with them on D-3, and 70 years on during the D-day landing re-enactment dad had decided not to come into Sunday dinner, he wanted to be with his own memories, he phoned me up asking if I was watching, as the beach they were showing was the Jauno beach and he directed me to the very point he was dropped off next to a water breaker..  

He has told us a lot about his time in the war, when we were younger it was more based around the lighter side, with sleeping in ditches, his experience on  with the headless horseman on Salisbury Plain one foggy night on Guard duty, his dealings with SS officers that he had to bring back from Belgium and France near the end of the war to a POW in England.   In his later years he told us more of the horrors of the war...   

My dad wasn't called up, but willingly joined in '39 and almost didn't get in, as he was blind in one eye, so the MO doing his medical went to issue him with a 'Medical Exemption' but dad said, '' You close one eye to take aim with a rifle, I'll just make sure I close my blind eye''.

Like you I don't know where all his medal's, demob paperwork etc, the last time I saw these were at the wake after dad's funeral..

His father was Australian so in the WW1, he served with the Anzac and involved in Gallipoli...   But sadly I didn't know my Granddad, as my dad had me late in life, he was 47 when I was born..


----------



## Catwoman76 (Mar 5, 2012)

Ellie Jones said:


> Sheena can't you borrow dad's photo, scan it and give us a look?
> 
> Contact the Paratrooper association as well.
> 
> ...



Hi what a fascinating story, I get engrossed in things like this.  I like the quoteMy dad wasn't called up, but willingly joined in '39 and almost didn't get in, as he was blind in one eye, so the MO doing his medical went to issue him with a 'Medical Exemption' but dad said, '' You close one eye to take aim with a rifle, I'll just make sure I close my blind eye''.

My dad volunteerd as soon as he could ( as he was only just 16 when the war started) and my mum was 13. He told his mother he had volunteered for the Parachute Regiment and she was annoyed by this because she said to him' so your going to get yourself kilt then' ( not killed, but kilt lol). Thankfully he wasn't.  I know what Regiment he was in and I have some of his Army paperwork at my house, because I don't want these to go missing, so then they can be passed on to Tia.

I have just emailed the IWM but I have just got a message from the postmaster saying it was not delivered so I will try another way.

As for the photo, I will try and see what I can do tonight, but I'm not very good at trying to get photo's on to the froum, as some people already know

Best wishes Sheena


----------



## cherrypie (Mar 5, 2012)

Hi Sheena,
Try this for the email address.
http://www.iwm.org.uk/connect/contact-us

If it is the same one as you tried, apologies.


----------



## Catwoman76 (Mar 5, 2012)

cherrypie said:


> Hi Sheena,
> Try this for the email address.
> http://www.iwm.org.uk/connect/contact-us
> 
> If it is the same one as you tried, apologies.



Yes it is the same one, but thanks anyway for the link.  I will try another way  Sheena x


----------



## margie (Mar 5, 2012)

Ellie Jones said:


> His father was Australian so in the WW1, he served with the Anzac and involved in Gallipoli...   But sadly I didn't know my Granddad, as my dad had me late in life, he was 47 when I was born..



Ellie - if you haven't seen anything of your Grandad's war record the National Archives of Australia have been digitising them. Try this link

http://www.naa.gov.au/collection/explore/defence/service-records/index.aspx

Sheena - let us know how you get on - I think this is a nice research project for you, it will give you something else to focus on away from all the problems you have been having.


----------



## Steff (Mar 5, 2012)

Funnily enought my son is doing the same and just attended an assembly friday about it was so lovely


----------



## PhilT (Mar 5, 2012)

Check out the link below for info on the surrender of Singapore.

http://www.viweb.freehosting.net/japsurr.htm


----------



## Catwoman76 (Mar 5, 2012)

PhilT said:


> Check out the link below for info on the surrender of Singapore.
> 
> http://www.viweb.freehosting.net/japsurr.htm



 Thank you so much Phil.  I have seen the row of photo's in the link and the second one, with the japanese signing the document, are the people in my dad's photo I am positive of this, exactly the same clothes etc, under the photograph it says September 12, 1945.  In my dad's photo it looks like it has been signed, the middle man has his left arm just touching the very large book, and the men on the right are leaving. It's unbelievable I am so engrossed by this, I want to find out even more, it's rivetting.

