# Diabetes Destroyed...Joseph Borden



## slipper (Nov 16, 2014)

On the Yahoo home page yesterday was a link to a "cure" entitled as above.
Being gullible as I was bored I clicked the link and was presented with a very slick presentation from a Ricky Everett regarding the work done by scientist Joseph Boredon which basically told me that Niacin and other essential items could cure diabets (Type 2).

I listened to the video but by 25 minutes had lost the will to live and never really found out what we could buy.  I researched a bit more and found the cost of whatever it is to be £32 .

Did anyone see the full video, or know about this work and what it is the guys are selling, just so intrigued now.


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## DanB92 (Nov 16, 2014)

slipper said:


> On the Yahoo home page yesterday was a link to a "cure" entitled as above.
> Being gullible as I was bored I clicked the link and was presented with a very slick presentation from a Ricky Everett regarding the work done by scientist Joseph Boredon which basically told me that Niacin and other essential items could cure diabetes (Type 2).
> 
> I listened to the video but by 25 minutes had lost the will to live and never really found out what we could buy.  I researched a bit more and found the cost of whatever it is to be £32 .
> ...



Their is no fast or easy way to get rid of diabetes.


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## Northerner (Nov 16, 2014)

I immediately discount anything being advertised as a 'cure' for diabetes. Whilst there is a lot of interesting and hopeful research going on, no-one has yet discovered a cure - if they actually did it would be earth-shattering news of such importance it would be in every newspaper, on every news bulletin, and would get a Nobel Prize before you could say 'scam'  

Whatever it costs, it can only provide (perhaps) some relief of symptoms, and then probably only for some people, not all.


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## slipper (Nov 16, 2014)

Yes agree, but was just interested in this one as it is plausible and very slick.


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## KookyCat (Nov 16, 2014)

Hi Slipper
My friend mentioned this to me recently, she's recently been diagnosed with type 2 and she came across it.  She knows I'm a bit of a science lover so asked me to dig.  It's an e-book that provides a diet protocol high in Niacin and other "mystery" nutrients which they say will cure type 1 and type 2.  There is a good deal of research going on into Niacin (vitamin B3) and insulin resistance, it's already known to help reduce cholesterol (the bad one) and increase high density (the good one I believe but I get confused with the lipid names ).  Their theory in the book appears to be that high levels of Niacin flush rogue fatty acid compounds from the pancreas, but Niacin in high quantity can be unpleasant and toxic (that bit is true and well documented and one of the unpleasant bits is high blood sugar).  They say you can get that quantity naturally from food but it's about how the food is combined to get the right enzymes to allow the niacin to enter the pancreas (that bit also has basis in truth, they are fairly sure that synthetic niacin supplements cause problems because they need a number of different enzymes to work in proportionate quantities).  Now since insulin resistance is thought to be one of the main causes of hyperglycaemia in people with type 2 it is theoretically possible that if Niacin did flush fatty acids it might "cure" the condition, but for type 1 it wouldn't unless the immune reaction was to the fatty acids, even then nobody knows if you could reverse the beta cell destruction.

They say the big pharmaceutical companies want to cover up their cure because it will cost them money.  Obviously I haven't seen the ebook but I suspect it's just a very healthy, very low carb diet with Niacin rich food. The niacin connection is interesting to read about though, but there's lots of that freely available on the web.  From what I can tell though the research has a long way to go before it would be of any use as a treatment.  If it's a scam is quite well researched I suppose.  Interestingly there are no genuine proponents of it on forums or other places just testimonials on sites selling the ebook which is generally a sign it isn't legit.  I'd recommend a bit of a read up on the niacin connection though it's really quite interesting


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## Northerner (Nov 16, 2014)

I think this is what bugs me about this sort of thing - there may be/usually are some elements that could improve things, but they then extrapolate this into a miracle cure. And who knows whether the 'cure' might actually do you more harm in other ways, given that it is usually not subjected to intensive testing?


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## KookyCat (Nov 16, 2014)

Northerner said:


> I think this is what bugs me about this sort of thing - there may be/usually are some elements that could improve things, but they then extrapolate this into a miracle cure. And who knows whether the 'cure' might actually do you more harm in other ways, given that it is usually not subjected to intensive testing?



