# A little too high



## Spikeybudge (Jul 14, 2020)

Hello, 
It's been a good few years since I was last on here so have enlisted again for a fresh start. Still not where I want or need to be but trying extra hard, which brings me to my question. 
Homemade veg stew.. 2 packets of mixed veg, water, added a few mushrooms and fresh french beans and 5 small potatoes chopped .I only have 3/4 pieces! Thickened with gravy granules.....ate 4 serving spoonsful at lunchtime , about 3pm tested as I felt horrible, knew I was high , I was 21 !!!  This isn't the first time this has happened , am I missing something about stew? I'm vegan so I love veggies and can't see why this is happening


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## Kaylz (Jul 14, 2020)

Well how were your levels before eating the stew?

I see your down as Type 1 assuming your on insulin then are your ratios correct? is there a problem with your pen? do you have a dodgy site? are you possibly coming down with something? there are so many factors to consider 
xx


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## Deleted member 27171 (Jul 14, 2020)

Hi @Spikeybudge welcome (back) to the forum.
My questions would be similar, had you tested beforehand? How far in advance of meal did you take your bolus dose and how long after did you test?
If levels weren’t high before hand and assuming you are either MDI or pump then that does seem like a big increase.


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## Spikeybudge (Jul 14, 2020)

Thanks , I was at 9 before but was eating 4 hours after breakfast, was up late (antihistamines) but needed to eat before going out...took the dose about 10 mins before and tested about 3 hrs later as I felt dreadful,  knew I was hyper by how I felt but the high level was a shock. It's the second time it's happened with home made stew...but I don't understand why, there's, nothing in it really to bump it up, just wondered if anyone else had ever had this issue as it's baffled me


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## SB2015 (Jul 15, 2020)

Hi @Spikeybudge and welcome (back)

Are you carb counting?  I am just wondering with all those veg in that (yummy sounding) stew, what was the total carb count.  It can be quite surprising how they add up.  I got caught out by a stuffed marrow last night.  Marrow is so much water but once I totted things up I went over my target for carbs per meal.

Another thought is that once I have let the carbs creep up in a meal I find that I do not absorb it all at the same rate.  I therefore find I need a bit extra if I go over 60g  of carbs at a meal.  It doesn’t happen often, and is usually associated with eating out so probably a bit awry on carb counting, and then the pudding menu .....

Good to have you back and look forward to hearing more from you


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## Inka (Jul 15, 2020)

Hi @Spikeybudge Although I don’t normally count ‘free’ veg, I find I do have to count it if it’s the main part of the meal. Also, some gravy granules can be quite carby.

21 is very high though, so I’m wondering if there’s an issue with your insulin or your injection site, or if there could be any other reason why you’d be so high eg illness, stress, etc.

Also, could it be an issue with your basal insulin? 

So what I’d do is have exactly the same meal again but adjust your insulin very cautiously each time you eat that meal until you find the dose that works for it.


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## Spikeybudge (Jul 16, 2020)

LucyDUK said:


> Hi @Spikeybudge welcome (back) to the forum.
> My questions would be similar, had you tested beforehand? How far in advance of meal did you take your bolus dose and how long after did you test?
> If levels weren’t high before hand and assuming you are either MDI or pump then that does seem like a big increase.


Hi, thank you for the welcome , yes, I had tested and was in normal range, took my bolus about 10 mins before and tested 3 hours later. I think my mistake is in thinking no carbs in  most veg  will I never learn....still think it was overly high, I'm not the perfect diabetic but that's not a level I get to these days. It also made me really tetchy so have had a couple of days to simmer and calm down. This really is the most annoying affliction.  Yesterday I fitted my new Libre and so far am loving it..I can test often and see exactly what is happening  and I can see it being a great help as on seeing my glucose rising rapidly I can react more quickly. I still need to sort the carb content of my stews and find that difficult to assess ...feeling thick here but I guestimated 40g for 4 serving spoons? I know guessing isn't the best but how else do I work it out, do I need to write down amount of each veg and then volume of water?