A big thank you Phil  I hope other people can have a look at this fascinating link.  Sheena


----------



## Catwoman76 (Mar 5, 2012)

Catwoman76 said:


> Thank you so much Phil.  I have seen the row of photo's in the link and the second one, with the japanese signing the document, are the people in my dad's photo I am positive of this, exactly the same clothes etc, under the photograph it says September 12, 1945.  In my dad's photo it looks like it has been signed, the middle man has his left arm just touching the very large book, and the men on the right are leaving. It's unbelievable I am so engrossed by this, I want to find out even more, it's rivetting.
> 
> A big thank you Phil  I hope other people can have a look at this fascinating link.  Sheena



ps I have now got the photo on my computer.  I was wondering if I could email it to someone who knows what thay are doing, who could then put it on the post?  Could anyone help with that please?  A big thank you.  Sheena


----------



## Northerner (Mar 5, 2012)

Catwoman76 said:


> ps I have now got the photo on my computer.  I was wondering if I could email it to someone who knows what thay are doing, who could then put it on the post?  Could anyone help with that please?  A big thank you.  Sheena



I'll happily do it for you Sheena - I'll pm my email


----------



## Northerner (Mar 5, 2012)

Here is the picture:









My dad was also a paratrooper, but joined up just after the war (he was 17 when the war ended and worked on the railways as a signalman during it)


----------



## Catwoman76 (Mar 5, 2012)

Northerner said:


> Here is the picture:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Oh it's so exciting to see it , a huge thank you Alan.  What do you all think of the photo, any thoughts? I haven't even ate my dinner yet because of being so engrossed in this tiny little photo   but going to try and eat my dinner now.  BFN  Sheena


----------



## Northerner (Mar 5, 2012)

Catwoman76 said:


> Oh it's so exciting to see it , a huge thank you Alan.  What do you all think of the photo, any thoughts? I haven't even ate my dinner yet because of being so engrossed in this tiny little photo   but going to try and eat my dinner now.  BFN  Sheena



Fascinating - a real fly-on-the-wall picture, and clearly not an 'official one' as not posed. He wasn't hanging from a tree by his parachute and took it through a window by any chance?


----------



## Catwoman76 (Mar 5, 2012)

Northerner said:


> Fascinating - a real fly-on-the-wall picture, and clearly not an 'official one' as not posed. He wasn't hanging from a tree by his parachute and took it through a window by any chance?



Now there's a thought lol, but he doesn't remember.  Whether this is a one off photo or there are still many out there, it doesn't matter to me.  It's in my safe keeping now and Tia was interested in the photo and also PhilT's link.  Sheena


----------



## PhilT (Mar 5, 2012)

My dad was in Burma during the last year of the war, I have some old photo's of him with other members of his company.


----------



## Catwoman76 (Mar 5, 2012)

PhilT said:


> My dad was in Burma during the last year of the war, I have some old photo's of him with other members of his company.



Wow my dad was in Burma too, I have his 'ciggarette tin' in safe keeping with his name engraved on it in 1945. I also have his dad's 'cigarette tin/sweet tin, my grandad, from WW1, with a image of Queen Mary on it.  Sheena


----------



## Ellie Jones (Mar 5, 2012)

That is really a wow picture of time..

On the left the man in front of the large book is likely to be the top ranking Japanese officer..  With other Japanese officers and/or government officials on his left, and looks like Allied forces to his right.

On the other table, the ones in the front row does look to be Japanese, the next row are a mixture of allied forces, the Aussie is easy to spot, the two officer's in white look like American navel officers, at the top end this looks like an English Army officer, at the bottom of right of the picture, it probably another British officer, Les is sure that the badge on his sleeve  is the Paratroopers wings, whether he's a officer from the Paratrooper regiment is difficult to say, as you don't have to be a Paratrooper to gain the wings, just pass the Paratrooper course.

It does look like someone rather important is coming into the room, as they all turned in one direction... Perhaps the High ranking office who is accepting the surrender.

The photo was taken from a gallery surrounding the hall, so likely not official photo and perhaps it was actually your dad who took it..  

I hope you find out more about it all, as it would be lovely to hear more

I'm always been proud of my dad, and when he sadly passed away in 2010 aged almost 92, I wrote on the card for the family flowers, 'you are a hero and will always be my hero'


----------



## Catwoman76 (Mar 5, 2012)

Ellie Jones said:


> That is really a wow picture of time..
> 
> On the left the man in front of the large book is likely to be the top ranking Japanese officer..  With other Japanese officers and/or government officials on his left, and looks like Allied forces to his right.
> 
> ...



Oh my goodness, could of it been Monty!!!!!?, I never thought of a VIP entering the room.  If you saw the photograph in real life, you wouldn't think anything of it, it sits snugly in the palm of my hand, it's small..........I just happened to turn it over and read the back. Apparantley the top ranking Japanese officer couldn't attend the signing because of illness, so another officer was sent in his place to sign the book.  I would dearly love to know who took the photo, it is so interesting Ellie. Brilliant   Sheena


----------



## HOBIE (Mar 5, 2012)

Hi Catwoman your dad wants a big PAT ON THE BACK !  Thank him from me for doing his bit !!!