That's what concerned me about this when my friend flagged it.  High levels of Niacin can cause lots of problems including maculopathy so people could really damage themselves if they don't realise that.  I find anything that capitalises on our desperation to be rid of a disease or condition pretty unpalatable.  As I said to my friend, if I found a nutritional cure, as a person who has experienced how difficult it is and how desperate it feels I would be sharing it free of charge because I know how it feels.  Then when all 6 million of us were cured I'd enjoy my moment on the This Morning couch


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## trophywench (Nov 16, 2014)

Niacin used to be used to reduce chol before they invented the satanic statin.  But they had stopped commonly prescribing it donkeys years since - precisely because of the rotten side effects it can have!

Bearing in mind they hadn't used to particularly care what your chol was doing anyway, I presume it would only be if you had say yellow exudates in your eyes or something, that you'd be prescribed anything for it - in fact I don't think we used to have to have it tested, that has only been done since the late 1990s I believe?


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## KookyCat (Nov 17, 2014)

It can still be prescribed for cholesterol apparently, well a medication that is Niacin based, but only if the cholesterol level is so high that it presents a major risk to life.  The stuff out there about the current research with Niacin is genuinely interesting, and there's some suggestion that the fatty acid compounds do "blend" with the beta cells and could change the molecular shape of the cells thus provoking an autoimmune reaction.  It's interesting to me in particular because I spent 18 months before the diabetes struggling with a critical B12 deficiency that nobody can really explain and a general B vitamin deficiency that was also resistant despite a very healthy diet.  I just worry that not everyone is aware that vitamins can be very dangerous and toxic in the wrong quantities.


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## trophywench (Nov 17, 2014)

LOL just reading one of Northie's 'In the news' things about the jabs given to get rid of the placenta, apparently increasing difficulty in breastfeeding.

I then looked up part of the name - Ergot, it seemed familiar.

Ooh yes, it was what they gave you to abort, in the mists of time.  So if you wanted to abort, you wouldn't want your milk coming in after, would you - cos that would be a sure sign of your having been pregnant, wouldn't it, even then!  So another No excrement, Endeavour moment.

But apparently it comes from a fungus.  And they're good to eat mostly, aren't they?  LOL


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## FergusC (Nov 18, 2014)

trophywench said:


> LOL just reading one of Northie's 'In the news' things about the jabs given to get rid of the placenta, apparently increasing difficulty in breastfeeding.
> 
> I then looked up part of the name - Ergot, it seemed familiar.
> 
> ...


re Ergot, that fungus (Claviceps purpurea ) was famed for growing on rye and causing mass poisonings.


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## Annette (Nov 19, 2014)

FergusC said:


> re Ergot, that fungus (Claviceps purpurea ) was famed for growing on rye and causing mass poisonings.


Wasn't that the stuff that caused a whole village in France to go mad?


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## KookyCat (Nov 19, 2014)

Annette Anderson said:


> Wasn't that the stuff that caused a whole village in France to go mad?



Yes I believe it was


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## loquat1 (Dec 5, 2014)

Getting back to topic (ahem), the only reason I might give this likely scam the time of day is that its underlying theory about the root cause of T2 DM (ie Free Fatty Acids) is not a million miles removed from the theory proposed by the Cancer Tutor website, which I believe to be generally reliable. 

As for the well-known tactic of playing the 'Big Pharma suppression' card, anybody who dismisses this out of hand could not have read Tanya Harter Pierce's book on Cancer.


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## Copepod (Dec 5, 2014)

Welcome to the forum, loquat1. Please introduce yourself in the Newbies thread, if you'd like.


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## loquat1 (Dec 5, 2014)

Thanks for the welcome Copepod. Yes, I'll introduce myself - eventually. But for now, please accept this post in lieu, as I think it's priority is a little higher:

OK, so I've dug a bit deeper still, & I hafta say, something very fishy goin' on here. The Acipimox/FFA's story checks out. I found this on the ADA website:

*Overnight lowering of free fatty acids with Acipimox improves insulin resistance and glucose tolerance in obese diabetic and nondiabetic subjects.*
A T Santomauro, G Boden, M E Silva, D M Rocha, R F Santos, M J Ursich, P G Strassmann and B L Wajchenberg
+ Author Affiliations

Endocrine Service, Hospital das Clinicas, São Paulo, Brazil.