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## Spikeybudge (Jul 16, 2020)

Kaylz said:


> Well how were your levels before eating the stew?
> 
> I see your down as Type 1 assuming your on insulin then are your ratios correct? is there a problem with your pen? do you have a dodgy site? are you possibly coming down with something? there are so many factors to consider
> xx


Thanks Kaylz, yes I'm type 1, my pen is fine, I did wonder about coming down with something as I have had that happen with levels rising first, It really is a process of elimination I know but one thing I had done was change sites, I was using thighs and moved to sides of belly, haven't injected there in a long time so should have been ok but it was 2 high readings after changing. I've changed back and levels are much better so I think that's something I will discuss with my clinic and poss ask them to check my sites to make sure I'm not missing anything .


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## Spikeybudge (Jul 16, 2020)

Inka said:


> Hi @Spikeybudge Although I don’t normally count ‘free’ veg, I find I do have to count it if it’s the main part of the meal. Also, some gravy granules can be quite carby.
> 
> 21 is very high though, so I’m wondering if there’s an issue with your insulin or your injection site, or if there could be any other reason why you’d be so high eg illness, stress, etc.
> 
> ...


Hi, thank you for your reply  and yes , I definitely think it's going to be an ongoing process with it, I got really het up over it which wont have helped but I'd had good numbers for a while and it really upset me, I did not handle it well ! Basal is good , I was changed to Tresiba from Lantus and have found it suits me much better. Like you, I wondered about the granules but they were really low, it was a different brand to my usual though, only just remembered that! And it didn't taste as good or thicken as well so won't use it again,  I will definitely be checking to make again with my old brand and see if the result is the same. 
Give diabetes an inch and it takes a yard


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## Kaylz (Jul 16, 2020)

it's easy to check for lumps yourself, there's not much more they do than you can do yourself

As for getting near precise carb values I still weigh my carb foods out to make sure its as close to right as it can be
xx


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## Inka (Jul 16, 2020)

It sounds like it might be where you injected. I’ve found you don’t need actual lumps to get poor absorption. It can just be a slight ‘thick’ feel, hardly discernible really. I have areas where my insulin doesn’t seem to absorb well, so I just avoid them.

From what you’ve said, it doesn’t seem like a carb counting failure was the main cause, but to answer your question, weigh or check the packet label, add up the total carbs, then work out how much you’re going to have of the meal eg 1/4, then divide the total carbs by 4 or whatever.

I totally understand why you got het up. It’s a b***** annoying condition. Just move on and don’t dwell on it. You’ll never be perfect - and neither will any of us.


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## Matchless (Jul 16, 2020)

Thats a big spike i have never been over 300 or 16 very rarely ,I think its all those  spuds did you weigh them and count the carbs ,i weigh all my carbs for every meal toast as well for breakfast allso 9 was a bit high befor a meal .


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## trophywench (Jul 16, 2020)

What were the actual veg in the pack of mixed?  Root veg esp parsnips are higher carb, so is sweetcorn and legumes (ie peas and beans)  Leafy things are lower - but at the end of the day even lettuce contains carbs but as meat & fish eaters don't usually eat more than a few leaves at a time the total's negligible.  When there's nowt to slow the absorption of carbs in the veg down ie meat/fish/fat, then of course they'll hit the body to a greater extent and so have to be properly counted and jabbed for.

If the veg were frozen, the nutritional info is on the back of the packet.

Finally - we haven't the slightest idea how big your serving spoon is!


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## everydayupsanddowns (Jul 20, 2020)

A consultant I know from Twitter always used to say that his benchmark was 18. At that level in his (considerable) experience it was more likely to be dose failure than miscalculation - assuming of coirse that the 21 was double checked and wasn’t a rogue rest strip?

So could have been dodgy insulin / pen weirdness / forgot to air shot and dose not delivered properly / injected into scar tissue or lipo etc?