----------



## trophywench (Mar 5, 2012)

Sounds much like a Kodak Brownie box-camera print to me! - my mum and dad's photos were that size from their box cameras when I was little! - my dad's was far better than mom's though - you could adjust the exposure on it!  LOL

There was a lot of Japanese baldness about, wasn't there!  LOL


----------



## NiVZ (Mar 7, 2012)

All very interesting CatWoman.

Hope you don't mind but being a computer geek, I straightened up the pic that was posted and ran it through a 'reverse image search' (searches for similar images) called TinEye and it searched over 2 billion images and found 0 near matches.  http://www.tineye.com/search/ed57e1844ad94594b0fa1ee5d1e005377b3ab564/

NiVZ


----------



## HelenM (Mar 7, 2012)

If you look at this photo here, I think you can work out what is happening.
http://www.fepow-community.org.uk/Japanese_Surrender_at_Singapore/


 The photo appears to have been taken after both parties have signed the instrument of surrender. On the right the Japanese are just leaving acompanied by an escort of representatives of the allied forces. You can see what appear to  be Naval officers, a Sikh, possibly a representative of the Indian army, an Australian and an Army guy. On the left sits Lord Mountbatten .

The senior Japanese officer (in the middle) was Seishirō Itagaki, the commander of Japanese forces in Southeast Asia. He was tried for war crimes and was hung in 1948.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seishirō_Itagaki


Click on the letter at the bottom of the page, it describes the ceremony in detail  (p4)


----------



## Robster65 (Mar 7, 2012)

Really fascinating thread Sheena. And so much information from everyone.

As Ellie suggested, it would be well worth emailing a copy of it to the Imperial War Museum in London. They would be able to tell you if it's of national importance or one of many copies at the time.

Either way, it's a wonderful to know that your dad was there at such an historical time.

Rob


----------



## NiVZ (Mar 7, 2012)

Great find HelenM, especially the middle pic in your link which looks like the same scene froma different angle, judging by the desks and the rug at the top.

Using the info in the letter I also found this short 30 sec video of the ceremony:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1uswkpoIB3E


And there is some (watery) footage of the ceremony here if you go to 39 seconds in

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qyNFHk3xE24

You can also find more images by googling Lord Louis Mountbatten japan surrender and then clicking googles 'Images' link.

NiVZ


----------



## Catwoman76 (Mar 7, 2012)

Robster65 said:


> Really fascinating thread Sheena. And so much information from everyone.
> 
> As Ellie suggested, it would be well worth emailing a copy of it to the Imperial War Museum in London. They would be able to tell you if it's of national importance or one of many copies at the time.
> 
> ...



This find has made me so focused and the wonderful replies about the photo has made me SO happy. Rob and Ellie, I did email the photo to the IWM but I had a reply from the 'postmaster' telling me it was unsuccessful.............so yesterday morning I wrote to the IWM in London and gave them the details of the photo, why I couldn't email the photo and also a some details of my dad's time in the in the war, and hopefully someone with email me with an address that will work!   I have also emailed the photo to an american gentleman who appears to be very knowledgeable about WW11, so hopefully I will hear from both parties soon.
  The more input that I have had from people,  it has seemed to add even more curiosity and interest in this wonderful little photo, which has made such an impact over 60 yrs ago and is still doing so today.  I am filled with pride and I also feel as though I have been given a new lease of life, because of recent events that have happened, and the more I find out, the more I want to investigate. I feel as though a huge amount of christmasses have come at once, so a BIG thank you to you all for your interest from a very happy and excited Sheenax 
I will promise to keep you updated with any news I get.


----------



## Northerner (Mar 7, 2012)

NiVZ said:


> Great find HelenM, especially the middle pic in your link which looks like the same scene froma different angle, judging by the desks and the rug at the top.
> 
> Using the info in the letter I also found this short 30 sec video of the ceremony:
> 
> ...



Excellent video finds NiVZ  What a story this is turning out to be Sheena!


----------



## am64 (Mar 7, 2012)

loving this thread sheena 

...when my son was doing his project he interviewed two old folks from the unit next door ..one had been a translator for the british as although german she spoke 16 languages ( Spy  ) and the other had been in the paras who had been in North Africa and italy and at Arnham ...
the info that they gave him was so good cos it was first hand ...i do hope the IWM get back to you ...
amx


----------