Abstract

Obesity is commonly associated with elevated plasma free fatty acid (FFA) levels, as well as with insulin resistance and hyperinsulinemia, two important cardiovascular risk factors. What causes insulin resistance and hyperinsulinemia in obesity remains uncertain. Here, we have tested the hypothesis that FFAs are the link between obesity and insulin resistance/hyperinsulinemia and that, therefore, lowering of chronically elevated plasma FFA levels would improve insulin resistance/hyperinsulinemia and glucose tolerance in obese nondiabetic and diabetic subjects. Acipimox (250 mg), a long-acting antilipolytic drug, or placebo was given overnight (at 7:00 P.M., 1:00 A.M., 7:00 A.M.) to 9 lean control subjects, 13 obese nondiabetic subjects, 10 obese subjects with impaired glucose tolerance, and 11 patients with type 2 diabetes. Euglycemic-hyperinsulinemic clamps and oral glucose tolerance tests (75 g) were performed on separate mornings after overnight Acipimox or placebo treatment. In the three obese study groups, Acipimox lowered fasting levels of plasma FFAs (by 60-70%) and plasma insulin (by approximately 50%). Insulin-stimulated glucose uptake during euglycemic-hyperinsulinemic clamping was more than twofold higher after Acipimox than after placebo. Areas under the glucose and insulin curves during oral glucose tolerance testing were both approximately 30% lower after Acipimox administration than after placebo. We conclude that lowering of elevated plasma FFA levels can reduce insulin resistance/hyperinsulinemia and improve oral glucose tolerance in lean and obese nondiabetic subjects and in obese patients with type 2 diabetes.

COMMENTS: 

1. So, the first thing to note is that this is a Brazilian study, not US, and the authors (as far as I can tell) are all Brazilian nationals. Not that that necessarily negates the validity of the study, or that I have anything against Brazilians. After all, they used to be able to play football.

2. Joseph Borden does not appear in the list of authors, but G Boden does. Further digging reveals the full name to be Guenther Boden, not Joseph Borden. This is too close to be mere coincidence, so I smell a rat. 

CONCLUSION

Ricky Everett (or whatever is his real name) is most likely a snake-oil merchant who has stumbled on something that has genuine merit. I'd hate to throw out the baby with the bathwater, but consider yourselves forewarned. Does that mean that the basic premise of the protocol is bogus? Not necessarily. It's entirely possible that a niacin-rich diet, accompanied by co vits, minerals & enzymes that aid its absorption, is exactly what the doctor ordered for lowering insulin resistance.

Well, I  think I've fulfilled my civic duty, etc., but if any other boarders have anything to add, please feel free.


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## Andy HB (Dec 5, 2014)

Or just eat properly and exercise regularly (if you are able).

Personally, I find my sentence much easier to follow than the previous post.

Andy (like to keep things simple because I am) HB


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## loquat1 (Dec 5, 2014)

@Andy - I don't view those as mutually exclusive. A good diet & reg. exercise are taken as read, or at least should be. Doesn't hurt to supercharge that diet with the latest research though.


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## HelenM (Dec 6, 2014)

Just to point out that Guenther Boden is a well known researcher who is very much associated with the association of free fatty acids and insulin resistance 
He has a very long list of publications going back over 40 years.
http://media.aace.com/press-release...ed-outstanding-clinical-endocrinologist-award
 I doubt very much that he has anything to do with J Bordern


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## PhilT (Dec 8, 2014)

Sounds like another case of someone trying to sell 'Snake Oil' to me.


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## Andy HB (Dec 9, 2014)

PhilT said:


> Sounds like another case of someone trying to sell 'Snake Oil' to me.



I recommend Ben Goldacre's book 'Bad Science' for everyone who wants to have a little understanding as to how these snake oil salesmen operate.

Such people love to wrap their 'creative ideas' (euphemism alert!) inside scientific gobble-de-gook (same principle as those awful shampoo and face-cream adverts etc).

The book also covers the ways in which even valid science can be abused by poorly organised clinical trials.

Andy


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## Northerner (Dec 9, 2014)

Yes, I'd recommend Bad Science also - should be required reading for all journalists!  Also, 'Taking the Medicine' by Druin Burch, a history of treatments and just how dodgy a lot of them have been over the years


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## HelenM (Dec 9, 2014)

Ben Goldacre is also one of the people behind this site 

http://www.testingtreatments.org/tt-main-text/
 Lots of links and a free 'book'


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