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## trophywench (Jul 20, 2020)

Well if I have one unexpected high then yeas I agree with that consultant - hence I check the pump memory to see what the dose was before I do anything else cos it's quick and easy.  I don't scrap that cannula and insert another elsewhere until it's been consistently too high for hours cos I've had that many over the years that have just settled down after a while for whatever reason.

(Only trouble is - if I simply forget what happened yesterday - which can and does happen!  My brain doesn't multi task these days if it ever did)


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## Piglet (Aug 3, 2020)

Hi Im new here 
I saw this post and have read the answers so far. Have you considered that you are not actually eating enough carbs so you body is compensating and creating the extra glucose required via your liver. This is a common problem that I have come across when talking to people.

We always need to remember that our bodies need carbs in order to function and not eating enough at meal times can cause this very issue. 
Good luck


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## Drummer (Aug 4, 2020)

Piglet said:


> Hi Im new here
> I saw this post and have read the answers so far. Have you considered that you are not actually eating enough carbs so you body is compensating and creating the extra glucose required via your liver. This is a common problem that I have come across when talking to people.
> 
> We always need to remember that our bodies need carbs in order to function and not eating enough at meal times can cause this very issue.
> Good luck


I'm afraid that is total nonsense. We do not need carbohydrate to do anything. We function on proteins and fats. We need to eat enough, that is, not be starving, so our metabolism can function correctly and it is just fine to eat some carbs for variety, micronutrients, colour and flavour, but from choice, not necessity.


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## SB2015 (Aug 4, 2020)

Piglet said:


> Hi Im new here
> I saw this post and have read the answers so far. Have you considered that you are not actually eating enough carbs so you body is compensating and creating the extra glucose required via your liver. This is a common problem that I have come across when talking to people.
> 
> We always need to remember that our bodies need carbs in order to function and not eating enough at meal times can cause this very issue.
> Good luck


Welcome @Piglet

An interesting idea and our bodies are complex.  I know that my body will dump a bit of glucose when needed, especially if I go very low.  With a high carb load I suspect that there may be other mechanical factors involved, or a miscalculation of carbs.  I know when I started to count carbs p, weighing what we were cooking I was surprised just how much I was eating.

It just shows how complex things are.  Our bodies in general do a pretty good job.  It is just that we now have to pay the role of a pancreas!


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## Piglet (Aug 4, 2020)

Drummer said:


> I'm afraid that is total nonsense. We do not need carbohydrate to do anything. We function on proteins and fats. We need to eat enough, that is, not be starving, so our metabolism can function correctly and it is just fine to eat some carbs for variety, micronutrients, colour and flavour, but from choice, not necessity.



I would not expect a type 2 to fully understand the role of Carbs in the body but going back to biology, we all need fuel to ensure our muscles and brain function. This fuel comes from the starchy food (carbs) we eat. 

Type 1's have to have an understanding of the relationship between carbs, insulin and the liver as they all work in conjunction in a normal body. The Diabetes UK web site has a short video (link below) which explains the relationship and what happens in the body when there is not enough fuel to keep our bodies going.


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## Drummer (Aug 4, 2020)

No - the energy comes from ketones, from fat. Carbs in the diet are not essential for anything. If glucose is required it can be released by the liver - but you really should not make such claims for carbs - I understood that they were bad for me many decades before I was diagnosed as type two, and being type two doesn't limit my understanding.


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## Piglet (Aug 4, 2020)

This condition affects everyone differently and what works for you does not work for everyone. Whilst you demonstrate an understanding you should not be quite so quick to judge and criticise others who do not believe as you do. 

Your comments were quite condescending to a newbie to the site and might well drive them away..


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## trophywench (Aug 4, 2020)

The body furthermore is entirely capable of making glucose out of both protein and fats, to fuel its cells. However as long as the person keeps shoving fast acting carb (the old fashioned description of starchy carb)  in their mouth - it doesn't bother cos it's so easy to gain more than enough a lot quicker from that instead.

If the person eats any veg or fruit - it all contains carb so each person needs to make informed choices in order to eat a properly nutritious diet - and portion size is ALWAYS the key.


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